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Examining Tokyo's Media Immersion Pods

the terminal of geoff goodfellow writes "The New York Times has an article on the Bagus Gran Cyber Café in Tokyo, where customers rent so-called media immersion pods. From the article: 'At first glance the spread looks officelike, but be warned: these places are drug dens for Internet addicts outfitted with VHS and DVD players, satellite and regular television on a Toshiba set, PlayStation 2, Lineage II and a Compaq computer loaded with software, all the relevant downloads and hyperspeedy Internet. In the nearby library were thousands of comic books, magazines and novels.'"

32 of 123 comments (clear)

  1. But wait.. by Deal-a-Neil · · Score: 4, Funny

    I think that they're missing the mandatory catheter. I mean, who in hell wants to actually get up and take a whiz once you're immersed? Or maybe that's part of the "immersion" experience.

  2. Novel idea by cdogbert · · Score: 3, Interesting

    So why aren't these in the US yet?

    1. Re:Novel idea by Edmund+Blackadder · · Score: 3, Funny

      coz we still have cheap motels (thank god).

    2. Re:Novel idea by Jozer99 · · Score: 3, Funny

      People in the US don't like being enclosed in a 4ft by 3ft cubicle for hours or days. We also wouldn't feel particularly private in a 5 ft tall cubicle surrounded by strangers.

    3. Re:Novel idea by Golias · · Score: 3, Informative

      In the US, we have living rooms and dens where all our media needs are meet. Have you been in a typical Japanese house?

      This is why private karaoke rooms are such a hit there. If you want to get eight people together, doing so at somebody's house is out of the question.

      --

      Information wants to be anthropomorphized.

    4. Re:Novel idea by bhiestand · · Score: 2, Funny
      We also wouldn't feel particularly private in a 5 ft tall cubicle surrounded by strangers.

      In Japan, 5 feet is more than enough to keep the average person from being able to see over the wall :).

      Sorry, low blow, I know...
      --
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    5. Re:Novel idea by JohnnyBigodes · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's a bit more of a "short" blow, mind you ;)

  3. wtf "Media Immersion Pods" by UfoZ · · Score: 5, Informative

    What a fancy and pretentious name for a manga cafe.

    These are all over the place, nothing special, and a good cheap way to spend the night if you missed the last train or don't have a hotel. You get your own cubicle with internet access or a console, you can read manga or watch a movie or surf the net, whatever. Plus free refills for soft drinks.

    It's nice but I don't see what the big deal is.

    1. Re:wtf "Media Immersion Pods" by Mr.+Hankey · · Score: 2, Informative

      I went to one of these to check my email while finishing up visa paperwork for my wife. They're quite convenient and comfortable, and the rates are reasonable. US companies would probably be afraid that some people would just try to live there, given the exact same setup. I'm pretty sure a few of the people in the one I visited were spending enough time there to change their address.

      --
      GPL: Free as in will
  4. They are. by Deal-a-Neil · · Score: 4, Funny

    Look at them. They're already here. They're called "cubicles".

    1. Re:They are. by pimpimpim · · Score: 2, Funny
      FTA: Mr. Isshow told me. "Your identity can be in flux. You go to these places not to present yourself, but to lose yourself. Lose your name, your position, your pride."

      Sounds like a cubicle, all right...

      --
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  5. a.k.a. by The+Clockwork+Troll · · Score: 5, Funny

    Locally these are known as "" which translates literally to "birth control parlor".

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  6. Mssed-the-last-train immersion pods by sparkydevil · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Japanese people do not use these spaces because they are actively seeking out media, but because they are using the space as a refuge from long commutes and cramped, shared, homes. Japanese people often work very late and live over one hour from the city, making it almost impossible to visit each others homes. To have any privacy, couples have to meet outide the home, and places such as Bagus, karaoke boxes and love hotels are all geared to this market.

    1. Re:Mssed-the-last-train immersion pods by JanneM · · Score: 3, Informative

      Also, these internet and manga cafés are usually open around the clock, and have lately begun to offer amenities like showers, so quite a few people use them as a cheap place to crash if they've been partying and missed the last train home.

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    2. Re:Mssed-the-last-train immersion pods by JanneM · · Score: 3, Informative

      Hotels renting rooms over night or by the hour, often with some kind of theme setting. It's not for prostitution, as many westerners assume at first, but a popular way for people to get together, especially since the expensive rents mean you often live at home until you marry.

      My favourite around here in Osaka is "Chapel Christmas", which, as you may guess, is Christmas-themed, complete with a huge Santa and grinning happy elves all over the facade. I have a few pictures here:

      Chapel Christmas

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      Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
    3. Re:Mssed-the-last-train immersion pods by JanneM · · Score: 5, Informative

      A Japanese house (yes probably through necessity) is, in comparison, polite quiet and tidy. And the home made food infinitely more apatising. So the pods being a refuge idea is a US construct I think.

      I live in Japan, and it's not altogether "a US construct". Consider: you're 20-something, and you're of course living at home, since the rent on even a small apartment is absolutely ruinous for a single person. You do have a job, though, and since - if you're a very consentious child - you're sharing the living expenses with your parents, you have a quite comfortable level of disposeable income even with a pretty low entry-level position (and if your parents are indulgent, you aren't paying anything at all, making that income all the more significant). The same goes for your current SO.

      In fact, if you save for a few years, together you could in fact afford that apartment in a Tokyo suburb or somewhere in southern Osaka. But until your relationship becomes long-term and serious enough, there's of course no way you're goi9ng to risk something like that. So for the time being you're relegated to whatever resources you have. And seriously, with money burning in your pocket, are you going to spend an hour on the local train to go to your or your SO:s parent's house, endure socializing, knowing winks (not to mention the ever-present risk of baby pictures) to retire to a small bedroom all of a couple of meters away from the living room where the old folk are laughing at the latest lame Osaka burlesque on the TV?

      Or are you going to a dinner out on the town, followed by a short walk to a clean, fresh hotel in any kind of style you wish (with no shortage of "special" styles whenever you want to spice things up a bit (there famously is a Hello Kitty Dungeon in one hotel here in Osaka)), with no interruptions, thin walls, kid brothers or parents, and with attentive, affordable room service at the touch of a button?

      I absolutely, totally, unconditionally agree on the state of Japanese living - it really is neater, cleaner and more friendly than anywhere I've been. But for those times you want to be alone together, it's really not optimal.

      --
      Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
  7. Already in the US by illuminatedwax · · Score: 4, Funny

    I call it "my bedroom."

    --
    Did you ever notice that *nix doesn't even cover Linux?
  8. Golden ball of thread... by electrosoccertux · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The more I immerse myself in this media centered world, the more I find myself recalling the fable of the boy who was given the golden ball of thread. Every time he pulled it, he skipped forward in time. While being warned of its power, he began to make regular use of it. He pulled the thread at the beginning of his classes, and when he had to start studying, or when he got put in time out, or whenever he was bored and wanted to get on with the fun things in life. Before he knew it he was on his death bed having skipped the boring and unpleasant parts of his life. The fairy who gave him the ball of yarn was gracious enough to let him live a second chance...and this time he never wished to skip any parts of his life.

    But we don't get a second chance.

    I'm finding the more I spend time NOT doing something digital, the more I enjoy my day. Every time I sit down to watch a movie, play a game, or read Slashdot, I look up and realize I've lost two hours. Where did it go? I never can seem to find those extra 90 minutes that I don't remember having spent.

    Now I ride my bike for fun, or sit on the couch with my pet and call my mother, or hang out with some friends. I'm finding I have all the time in the world now to enjoy myself, and it's all passing at the speed it should. Forget computers, forget movies, forget entertainment centers: I want to live my own life, not watch someone live theirs.

    I think it is better to leave the thread in the box. The fun times wouldn't be fun without the boring ones. Each will come when it comes, and no sooner. Might as well make the most what's inbetween.

  9. Re:you're bullshiting or completely clueless by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I find it hard to believe that Japan's modest lifestyle has led it to be the 4th largest consumer of energy in the world. They used to be the second largest consumer of oil in the world until China came on the scene, which is despite the fact that they import nearly all of their oil - where as the largest oil consumer, America, imports less than half.

    http://www.geohive.com/charts/charts.php?xml=en_co ns&xsl=en_const

    While you are incorrect, and they are, as you can see, huge energy consumers (which seems to be what you're attempting to disprove) that was not really the type of consumption I was referring to with my comments.

    When the US rebuilt Japan, the policy makers saw to it that Japan would be a capitalist utopia of sorts where life was predicated around work and consumption. As you may know, making lots of money and spending it on material goods makes you happy. At least, that's what we're led to believe. In Japan you have this disposable culture, as is in America, taken to illogical extremes. These "media immersion pods" are purportedly a way of getting away from the bustle of the city, of careers, and of societal expectations. That's how people get away? That's how they interact? Go on dates even, by totally isolating themselves from reality and consuming in solitude? Yes, that to me, is frightening. It's an incredibly passive existence (though most people live passively) A respite for me means playing my guitar, or piano. Going out and taking some photos. Writing. Learning something I didn't know yesterday.

    To me it seems like they don't want to move away from this exposure, but to become totally immersed in it in order to shed their identities. It's like popping pills. They move away from themselves. It's the same reason people shoot heroin. To each his own, I guess. I'm sorry that I find these trends disturbing.

    Oh, and please mind the personal attacks. I'm not damning the nation of Japan. I just think this exemplifies problems I've perceived in their culture.

  10. Re:chinese, japanese, it's all the same by Mr.+Hankey · · Score: 2, Informative

    The typical setup I saw gives you hiragana by default (one of two phonetic syllableries) and lets you convert them to the traditional (pre-simplified) Chinese characters adopted many years ago by the Japanese. There are a few keys which allow you to modify the input method to input "romaji" as well as the various Japanese writing systems.

    Actually, the Kanji are Chinese characters (called Hanzi, roughly "people's writing" in China IIRC) which were adopted in Japan long before Katakana and Hiragana were created. The kana systems borrowed heavily from radicals in Chinese characters for many of their shapes. Slightly more accurately, hiragana borrowed heavily from Chinese characters to make a simpler writing system primarily for poetry, and then katakana borrowed heavily from hiragana when Japanese noblemen didn't want to use a writing system developed by women. Go figure...

    --
    GPL: Free as in will
  11. Re:The article answered my question about... by Evil+Dave+Letterman · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Oh, they exist, and have done for at least a decade. They're known as "ime-kura" short for "image club" -- which is a very very very nice way of saying "role-playing brothel". Most of them, in an effort to skirt under the law, don't allow "SEX" but allow everything but... meaning, no outright penetration, but anything else goes. Even "labiel" sex. Most imekura stick to normal fettishes like nurses and airline stewardesses, but many take on anime and video game characters as well.

  12. Re:chinese, japanese, it's all the same by kote-men-do · · Score: 2, Informative

    As a Japanologist I can say you're completely wrong about some points.

    1) Hanzi simply means Han Characters, (referring to the Han Dynasty, not the Han Chinese)
    2) Hiragana was derived from cursively written man'yogana (Characters used for phonetic value, not meaning). This was used by women in the beginning, hence it was also known as Onnade ("woman's hand"). These weren't the only kana in use however, they were simply standardized by the goverment from the large pool of "hentaigana".
    3) Katakana are taken from graphemes (small building blocks) from characters. These are NOT cursive. These were originally developped by monks (early Heian) to hint at the pronunciation of characters.
    4) Japanese characters are not the same as the traditional Chinese characters. I also study Literary Chinese which uses traditional characters, and there are quite a few differences between characters. There are differences in stroke order, stroke count, radicals, etc... A simple example is the character for "study" (xue2, gaku, mana, bu). The Japanese use the simplified variant of it, not the traditional one.

  13. Re:Truth in advertising by ozmanjusri · · Score: 2, Funny
    ,i>Kant on the other hand requires absolute silence.

    Really? I thought he was a real pissant who was very rarely stable.

    --
    "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
  14. Re:Truth in advertising by Umbral+Blot · · Score: 3, Funny

    If by Kant and absolute silence you mean the sound of yourself sleeping... then yes, I see your point.
    Let me put it this way, if there is anything else going on you can be sure I would be paying attention to it rather than Kant. The man doesn't know how to end a sentance.

  15. That was rather rude of you, I think. by Naruki · · Score: 2, Informative

    Look, I couldn't afford the rental rates for the computer, so I just wanted a quick wank at the "Bosomy Babes of Bulgaria" web site you were hunched over. It wouldn't have killed you to lean back a bit, and you wouldn't have gotten anything in your eye.

    By the way, in Japan the private rooms also provide a box of tissues. In case you get a cold, I believe.

  16. Re:chinese, japanese, it's all the same by kote-men-do · · Score: 2, Interesting

    1) No, your instructor is wrong. It's not because he's Chinese he knows about Chinese history. I know more Japanese history than Japanese people themselves for example. Simply because I study the country at university in more detail than they did in high school. Han refers to the area Hanzhung. The people from Hanzhung simply refered to themselves as Han. Now when the characters came via Paekche to Japan I'm sure they were referred to as "Han characters" or "the writing of the Han", but "people's writing" is simply wrong. That would be "Min2zi4". I don't know if that term actually exists or not.

    2) There is no "uu" and "ee" in any transcription system. Just "u" and "e". A cursive writing style was not seen as feminine (non-cursive writing of characters is just very slow due to having to lift the brush time after time), it was specifically the hiragana, because these were used by "uneducated" women (they were uneducated because higher education was forbidden for them). However due to such works as the Genji Monogatari it gained popularity and replaced katakana and Chinese as writing in official documents. Also, the hiragana were NOT developped from JUST the radicals. When you're writing in cursive you don't just write the radical and omit the rest of the character...

    3) You're wrong. The two alphabets were developped independantly. The more educated folk simply used man'yogana instead of onnade. Katakana was developed by monks to aid in the reading of kanbun (Chinese texts annotated by Japanese). The similarities you discuss such as the kana for "u" is simply because they were derived from the SAME man'yougana, this is the case for "ka" and "u" but not for "e". The syllabaries were developped from the same source, but it is completely WRONG to say that one develloped from the other or vice versa. This is a FACT.

    4) The Japanese goverment held some kanji reforms themselves after WW2, where complex forms (kyuujitai) were simplified into variants (shinjitai) that were already used in handwriting.

  17. A sick person writes... by ofcourseyouare · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "The Japanese system of competition for education, career and social esteem, Dr. Kimura explained, forces young people to obsess over self-presentation, which costs them both fantasy and anonymity, the privileges of childhood... The Gran Cyber Cafés now serve this purpose, he said. "Nobody cares what you do, which enables you to be absorbed in whatever fantasy you want to indulge in through Net surfing, Web games or manga. Yet you can satisfy your timid desire to belong."

    In other words, the basic argument of this article is "the Japanese are sick and manga cafés like this are an interesting symptom of the disease - by comparison with the robust health of Western culture". What nonsense.

    Two key elements...
    * the seamless blending of sexual content and other forms of entertainment
    * the enthusiastic embrace of new forms of culture
    ...I consider to be a symptom of the health of Japanese culture as opposed to US/ UK culture where...
    * sexual content lives in a ghetto in which only those who are talentless or desperate will work, while ultraviolent content is fine
    * new forms of culture are treated with suspicion - even games, for God's sake, after all these years are still disdained.
    So my response is please stop treating this sort of manga café as a kind of boil that reflects some underlying disease, and let's open a chain of these in the west right now.

    But of course, I only think that because I'm sick...

  18. I have used one... by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    There are a lot of internet cafe's in Japan, big chains being Gera Gera and Popeye Media Cafe. I have tried out a few.

    They are actually really good. Keep in mind that a lot of people live in small houses in Japan, so go out a lot to eat and for entertainment because of limited space at home. Also, a lot of people live with their families until their late 20s, sometimes with grandparents too. So, privacy and "getting away from the family" are worth paying for.

    For under a fiver (800-900 yen) you can get a private cubicle for three hours. Browse the net, play some games, watch some TV or a DVD. They have libraries of magazines and manga to read too, and free drinks. You can order food too, or get a cubicle where you can lie down on a futon or sit with your girlfriend.

    Many even have showers, blankets and pillows available. You could pretty much live there if you wanted to. In fact, many offer discounts on up to 8 hour blocks, or overnight stays.

    I know it's hard to imagine the appeal for people in the west, but they are good. And not just frequented by men either, women use them too.

    The only issue I had was that they seem to invariably be quite hot, despite air conditioning. The Japanese seem to have a higher tolerance for heat than me - well, I was born in Yorkshire in March so...

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  19. Re:chinese, japanese, it's all the same by JanneM · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Hiragana and Katakana developed independently, as the other poster mentioned. The basic reason for both was the need in Japanese to record sound symbolisms (such as verb inflections) not needed in Chinsese; put shortly, Hanzi was a great fit for Chinese, but not all that great for Japanese (as evidenced by the difference in the way "original" Japanese words and chinese loanwords are written). Hiragana and Katakana were developed during different times of close contact, and were in one case a shorthand of Hanzi commonly used for phonetic spelling, and in the other, as common subcomponents with a well-known phonetic use (though these were different from radicals). In a few cases, and over a millennium of confusion, they resolved to nearly the same shape, but that is incidental.

    More to the point, there was not one single time that Hanzi crossed the sea and became Kanji. That has happened in multiple waves, so some characters are of younger origin than others - and this is also part of the explanation why some characters have so many readings; being common, they had changed over time and picked up new readings and meanings every time there was a new burst of cultural exchange between the countries. Also, a few characters have gone the other way, originating in Japan and being used in China as well.

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  20. Totally new technology by jdbartlett · · Score: 2, Funny

    Wow, VHS! How come Japan gets all the new technology first?

  21. Re:wtf "Media Immersion Pods" MORE... by davidsyes · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's MORE than a Manga Cafe. I've been to TWO of them. They also have Play Station, I think X box IIRC, and VCR/DVD combos. If you go in there with the right gear, you could **probably** bootleg the hell out of DVDs and other media. Not that I support/condone that.

    But, if those existed in the US, you'd have some form of illegal sex, human fluids, spilt drinks, and maybe even drug activity. But, aside from THAT, the MPAA? and RIAA and BSA would demand copying of license or IDs and installation of anti-piracy tools.

    The anti-porn legislation types would demand installation of video cameras to deter sex and abuse of children.

    Cities hard up for tax revenues would impose harsh and draconian "arcade" permit requirement upon each machine. I suppose Internet cafes already pay these. IN Stockton, California, any such business would have to pay these arcade fees via the police department.

    They places would lose money, and go out of business. All because of church groups, drug dealers, sex addicts, and the RIAA/others complaining about piracy and loss of revenues.

    But, yeh, most of all, here in the US, we don't have the "crowd effect" of 10 million to 20 million (I forget the exact number, but the pop and density are high...) people in the size of Tokyo pushing to get out of the house and stay out as long as possible. The main Shinjuku station probably moves more people in a week than NYC might in a month or two. The per-square foot of utilization by shops, eateries, jewelers, and more is mind-boggling. Not a space is wasted, and most of the shops and such all seem new, abuzz, and entrepreneurial, tho there are some larger chains or big-budget stores present. There is a certain "energy" in the air I felt in Tokyo, and I NEVER feel that here in the US except on occasions of HUGE parades, shows or concerts., and THAT is mostly all due to "herd mentality", not a daily occurrence.

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  22. Re:The article answered my question about... by davidsyes · · Score: 2, Interesting

    INDEED!

    I had to use the toilet in one (in Japan, in English, one asks for "the toilet", not the "bathroom") and there were all sorts of meticulous posters explaining not to shower in the toilet room. Instead, rent the shower...

    I think the shower was priced around Y300 or Y500 (roughly US$3.30 or US $5.50 at the time. For that, and a $10 movie, though, about every 2 hours, it could be pricey. So, I think some people just used the desk area, where some "overnight" spaces were dedicated. I don't think overnighters had a "cubicle" or "pod" in which to sleep. There were resting areas. In the open. At least in the one in Shibuya I went to.

    But, it could get pricey, tho one still could save Y300 to Y2000 per day on travel costs. Just buy some undies and socks and toss out the soiled/used stuff or recycle it. Even THAT can get pricey, too. But, time being very priceless probably is a strong motivator for some to say in town and not worry about missing the last train, only to be able to have 5 hours of sleep and home and turn around and sleep an hour on the train on the way back to work-- if waking is not a problem when having to transfer to another train.

    --
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