KDE Joins ODF Alliance

UseFree.org writes "The position of the OpenDocument Format (ODF) was strengthened today when the free & open source K Desktop Environment (KDE) announced that it has joined the ODF Alliance. KDE developer David Faure has been instrumental in developing the OpenDocument standard, which is already implemented in KOffice, KDE's office suite. Faure says: 'The fact that KOffice provides an independent implementation of the OpenDocument file format, and was able to take part in its specification, proves that OpenDocument is actually a standard, not just a rubber stamp on Sun's OpenOffice file format. What makes an open standard is not merely approval by a committee, but independent implementations.'"

Comments

Who would have thought !!

[Anonymous Coward]

Color me surprised, KDE is on board for the ODF?! Surely this is going to change Microsoft's stance on ODF...

hmm.

[popeguilty]

That's neat, but what does this really change?

Safari?

[jadavis]

I would really like to see ODF become more popular.

Could this mean that Safari, which is based on Konqueror, might be able to at least view ODF files?

I think ODF could take off if Macs could effectively use them. I don't see any disadvantage to Apple at all to include KOffice or OpenOffice so that Apple users have something to use even if they don't buy (or more likely, pirate) MS Office.

Also, Google/GMail should support this format! Why not? They allow viewing of MS Word documents as HTML, why not an .odt? That would help a lot.

Re:Safari?

[roger6106]

Also, Google/GMail should support this format! Why not? They allow viewing of MS Word documents as HTML, why not an .odt? That would help a lot.

If you want to suggest this to Google you can send in a suggestion.

Re:Safari?

[SydShamino]

Sadly, IBM's announcement that Lotus will include ODF read ability is the biggest boost I've seen. This means that, eventually (after my company upgrades), everyone here will be able to read ODF files. I had to give up on openoffice.org writer early last year because I was sending out garbled .docs.

(Sadly, because I'm not a Lotus fan. I usually cheer when we move tools out of Lotus.)

Re:Safari?

[kimvette]

OOo 1.x's Microsoft format handling sucked. Don't let your 1.x experience deter you from trying 2.0. The difference is night and day.

Re:Safari?

[Ignominious Cow Herd]

Safari is based on the HTML library used in Konqueror, not on Konq itself.
KOffice is separate from Konqueror. Konq. can view KOffice files by embedding (KParts?) objects.

So no, I don't think so.

That said, Apple could/should at least support ODF in the Preview app. if not in Pages.

Re:Safari?

[pavon]

No, the ODF code is in Koffice not Konquerer, so porting it to Safari wouldn't help. Besides, if they were going to port the code it would be better to put a viewer in Preview, and import/export in iPages, rather than Safari (I don't know if ODF would work well as the native file format as iPages is a cross between Word Processing and Desktop Publishing).

The good news is that KDE 4.0 will run natively on OS X, which means that all the KDE applications, like K Office, will run natively.

Re:Safari?

[twitter]

Could this mean that Safari, which is based on Konqueror, might be able to at least view ODF files?

You will probably have to install KWord. If you have that, Konqueror already opens kwd. When KWord does ODF, it will work in Konqueror.

KWord, by the way, is a nice word processor. One of the main authors worked on LyX and the influence shows. KWord already works by styles and is extremely flexible and light for such an easy to use GUI word processor. Like all gnu/linux word processors, KWord makes it easy to share with your friends because it exports to pdf out of the box. Good ODF support will be a great way to avoid firing up OO2, which is nice but heavy.

Re:Safari?

[bcmm]

KWord already does ODF!

koffice

[SolusSD]

well koffice was the first product to announce support for odf and the second to implement it, this is a given.

Food for thought

[Phil-14]

I wonder if this means gnome is going to join the Horde.

Re:Food for thought

[AuMatar]

No. We don't want them. The only way they can join the Horde is as a Tauren's lunch.

Re:Food for thought

[Anonymous Coward]

yes they will.

but they'll remove 95% of the configuration options and the widget sets around the format will be inconsistent throughout and you won't be able to right-click on your document. after all, these things could be confusing to the user.

Re:Food for thought

[Anonymous Coward]

This article was so useless your comment was the only one that actually made sanse :)

Obligitory NEDM Reference

[Anonymous Coward]

That's neat, but what does this really change?
 
Troll comment. Want chapstick?

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[popeguilty]

I'm not trolling. I just don't get, as a KDE user, how this affects me or what practical change this causes.

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[mrchaotica]

It doesn't affect you or cause any practical change in KDE. What it does is help strengthen ODF's credibility as a standard.

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[popeguilty]

Good point.

I adore your sig, btw.

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[N3Roaster]

But this does affect the author of the grandparent post. If ODF is a credible standard that is widely supported, a KOffice user can mail an ODF much like today people mail Word documents (and it will be just as annoying).

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[mrchaotica]

I adore your sig, btw.

Why, thank you! I have to say though, the idea behind it is not entirely mine (someone else on Slashdot said something similar that caused me to think of it, but I can't find the reference).

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[numbware]

a KOffice user can mail an ODF much like today people mail Word documents (and it will be just as annoying)

Yes, it will be annoying, but there's no stopping people from doing this. Wouldn't you rather get something you're sure you can open (ODF) as opposed to a Word file that isn't compatible with your version of Word?

Re:Obligitory NEDM Reference

[N3Roaster]

Wouldn't you rather get something you're sure you can open (ODF) as opposed to a Word file that isn't compatible with your version of Word?

Yes, I would. In that sense it is perhaps slightly less annoying.

iWork!

[mrchaotica]

No, iWork needs to support ODF as its native format. I don't see why they had to go and make their own format anyway....

Re:iWork!

[TheBig1]

I have already filed a bug / feature request to Apple for this. All those who think it would be a Good Thing (tm), please do the same.

Re:iWork!

[mrchaotica]

I think I have too, but did it so long that I don't remember how to file bug reports with them anymore. Could you post a link?

Re:iWork!

[TheBig1]

My post was a while ago too... let me see if I can find the link again... Here we go: http://www.apple.com/feedback/pages.html

Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[9mm Censor]

Open Office? If you noticed, none of the Intel Macs have Apple Works, could the successor be open?

Re:Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[mrchaotica]

No, the successor to Claris/AppleWorks is iWork, which has its own file format for no apparent reason. It's doubly silly because it's just like ODF except that it uses a different XML schema/doctype/whatever and is a folder ("bundle" in Mac terminology) instead of zip file.

Re:Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[ThePopeLayton]

I really don't think so because new macs ship with a trial version of MS Office (atleast the educationally priced mac i purchased did)

Re:Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[mrchaotica]

My iBook from a few years ago shipped with AppleWorks and a trial version of MS Office, so I don't think that matters.

FWIW, my Intel iMac shipped with a trial version of iWork only (I think -- it might have had an MS Office trial too, but if it did I deleted it immediately).

Re:Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[dn15]

I doubt they're about to start including OpenOffice when they have iWork (Pages and Keynote) which is the existing successor to AppleWorks.

Re:Apple Says goodbye to AppleWorks, Hello to...

[the100rabh]

But will u use it instead of all good ---all format supporting--- OpenOffice

the Horde?!

[KwKSilver]

Maybe, but I thought they were supporting the Hurd... ;)

KOffice is growing up

[mangu]

I tried using KOffice a couple of years ago and was pretty much underwhelmed.

Now, with version 1.5, it's pretty much as their site says, "the most comprehensive office suite in existence". From what I have seen, the only place where they are still lagging is in import/export filters. Otherwise, while they are still playing catch-up with OpenOffice, Abiword, and Gnumeric in some areas, they are evolving and improving much faster than the others. Let's just wait for version 2.0!

Re:KOffice is growing up

[GreatBunzinni]

It is true that KOffice is pretty much "the most comprehensive office suite in existence" and the direction it is going is really exciting. Yet, as it is right now KOffice is too buggy to even consider using it in a semi-reliable way. It has improved a lot but it still has a lot of annoying and painfully obvious bugs which get in the way of simple work like making a simple spreadsheet.

So yes, KOffice is going the right direction but it still has a whole lot to do to become a decent office package.

Re:KOffice is growing up

[Neo-Rio-101]

KOffice is good except that it still can't handle international input in the way that openOffice can. Seems as if Koffice doesn't support input from SCIM. I'm still limited to English text.

Why in Linux section?

[kosmosik]

KDE is just open source desktop shell - it is not tied to Linux in any way. Sure it is mostly used on Linux but such clasification (KDE = Linux) is just opposite to spirit of free software. KDE is free so you can run it on any ststem - be it Solaris, Linux, *BSD, OSX, Windows whatever.

If I like KDE and dont like Linux I could possibly run it on *BSD.

It is strange that /. editors seem to not uderstand *principle* rules of free software.

Re:Why in Linux section?

[Bent Mind]

KDE is free so you can run it on any ststem - be it Solaris, Linux, *BSD, OSX, Windows whatever.

I'm curious, has anyone ever run it on the Win32 platform, instead of Explorer?

Re:Why in Linux section?

[TheDreadSlashdotterD]

If they have I want to see it, and a link to TFM so I can read it. Until then, it's a GNU/Linux, Unix thing.

Re:Why in Linux section?

[LiquidFire_HK]

Quoting Wikipedia:

KDE (K Desktop Environment) is a free desktop environment and development platform built with Trolltech's Qt toolkit. It runs on most Unix and Unix-like systems, such as Linux, BSD, AIX, Unixware, OpenServer and Solaris. There are also ports to Mac OS X using its X11 layer and Microsoft Windows using Cygwin. Currently, a large portion of the primary KDE libraries and a few other applications can work natively on Microsoft Windows, thanks to the KDElibs/win32 Project. Ports of other KDE applications are being discussed.

I doubt you'll find it extremely hard to google for some screenshots or info.

Re:Why in Linux section?

[Bent Mind]

Interesting links. The Wikipedia link sent me to the KDElibs for win32 page. From that page:

We are not talking about KDE Desktop for MS Windows, since this operationg system already has a native desktop.

I also followed the Google link. There are lots of pictures of Windows clones and KDE running in a NX client window. It should be noted that the link is not work safe. However, there were not any screenshots showing KDE replacing Explorer. I was just curious, and I think I have my answer...

Re:Why in Linux section?

[M1FCJ]

I achieved this by running Cygwin's X server implementation with multi-windows option and KDE for Cygwin a couple of years ago. Unfortunately you still have the Explorer around but probably you can hack the registry and make this environment your default shell (since then, on my Windows box, I started using GeoShell, which is waaay superior than Windows' Explorer). On every other machine I use KDE on a Linux or BSD variant).

Re:Why in Linux section?

[M1FCJ]

Here is the link to KDE on Cygwin project. It is still not native but almost there.

Re:Why in Linux section?

[Anonymous Coward]

Current version of KDE don't run natively on Windows (need CygWin and an X server), but KDE 4 will run natively on Windows (and OS X). Several parts of the desktop won't be usable on Windows (like KWin), but the rest should work fine (like Konqueror, and KOffice 2.0).

Currently actually Kexi runs on Windows (Kexi is part of KOffice, it uses a partially ported KDELibs)

Other DE's should follow along.

[Ehwaz003]

Good thing to see that KDE has joined the alliance, but I sure hope the other major and minor desktop environments follow along. It would especially be very nice to see some lightweight DE's like Fluxbox, Xfce, Icewm, etc. to join. After all, isn't the chance to install linux with a graphical client on very old PC's one of those main advantages to consider installing linux? Might as well make sure then when you recycle those PC's, they follow the same standards. I think a good kernel version and standards like these make all the difference.

Re:Other DE's should follow along.

[wolftone]

How would it be helpful at all if lightweight environments such as Fluxbox or Icewm join an office-suite file format alliance? The only reason KDE is involved here is that they have an office suite -- KOffice -- integrated into their desktop environment. The more lightweight environments don't have integrated office suites, so I find it a little odd to think about them needing, much less wanting, to join an alliance devoted to office suites.

It would be something like a website devoted to a popular rock band with a prominent mention that it a part of a soccer referee web ring. Who cares?

Re:Other DE's should follow along.

[ardor]

Only Xfce is a DE. Fluxbox, Icewm... are window managers. You need to build stuff around them to create a DE (config GUIs, apps, file managers etc.)

Re:Other DE's should follow along.

[Ehwaz003]

Hmmm, your right. I still stand with the fact that the lightweight DE's and window managers which do support some form of office application should be applicable for ODF. I don't like KOffice however. I'll stick to OO, because I like it and I use it at my work.

TextEdit

[Anonymous Coward]

I, too, have filed a bug report last year requesting support of OpenDocument in TextEdit, which already supports reading and writing of several of MS' formats including Word XML. Unfortunately it does not seem possible to easily deep-link directly to specific Apple bug reports. I wonder how many others have requested OpenDocument support and had to open a new bug report instead of adding a 'me, too' to an exisiting one.

I also wonder how much Apple's fear of losing MS Office for OS X is causing a delay in OpenDocument support in various Macintosh packages.