Slashdot Mirror


VW Raises the Bar for Self-Driving Vehicles

Old Man Kensey writes "According to the UK Daily Mail, VW has produced a prototype Golf (code-named "53 plus 1" in a reference to Herbie the Love Bug) that successfully steers and accelerates itself at speeds up to 150 MPH on tracks designed on the spot without pre-programming. It sounds almost too good to be true given some of the problems CMU's prototype has had over the years, but perhaps VW has learned from and extended CMU's research (and within-an-inch GPS positioning probably helps too)."

8 of 177 comments (clear)

  1. Research by Umbral+Blot · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This is a good illustration of why research funded by a corperation is more likely to achieve results than that of academics. Academics are free to pursue whatever is most interesting as they work, and it is ok to get off on a tangent as long as some papers come out of it. However if you work for a company you need to get results, hence this car. Of course this model doesn't work quite as well for theoretical physics, but well enough for the computer science. I suspect we would have AI already if it could be turned directly into a product.

  2. And this is why I don't feel comfortable by rolfwind · · Score: 4, Interesting
    lettin a car let me drive. The article goes on to state an experience in 1991:

    Everything worked perfectly until Pomerleau got to a bridge. The Humvee swerved dangerously, and he was forced to grab the wheel. It took him weeks of analyzing the data to figure out what had gone wrong: When he was "teaching" the car to drive, he had been on roads with grass alongside them. The computer had determined that this was among the most important factors in staying on the road: Keep the grass at a certain distance and all will be well. When the grass suddenly disappeared, the computer panicked.


    And that bug is probably fixed by now, but the problem is, how do we determine we worked out all the bugs? We can't even do that with Linux/Windows/Anything. The closest we come to that in the OS world is a microkernel with only a few thousands lines of code and controlled input.

    But how do we ever determine a program that learns and is subject to varying, uncontrolled data inputs is bug free? You can't and I wouldn't want to see the first literal blue screen of death when it happens.

    I don't want to sound like a luddite, but the article mentions that planes have been flying autopilot (did they forget to mention landing/taking off is still done by the pilot) since the 1970s. But I believe we'll have flying cars before self-driving* cars because the problem is several hundreds of a magnitude easier in empty 3D space where all you have to do is stay high enough off the ground and avoid collisions via radar/whatnot.

    *The only way is I see anything coming close to a self-driving car is on highways where lanes get marked magnetically and driving problem gets reduce to the car having to stay X feet behind the car in front of it.
    1. Re:And this is why I don't feel comfortable by 91degrees · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Perhaps, but I'd quite like a car that I could drive somewhere, press a button and have it drive home, then I can call it and it comes to pick me up (and drives me home if I've been drinking).

  3. Nice, but not enough. by nbannerman · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Travelling at 150mph on a circuit is easy. Well, relatively anyways.

    Now if they managed to get this car travelling at 20mph down a city street during rush hour, we'd really have something useful on our hands.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm impressed. But a self-driving car on an empty track is a million miles away from the everyday driving conditions we encounter.

  4. Re:Wikipedia is not reliable by Yokaze · · Score: 3, Interesting
    You cannot use GPS to give you better measurements than the accuracy of the GPS constellation orbit determination, and the satellites' positions vary more or less randomly due to residual atmosphere, solar wind, and solar radiation pressure.

    I don't think, that the satellite positions vary randomly in the sense, that they have gaussian variance in a deliberatly short intervall of time. But their positions contain a systematic error, which can be determined via a fixed known position (actually more, but who cares) and thereby be corrected. This, in general, is the principle behind DGPS. The accuracy does not depend as much on the position of the satelites, but the discrepancy between the systematic error between the fixed known position and the unknown one.

    That said, I'm still sceptical concerning the quoted accuracy. Especially for a moving object, like a car.
    --
    "Between strong and weak, between rich and poor [...], it is freedom which oppresses and the law which sets free"
  5. Speeding tickets by davidc · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This is surely the perfect car. I can just imagine the scene:

    Car pulled over by the highway patrol for doing 150 in a 65 zone.
    Officer is puzzled by the fact that the only person in the car is asleep, in the back seat.
    "Did you know what speed you were doing, sir?"
    "Huh, um, wha? Oh - the car was driving, Officer".

    Car has to appear in court next Wednesday.

  6. It solves a lot of problems, actually by Old+Man+Kensey · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Actually, you're wrong. Computer systems working properly (which is the big sticking point) can drive the car in a more efficient manner that will minimize wear. You know how teenagers love to gun it coming out of a light? Hello engine wear. Or aggressive drivers trying to jump forward into a spot that closes up so they have to slam on the brakes -- they're wasting gas, wearing out their brakes, wearing out engine parts... to say nothing of the time they go to panic-stop and suddenly nothing happens because a brake line sprung a leak from overuse.

    The holy grail is cars that talk to each other to get around more efficiently yet. If the traffic up ahead narrows from four lanes to two because of construction, and car computers can talk to each other and say "Hey, you're two miles back but get ready for this", then orderly traffic flow can be maintained as the cars merge into the remaining lanes and decelerate. This in turn saves gas, etc.

    Hell, think how much money you'd save if you car just automatically avoided potholes if it could. Tires, struts, shocks, suspension, all those would last much longer. Look at the figures on how much money it costs drivers annually in a city like Baltimore that's infested with chuckholed roads.

    --
    -- Old Man Kensey
  7. Re:Comments on Slashdot aren't reliable either... by Physics+Dude · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Right, and do you know what is the order of magnitude of those naturally occurring forms of error? Let's see: ionospheric refraction, considering scintillation activity is in the order of 1.5 meters. Tropospheric refraction is about 2.2 meters. Code multipath is 1.5 meters. Adding these we have an RMS error of 3 meters, even ignoring other factors, like antenna gain and receiver noise temperature.

    And your point is? These types of errors you list (including satelite path deviations) are presisely what DGPS corrects for if the well known GPS is in relatively close proximity to the onboard GPS. In that case, these unknown variabilities will be reasonably well correlated so they will be removed when taking the differential. (ie. satelite orbit changes, ionospheric refraction etc., though unpredictable, will be nearly exaxtly the same for both GPSs so it gets subtracted out). In my work we generally get DGPS accuracies of less than half a meter which is well below your quoted error of 3 meters RMS.

    For use with autonomous vehicles, one can generally do a lot better when the DGPS is augmented with a ground based equivalent of GPS like Terralites (XPS) which can and do routinely give accurate positions in the 1cm range.