Is Simplified Spelling Worth Reform?

digitalhermit writes "I guess many folks are of very little brain, and big words bother them... There's a push for simpler spelling. Instead of 'weigh' it would be 'way.' 'Dictionary' would be 'dikshunery' and so forth. Dunno if it's a joke, but it seems in earnest. Mark Twain must be spinning around somewhere." Twain is often credited with the satirical call for spelling reform called "A Plan for the Improvement of English Spelling," though according to Wikipedia, Twain was "actually a supporter of reform," and the piece may have been written by M.J. Shields. Benjamin Franklin was another champion of spelling reform, and even came up with a phonetic alphabet to implement such reform.

Comments

Re:Never going to happen

[IAmTheDave]

You no what? It aint never gonna happen.

Agreed, especially considering it was originally proposed in 1789 by our most famous dictionary's namesake, so if he can't get it going, well then, I ask you, who really can?

no, British English makes sense

[Yahweh Doesn't Exist]

the prefix + stem + suffix model is far better than this phonetic bullshit.

e.g. centre, centripetal, centrifuge are all connected concepts and share the stem "centr".

the American spelling "center" has the stem "cent" which suggests center is something to do with 100; a center is a machine/person that makes cents?

you only make things more difficult for yourself in the long run if you wimp out of learning things properly in the beginning.

Re:Never going to happen

[Trifthen]

Part of the problem is context. In English, since there are so many words which are homonyms, information is actually transmitted by the spelling of the word. It's bad enough one word can have dozens of meanings, but then you have cases like: Weigh, way, and whey. If we compressed that to simply 'way', which way would you way the way? (In which manner would you determine the effect of gravity upon watery milk byproducts?) See the problem?

Simplified spelling destroys context and meaning in English. We would basically have to rewrite the language from scratch to avoid problems like the one outlined above. In not so simple terms: that will never happen.

Re:Simple solution

[conJunk]

absolutely. any problem cited with "students in america take longer to spell than in countries with phonetic languages" omits one teensy factor:

i don't have cite for this, but my guess is that those kids who take years to learn to spell didn't start learning it until the teacher showed them at school, probably around age six or seven. the development of the human brain is such that young kids can learn almost anything really easily, and if their parents had taken the time to start reading books to them from the beginning, and helping the kids sound out words when they show an interest, and those kids likely would not be taking years to learn.

i used to teach english as a second language to 3 and 4 year old japanese kids with extremely ambitious parents. those kids could pick up phonics and english spelling no problem. the natural OCD-like nature of kids make the details easy for them, as long as their having fun, and have a good healthy diet that's conducive to a reasonable attention span

Re:Simple solution

[Reziac]

Exactly. Parents no longer sit down and read to their preschool-age kids. My mom DID... and I could read at a 4th grade level by the time I was 5 years old -- AND I already had a sufficient grok of phonics (by intuition, not training) that I could work out ANY word, even one I'd never seen before. (The only ones that gave me trouble were irregulars like "Bartholomew" -- where the accents don't fall on the standard syllables.)

Between that, and when spelling/phonics began being taught (in my era, that was in the 2nd grade), it was very easy for me and for most students. Kids who couldn't read, and who couldn't puzzle out new words, were very rare.

But now? Spelling isn't taught until the 4th grade or even later. Phonics often isn't taught at all, another legacy of the "whole word recognition" debacle (if you watch severe dyslexics, you'll see that WWR is how they read -- so the object of WWR was apparently to make everyone read at the level of the lowest common denominator!) I remember when the first WWR experiments came along -- my 5th grade class was one of 'em, and even at that age we KNEW we were being shortchanged compared to the other kids.

As to "odd" spellings like weigh vs way, they DO convey meaning. Frex, a "weigh station" is not the same thing as a "way station".

Because it makes sense now is not a reason

[caffiend666]

Just because it makes sense now is not a reason. Things are made unintelligable with time. People attempt to draw distinctions between things and change them subtley. Time compounds the issue. A significant advantage must be shown before doing this. Even simple reality makes things change. China is reforming the written language out of necessity, because becoming literate in classic Chinese takes almost a decade. Latin is easier... Shaving a year or two off of this schedule means more time for real learning. Words are pronounced differently a year from now, in different places, even by people who attend different schools. I wouldn't want people with 'Harvard' accents dictating spelling, I live in Texas. I'm sure people at Harvard would equally hate the idea of someone from Texas like Bush dictating the dictionary.

For example, months in many languages are counted. First Month instead of January, second month instead of February, and so on. This used to be the case in English. But, the start of the year was changed to reflect the solar calendar instead of a lunar calendar, and the months no longer made sense. What was the seventh month of the year, was now the 9th month of the year and so on. The names September, October, November, and December each mean seventh month, eigth month, ninth month, and tenth month respectively. Even though they are in fact the 9th - 12th months.

Adding 'engineered' changes only add to the confusion long term. Not only do people have to deal with tense and style changes, but forcing more changes on top of it only makes problems worse. Words gain meaning with time. This will happen whether we try to temporarily fix it or not.

This is no better than the political correctness debates. A word which may be proper and make sense one year quickly gains meaning in both positive and negative connotations until many are unwilling to use a word. The end result of not accepting this additional meaning is that old written language quickly becomes unintelligible. Forcing change makes the issue worse. The Chinese had riots when they briefly tried switching to the latin alphabet in the 50s.

A big part of the reason the Chinese stopped switching to a phonetic alphabet is it would in many ways destroy their national identity. Mandarin is spoken very differently from Cantonese. But, they largely can understand each others writing. If they had switched to a completely phonetic system, there would be very little tying that nation together. Written Chinese is more like spoken Mandarin from a few hundred years ago. Not even regular Mandarin speakers would be able to read a phonetic version of what was spoken a few years ago.

English is an evolved language. Because of this, it is easy to start but hard to master. It will continue to evolve.