Slashdot Mirror
State and Federal Governents Clash on NSA Snooping
An anonymous reader writes "In what could set the stage for an indirect decision over the NSA domestic surveillance program, The Justice Department has threatened the state of Maine with a lawsuit should the state's Public Utilities Commission investigate complaints from Maine customers that Verizon, by cooperating with the NSA without their customers' consent, violated privacy laws. Maine's PUC is expected to make its decision today.
(More from the article below.) From the linked article: "Verizon may have broken the law, and the Department of Justice is overstepping its bounds in trying to intimidate the state PUC from investigating the potential violation," said Shenna Bellows, executive director of the Maine Civil Liberties Union. "And I do think it sets an extraordinarily dangerous precedent for the federal government to threaten to sue the state, (which is) merely doing its job."
The Maine complaint, filed in May by 22 Verizon customers, is one of several similar cases around the country. The cases were sparked by news reports alleging that phone companies have cooperated with government surveillance efforts by providing the domestic phone call records of millions of Americans.
In Vermont, where state officials are considering whether to open an investigation of Verizon and AT&T, the Justice Department has come down against the idea. The department has filed lawsuits to prevent the disclosure of information in New Jersey and Missouri."
(More from the article below.) From the linked article: "Verizon may have broken the law, and the Department of Justice is overstepping its bounds in trying to intimidate the state PUC from investigating the potential violation," said Shenna Bellows, executive director of the Maine Civil Liberties Union. "And I do think it sets an extraordinarily dangerous precedent for the federal government to threaten to sue the state, (which is) merely doing its job."
The Maine complaint, filed in May by 22 Verizon customers, is one of several similar cases around the country. The cases were sparked by news reports alleging that phone companies have cooperated with government surveillance efforts by providing the domestic phone call records of millions of Americans.
In Vermont, where state officials are considering whether to open an investigation of Verizon and AT&T, the Justice Department has come down against the idea. The department has filed lawsuits to prevent the disclosure of information in New Jersey and Missouri."
How dare the state of Maine prosecute the federal government engaging in illegal activities! Let's hope the U.S. DOJ gets a proper smack-down in the courts... otherwise we're all fscked!
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing.
Don't worry - States' rights is a major part of the Republican platform.
You know - along with smaller government and less federal spending.
Right?
Whenever I hear a Republican utter the phrase "tax and spend Democrat," I almost bust a gut laughing (and crying inside) thinking about the current deficit.
Amazing how 30 years ago, Nixon knows about some burglary and some audio tapes being stolen, and he is forced to resign. Then 10 years ago, Clinton gets a few BJs and has a 3 year investigation leading to an impeachment and a 3000 page report filed. And now, all these things are going on--most of which are orders of magnitude worse-- and they get hardly any news coverage, the president is under no real pressure about them, and the bulk of Americans couldn't care less.
All I can think now is that line from V for Vendetta: "There's something terribly wrong with this country."
If enough of them band together. I hope that's what they do. Not only propose new ones but to uphold and seek enforcement of the older ones, especially the first 10. The gutless cowards in the Congress are never going to do it, that's for sure. Good luck, Maine. Go for it.
The feds WILL lose.
Hopefully this will restir the notion of state's rights, because it's obvious when all of the power is condensed into one entity, the stage is set for massive abuse.
The founding fathers knew this. Society seems to have forgotten this. We need a clash of the titans like this to hopefully reawaken some interest in maintaining the sanctity of our rights and freedoms.
I'm glad this issue is not going to just "go away" as the Bush administration hopes. The process of continued lawsuit, hushing up, and repeat will have to unfurl as it will. It certainly is the responsibility of every level of government to enforce its laws. When there is a conflict, it will escalate to the Supreme Court. I hope they make a wise decision there -- this is the turning point, we can return to freedom and democracy, or we can head into totalitarianism.
Congrats to the State of Maine for being the first to grow some balls. And for the rest of you - Bite my shiny metal ass!
Why? The people in this country have something to say about the current state of things but have yet to act upon what the morals that govern them. They talk about how wrong the President is but yet they vote him into office again. They shout " I don't want my phone tapped," but they do it in the comfort of their home where they can't be arrested. They say "let us be moral and leaders of the free world," yet they think "a little bit of torture never hurt anyone as long as its in Cuba." And here we are - you and I paying our taxes and showing our teeth like its all okay.
We can sit here and piss and moan about this all day long but until smart people like most of the folks here at slashdot do something, it's all yapping and no substance. No one can ever say that anything got accomplished right the first time by a leader who leads from the back of the bus or that a bunch of grumbling average joes got something done. You might as well be telling 'You're Mama's So Fat Jokes' than wasting you're time talking to the TV as you sit on your fat ass eating Salsa Verde Dorritoes.
So go ahead and mod me down or call me a troll because I don't care. Someone needs to tell America the truth and stand up for whats right. I'm moving to Maine...
The question that I have is this: if the Public Utilities Comission asks Verizon point-blank: "did you do this?" and Verizon says "we won't tell you if we did or not," does that response constitute grounds for the Public Utilities Commission to revoke Verizon's charter in Maine?
That is to say, quite aside from the question of whether or not Verizon is guilty of wrongdoing in the matter of the wiretapping, it seems reasonable that a refusal to cooperate with the Public Utilities Commission investigation would itself be grounds for the commission to rescind Verizon's monopoly privilege in the state.
We may see a new civil war real soon
The first shots were fired at Waco and Ruby Ridge. The counterstrike came in Oklahoma city.
Yes, these were wingnuts (including the government forces), but the wingnuts always have furnished the canaries.
See John Brown. His body is a-mouldrin' in the grave, but his soul goes marching on.
Bear in mind that I'm no right wing wingnut myself. On "the test" I share a data point with the Dalai Lama. I'm not promoting the idea of civil war, but I got eyes and ears and I can see it comin'.
KFG
-- Alexander Hamilton (speech to the New York Ratifying Convention, 17 June 1788)
Reference: The Works of Alexander Hamilton, Henry Cabot Lodge, ed., vol. 2 (28)
No Inflation Taxation without Representation
I'm old enough to remember how, under Carter, interest rates were sky high (and at the time, while I don't remember it, the deficit was also fairly low).
When Reagan came in, he really got interest rates down, but he started borrowing money like crazy and the deficit went way, way, way up.
At the time, everyone except the people living off of interest were very happy with Reagan because of the drop of double-digit interest rates into the single digits.
But the deal is, because nobody felt the borrowing at the time, it seemed like he was fantastic when compared to Carter (and he actually was in some areas, but not this one!).
People are so short sighted that most can't see past tomorrow.
I guess we should eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow our children, their children, and our children's children are going to be freaking paying for it!
Myself, I usually vote Libertarian when I have the choice, because for some reason I, as well as a handful of other people, have the ability to see that both the Republicans and the Democrats are screwing us over.
Transporter_ii
Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality