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EU Patent Wars to Resume

replicant108 writes "Ciaran O'Riordan of the FSFE gives a concise analysis of why the EU Software Patent Wars will resume this winter. Apparently the pro-patent side have changed their strategy — this time they plan to bypass the legislative powers and target the judiciary instead. The goal is to transfer power from the national courts (which often rule against software patents) to a specially-created European Patent Court which will be controlled by the pro-software patent EPO!"

44 of 184 comments (clear)

  1. A hippocratic oath for coders? by crosbie · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Perhaps we should start a hippocratic oath for coders that entails immediate resignation from any employer who attempts to enforce their software patents?

    1. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by 91degrees · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Perhaps. Don't think it would be all that popular though.

      While I'm quite strongly against software patents, my opposition isn't quite as great as my opposition to being unemployed and ineligible for unemployment benefit.

    2. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by crosbie · · Score: 4, Interesting

      There's always employment in the free software industry.

      Software patents are manacles imposed on software engineers.

      Whilst it's nowhere near as severe, there is a similar principle at stake here to slavery. If you don't believe in slavery (removing the freedom from coders everywhere to reinvent wheels and utilise them) then you really shouldn't tolerate it, and that includes tolerating your employer doing it.

      One might just tolerate employers having software patents as deterrents with a tacit "Oh, but of course, we'd never actually use them!", but I'd rather find another employer, a more enlightened one, than share in the benefit from the removal of others' freedom.

      Make a stand, you wouldn't be alone.

    3. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by smchris · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Perhaps we should start a hippocratic oath for coders that entails immediate resignation from any employer who attempts to enforce their software patents?

      An anti-hypocritical oath for judges to serve their society instead of their corporations would probably be more effective.

    4. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by Bizzeh · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "i have no job, no house, no food, and my wife has left me. but at least i have good morals"

    5. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by CowboyBob500 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Make a stand, you wouldn't be alone.

      Exactly. Been there and done that myself after the company I was working for got taken over by a US company. The new US owners wanted to patent a whole bunch of stuff that had been developed in the UK. They wanted the developers to put their names to the patents. I refused. They told me if I didn't agree I'd be first to go in the upcoming layoffs due to the merger. I jumped before I was pushed.

      The company ended up going bankrupt in the end and the people who sold their souls ended up losing two months pay due to payroll not running and didn't get any redundancy payments from the administrators either. It's called karma I think...

      Bob

    6. Re:A hippocratic oath for coders? by crosbie · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I was actually quite careful to demonstrate a sense of proportion.

      We are talking about a legal mechanism that determines whether human software engineers are free, or not free, to develop software.

      There is no co-existence.

      Either these people are free, or they are not (they must ensure they have permission from patent holders).

      Which world do you prefer?

      A world in which some people may control what algorithms other people are or are not permitted to utilise in their software (even if they typically independently reinvent them), or a world in which people are free to develop software without any need to obtain anyone else's permission?

      As to dealing with this issue, I am indeed proposing how to do so.

  2. That's ingenious! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Wow. The lawyers working for software patents are really creative and persistent. They must have spent hundreds of thousands of euros on developing this new strategy, yet anyone could now replicate their legal strategy without compensation. Is this fair? Surely we need legal claim patents to protect the inventors of new legal methods, and to incentivize the creation of them! How can these lawyers work in good conscience on other fields of business when their own creative ideas have so little protection?

    1. Re:That's ingenious! by Shaper_pmp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Indeed!

      Clearly "legal strategy" patents are essential - after all, without legal strategy patents lawyers couldn't own their own discover-... idea-.. inventions.

      Then there would be no driving economic force behind legal innovation, and the entire legal industry would stagnate, retarding the progress of the Unites States/Europe and ensuring that legal development only took place in other countries...

      No, wait-

      --
      Everything in moderation, including moderation itself
    2. Re:That's ingenious! by Jerry · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Not really.

      The core of this "strategy" is as old as prostitution: Pay of politicians and judges, directly or indirectly. Giant Multi-National corporations have the money to corrupt those individuals, FOSS projects to not. Only a grassroots groundswell of massive protest can fight the money.

      That means exposing every person associated with the "judical system" in question to see what their connection is to Microsoft.

      --

      Running with Linux for over 20 years!

  3. My first EU software patent by a4r6 · · Score: 5, Funny

    "A method for the processing of data recieved in the form of input into information which may be disclosed through output" If they're anything like the USPO I stand a chance.

  4. And they still wonder? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    And they still wonder why the people keep voting NO to giving more power to the EU?

    Well, the few of us that are even allowed to vote, that is.

    1. Re:And they still wonder? by sepluv · · Score: 5, Informative
      The main point of the EU is to ensure that trade rules (e.g.: patent rules) don't differ between the member states so there can be an efficient common market. Not having lots of different complicated legal systems is probably a good thing (whatever the system is), and, whatsmore, most of the EU institutions (e.g.: the parliament; most member states) went against software patents in the end. The unaccountable EPO (who are more like a Quango full of civil servants than a democratic government or parliament) won't give up though.

      I'm not, in favour, generally, of extension of the the powers of EU instutions or the proposed EU constitution. However, surely if your state were to drop out of the EU, these trade deals would still happen but in an untransparent, unaccountable way with no parliament or constitution involved (and more likely to involve the receipt of nice pretty brown envelopes from everyone's favourite monopoly).

      --
      Joe Llywelyn Griffith Blakesley
      [This post is in the public domain (copyright-free) unless otherwise stated]
    2. Re:And they still wonder? by sepluv · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I disagree if you are, as you seem to be, implying any of the following:
      1. Member states' non-EU-directive-based laws relate strongly to the morals of their people.
      2. The morals of everyone in a single member state tend to agree, or there is more variation in morals between than within member states.
      3. Most people have any moral position on the esoteric stuff the EU deals with.
      --
      Joe Llywelyn Griffith Blakesley
      [This post is in the public domain (copyright-free) unless otherwise stated]
    3. Re:And they still wonder? by hr+raattgift · · Score: 2, Informative
      Every people has the right of self-determination. The EU is an abrogation of that right.


      Every person has the right to self-determination. The EU enshrines that right in, among other things, its collective adherence to the Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms.

      It can only justify itself, in the end, through the annihilation of its members


      If by "its members" you mean the 25 member-states, then I think that would be a good idea purely on the grounds of subsidiarity, starting with the most obvious nation-states like Belgium, Spain, the United Kingdom, and Sweden. Article 9 of the Treaty establishing a Constitution for Europe (TCE) explicitly extends the principle of subsidiarity downwards to the regional and local level. Two important criteria are also affirmed therein:

      * Decisions should be taken as closely as possible to the citizen
      * The action should secure greater freedoms for the individual

      TCE moreover is another move towards an ever-closer union of individuals rather than member-states. This runs contrary to the goals of some of the governments-of-the-day in a few member-states, and a much larger number of opposition parties, but it broadly reflects the evolutionary trend of the EU over the past 20 years.

      In short, if the EU strips member-states' national governments of their powers in favour of a federal system enshrining direct representation, the close-to-the-citizen principle, and the autonomy principle, I'm all for it. That this will anger many nationalists, particularly those who want to impose their vision of their culture and society and their "people" on unwilling fellow citizens, makes me very happy indeed.
  5. Time to dust off my software patent directive! by N3wsByt3 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Though...now maybe sending it to MEPs doesn't work anymore. :-/
    So..to who should I send it now; the european court?

    Anyway, here you go:

    The software patents manifesto

    Manifesto on the directive of "computer implemented inventions"

    Dear MEP,

    As you are probably well aware, soon the EU parliament will have a 'second reading' of the directive for allowing patents on "computer implemented inventions", which, as I will show below, actually amount to allowing software patents (swpat), though this is heavily disputed and denied by the proponents of the directive, including the European Commission (EC).

    The way in which this directive has gone through the EU Council of ministers is mind boggling and shows exactly how much the EU has a democratic deficit. Despite the fact there was no real majority for the draft any more (the change in vote-weight after the enlargement alone accomplished that, apart from a lot of change of minds of some other countries), despite the fact that stringent motions of national parliaments were passed to oblige the national ministers to redraw the proposal as an A-item so that it may be further discussed, despite the fact that the EU parliament and their JURY-commission asked for a new first (re)reading with almost unanimity, the EC chose to ignore and disregard all this, while giving no explanation, apart from "for institutional reasons as to not create a precedent". In other words, the "common position" had to be followed, even though there was no common position any more, because, apparently, the form is more important then the facts.

    This is a stupefying prime example of absurd bureaucratic reasoning and mentality; to give more importance to formality, and to place appearances before the changing facts. Bureaucracy abhors changes, even to the detriment of real democratic values. But then again, maybe this shouldn't surprise us, as the EC is exactly that: bureaucrats, whom were never voted into the position they occupy, yet create laws that could potentially influence millions of EU citizens (to which they do not have to answer to). The EU constitution leaves this democratic deficit as it is, alas. And as seen by the handling of this directive, the deficit is pretty huge.[1]

    I will not go further into the procedural mess and the apparent disrespect of the EC for the EU parliament, but rather concentrate on the different aspects of the directive itself (content). I will do this by stating, and then debunking, the rather dubious claims and arguments made by the pro-directive camp, which, alas, also include some misguided MEPs - though I haste myself to say the large majority of the EU parliament is well aware of the facts, as can be readily seen by the amendments made in the first reading.

    The following statements for why it is necessary to have the (current) directive is as follows:

    1)It is necessary for the stimulation and development of new software, so that IT-companies can be innovative to the fullest of their potential.

    2)It is necessary for the stimulation of EU software business, so we can effectively compete on the world-market.

    3)It is needed for the harmonisation of the internal market, and to retain the status quo. (Similar as the "we do not change the current practise" or the "it will avoid drifting towards US-style patentability" -argument).

    I will now debunk all these arguments (sources mentioned at the end of the document) in a rational and clear way, instead of all the FUD currently being made by many of the softwarepatents (swpat) proponents.

    1)It is necessary for the stimulation and development of new software, so that IT-companies can be innovative to the fullest of their potential.

    First of all, we have to ask ourselves, what, exactly, a patent is. A lot of pro-swpat advocates use terms as Intellectual Property (IP) rights, while those encompass a lot of different concepts, such as copyright (which is already used for software). We can find the following

    --
    --- "To pee or not to pee, that is the question." ---
    1. Re:Time to dust off my software patent directive! by JeanPaulBob · · Score: 2, Informative

      In my opinion, it would be better to say: "(to whom they are not accountable)"

      I'll explain why.

      "To whom" vs. "to which": Most of the time, when you're refering back to a person or to a group of people, you should use "to whom". "To which" is used mainly used for objects, or animals. It's like the word "it". A rule of thumb: If you wouldn't use "it" as a pronoun, you shouldn't use "which".

      "Have to answer to" vs. "accountable": Both are correct, but using "accountable" doesn't require as many words. The sentence is a bit simpler and more elegant, IMO.

      The dangling "to" at the end: The "to" at the end was redundant. The "to" in "answer to" got moved to the beginning--"answer to" got split up into "to whom...answer". In other words, you're changing

      "They do not have to answer to the citizens"

      into

      "citizens (to which they do not have to answer)"

      Does that make sense?

  6. oh dear by rucs_hack · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If software patents are allowed I'm going to have to patent several algorithms I've created just to prevent them being taken and used without recognising my development work.

    That will suck. I guess I can always dedicate the patents afterwards, so long as it prevents someone else from trying to make me not use my own work.

    I may be over-reacting, hope so, but software patents are a terrible idea.

    1. Re:oh dear by CastrTroy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Here's the question though. Why shouldn't someone be able to patent quicksort? I'm not really for software patents myself, as a lot of them fail the obviousness test. However, I don't think that quicksort is really that obvious, that It's actually a very useful invention. However it is just a mathematical formula when you get down to it, and we all know that formulas aren't patentable. I don't really agree with software patents, but in a lot of ways, they aren't really that much different than patents in any other field. If you cut out all the crap, you'd probably have a pretty good bunch of patents. I've yet to find a good logical paper that contrasts the pros and cons of software patents, and presents a good reason on why or not they should exist. Most of the stuff I read is severely one sided, or just yells of "No software patents" without any explanation or logic to back them up.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    2. Re:oh dear by tjeffer · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Well, I don't know what you mean by "academic priority", but you certainly should research the issue more before you go file a bunch of patent applications. If you've used the algorithms in software products already, they are part of the prior art and probably can't be patented by anyone (including you). Even if you can still secure patent rights on the algorithms, it may be more expensive than it is worth since no one else can enforce a patent right on the algoriths against you anyway (unless they managed to invent before you did). Either way, a couple hundred dollars worth of consultations with a patent attorney may save you tens of thousands of dollars in application costs.

    3. Re:oh dear by orasio · · Score: 2, Interesting

      First you have to understand that a patent is not an inherent right of the inventor.
      Patents are supposed to be an incentive for innovation.

      Quicksort is a great example. It's not a product of software patents.
      The fact is that patents didn't encourage the creator of quicksort, so qs _could_ be invented without the incentive of patents.
      On the other hand, had it been patented, you would have 20 years of slow sorting algorithms and superfluous legal costs because of it.

      The case must be made for software patents, that's why it's just dismissed, because there are a lot of drawbacks, and not a single tangible advantage.

    4. Re:oh dear by Barraketh · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Here's the way I see it:

      There is no inborn right to "own" intellectual property - you can't really own IP, since cost of replication is zero. Thus, the government provlides you with a temporary monopoly to compensate the time and money invested in the development of the invention. The government doesn't do this out of some magical concept of fairness, or because the invention is somehow yours - again, once an idea is out in public, it's everyone's. The government does this to promote innovation, figuring that otherwise people wouldn't invest the work needed to develop said invention. However, there must be a balance - if the patent time is too long, people aren't free to build and improve on the invention, and innovation suffers. If the patent time is too short, then people may be reluctant to make large invenstments in developing the invention, and innovation suffers.

      Now apply this thinking to the software field. The reason why software patents are unnecessary is twofold:
      1) The software market is changing so quickly, that being first to market is often conpensation enough in itself. Having patents in the software market last more than a few years is ludicrous, since they would then often be obsolete, and if the patents are that short, there's very little reason to have them there.
      2) It costs very little money to develop a software algorithm - all you need is a pen and a piece of paper. Compare this to the medical field for example, where companies have to spend billions on developing a drug, and then billions more testing it. With software, if you have a good idea, that's all you need.

      What these two factors achieve, is that we have no reason to think that there is a lack of innovation because there are no software patents. It seems that software patents might make software producers richer, but that people would still be in the software business without patents. Again, contrast with the medical industry, where if you spend $billions on developing a drug, and then someone goes and replicates it that's a fast way to go out of business. And if there is no reason to think that lack of software patents is hurting innovation, why have them?

      P.S. Yes, I realize the medical industry claims can also be disputed, but that's a different argument.

  7. Won't work by DrJokepu · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I am not very familiar with US legislation but here in Yurop courts can't create laws, they can decide only based on existing laws. So if the legislation (in this case: the European Comitee and the European Parliament, and later the national parliaments) don't create those laws, how could they decide anything?

    1. Re:Won't work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative
      I am not very familiar with US legislation but here in Yurop courts can't create laws, they can decide only based on existing laws. So if the legislation (in this case: the European Comitee and the European Parliament, and later the national parliaments) don't create those laws, how could they decide anything?

      Those laws dont' do anything on their own though. Someone has to act upon them. First the executive arm of government and then the judiciary (if it reaches them) apply their interpretation to that law.

      The EPO currently "interprets" Article 52 of the European Patent Convention, which states that only inventions are patentable and that programs for computers shall not be regarded as inventions, as meaning that programs for computers are in fact patentable. If they controlled the courts, they would have total power to enforce this "interpretation".

      The law is irrelevant if the court chooses to intepret "black" as "white".
    2. Re:Won't work by sepluv · · Score: 2, Funny

      I can only hope there are lots of zebra crossings in Luxembourg or Munich.

      --
      Joe Llywelyn Griffith Blakesley
      [This post is in the public domain (copyright-free) unless otherwise stated]
    3. Re:Won't work by tjeffer · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The original poster is talking about the difference between civil law countries and common law countries. In common law countries, the courts create common law that is every bit as binding as legislative law. In civil law countries, the courts are only supposed to enforce the laws of the legislature and are not supposed to formulate their own laws. The US is a common law country, while most of the EU are based on the civil law system.

    4. Re:Won't work by squiggleslash · · Score: 2, Informative

      The same is true of the US. However, in the early eighties, a group of largely right wing and semi-moderate justices on the Supreme Court, for some bizarre reason, decided that current patent laws as passed by Congress and as enforced by the USPTO, were too strict in terms of the types of things they allowed to be patented, and explicitly allowed a software patent (a method implemented by software on a factory controller.)

      Congress, unfortunately, decided to wash its hands off the matter and promptly passed the responsibility for policy making in patents to the new Federal Circuit court system.

      In fairness to Congress at that point, I don't think anyone realized either how much damage would be done by software patents, nor how absurd the concept is in general. Whether that would be the same with the EU court is open to debate, but while we have a better understanding today, we also have to face the fact that many companies know how to abuse the system, and they are aggressively lobbying for those very patents. So if a similar scenario arises, there's little guarantee the EU would actually pass laws to clarify the law in an anti-patent way.

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
    5. Re:Won't work by raindrop#1 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Article 52 of the European Patent Convention says that "programs for computers" shall not be regarded as inventions, "only to the extent to which a European patent application or European patent relates to such subject-matter or activities as such".

      So, if the crucial inventive step is merely that something is being implemented as a computer program, it cannot be patented. The subject matter of the patent must be more than merely, "hey, it's now being done on a computer".

      But, if the patent involved a software program that did some technical job in a novel way, so long as the novelty did not lie only or primarily in it being a software program as such, then it could be patented. As I understand it, this is the stance of the EPO and is in accordance with the European Patent Convention.

  8. Like Terrorists.... by ObsessiveMathsFreak · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ....The patent lobby only has to get lucky once. Once they're in, patents are forever.

    My opinion is that we should allow patents on absolutely everything, and simply let the patent trolls cause the entire system to implode on itself.

    --
    May the Maths Be with you!
    1. Re:Like Terrorists.... by rolfwind · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The depressing thing with your strategy is that, even if it works, it will set us a generation behind. This is also the sort of thing that will have the US/Europe fall behind Asia in these areas.

      The other obvious thing to point out is that patents were made to advance civilization and promote progress - largely w/o protection of patents, look how far the computer software industry has advanced. I could make a good case this would not be so if patent were around raising the bar of entry (actually, look at Universities - they are the forebearers of progress and are, er, were mostly open in research). It becomes obvious then that the reason for software patents is not to promote progress, but to protect corporations (corporate protectionism). Any politicians considering this should just be thrown out immediately by their electorate. There is absolutely no excuse to promote them. They literally want to suppress the little guy without an extensive patent portfolio to "cross-license" with the big boys.

      Socialism at it's best. History is repeating itself, types of government have ceased to matter (democracy, socialist, communist), corporations/money run the place.

  9. Alternative approach for ethical coders by Morgaine · · Score: 5, Interesting

    There is no need to resign to support your strongly held views against patents in software.

    All you need to do to fight patents very effectively is to ensure that your key ideas are released to the FOSS world as programming "noddies", ie. small example programs that illustrate the concept. Be very sure not to include any company code, nor any business logic.

    That establishes the prior art, so that even if a patent is taken out for that idea, eventually your prior art will ensure its demise if a patent claim ever reaches the courts.

    And if a company fires you for publishing your ideas in this way, well, it's not really the company that you wanted to work for in the first place.

    --
    "The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
    1. Re:Alternative approach for ethical coders by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 2, Informative

      And if a company fires you for publishing your ideas in this way, well, it's not really the company that you wanted to work for in the first place.

      Undermining your employer's patents is the kind of thing you're going to want to do anonymously in the first place. They're not stupid, and someone who does this to them is going to have a hard time finding employment if they know about it.

      Since you're "liberating" the patent "technology" (and I use that term loosely), if you have to put a name behind it for legal reasons (for example, if linuxg4mer6969 doesn't count as an prior user of what's described in the patent), then give the reconstructed code to someone else to claim credit for it.

    2. Re:Alternative approach for ethical coders by Wolfier · · Score: 2, Informative

      "Liberating patent technologies" is pretty non-ethical and can be classfied as the inappropriation of trade secret, and I highly advice against anyone to do so - returning vice with vice shouldn't be how things work.

      However, it's an entirely different matter if the idea originates from you - *instead of* giving the idea to the company in the first place and publish to OSS - just keep your mouth shut about your idea until you're at home.

      This way it'll make it both ethical and legal.

    3. Re:Alternative approach for ethical coders by Dun+Malg · · Score: 2, Interesting
      "Liberating patent technologies" is pretty non-ethical and can be classfied as the inappropriation of trade secret
      You're stating the obvious. We've already established that one who would engage in the act of "liberation" is opposed to software patents, so the question of ethics has already been addressed. Ethics have a communal aspect, but in the end they are highly personal. The things most people agree are completely wrong have been codified into law. "Ethics" are a much larger set that includes things that are extremely vague.
      As for misappropriation of trade secrets, well, that's obviously a possible legal risk, but again, if you think the attempted patent is itself immoral, then the risk may be worth taking. To torture an analogy: abolitionists broke the law helping escaped slaves to freedom. Were their actions unethical simply because they were illegal?

      The problem with your "argument" is that the premise we're exploring has already settled the issues you bring up and are discussing the how. Standing there shouting "but technically that's illegal and unethical" is ridiculous.
      --
      If a job's not worth doing, it's not worth doing right.
  10. Re:Patents are bad! by 91degrees · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It also has to cover the risk of failure. Many drugs cost as much to research but then don't pass final approval.

    But actually, the above statement is a lie to fool the naive. The reason it costs so much is that they can charge what the hell they like, and once the price goes higher than that, the demand falls.

    Patents would be much better if there was some way to force patent holders to licence to anyone for reasonable fees.

  11. Re:Egad by kahei · · Score: 2, Funny


    I would genuinely be abhorred if this were to actually happen.

    Why? Is it your fault?

    --
    Whence? Hence. Whither? Thither.
  12. Re:Patents are bad! by vtcodger · · Score: 2, Informative
    ***Theres no bloody way you can tell me that you need more than a 10 fold markup to cover the research!***

    The drug companies need to recover enough money to support all their research -- including trials of the many compounds that just don't work out. And they also need to self-insure against liability should one of their products kill or maim a bunch of folks even after all the testing. Of course, the companies also make obscene profits and it wouldn't bother me or a lot other people much, if that particular brand of obscenity were substantially moderated.

    But the system -- bad though it is -- works after a fashion and this is a case (and the only one I can think of) where simply closing all the world's patent offices, voiding all existing patents, and retraining all the patent lawyers as garbage collectors will not make the world a better place. Yes, we pay way too much for drugs until the patents expire. But in this one case, the patent-mongers are probably right. No patents, no new non-recreational drugs.

    --
    You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
  13. Bill Gates gets it (believe it or not)! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    In the current atmosphere of funding cuts to universities and researchers, they are looking for ways to monetize their 'intellectual property'. That means that data is jealously guarded and things aren't published the same way they used to be. The result is a lot of duplication of effort and a general slowing down of science. In that regard, patents are having an adverse effect on human progress. We got to where we are because scientists shared their findings after all.

    Bill Gates realizes that secrecy among scientists is slowing down aids research. As a condition for his funding of their aids research, he is insisting that they share their data. http://www.guardian.co.uk/aids/story/0,,1824606,00 .html

    In general, patents are being abused and are not fulfilling their original purpose. The people lobbying for patent protection for software are actually evil. They want to enrich a certain group of people at the expense of the rest of the world. When you see someone like Bill Gates acknowledging that, you know it has to be true.

  14. The European Parliament may be decisive again by FlorianMueller · · Score: 3, Informative

    The FSF Europe's Ciaran O'Riordan wrote in his article about the role of the European Parliament:
    in the EPLA they have no influence

    That is not necessarily correct. The first procedural question to be clarified concerning the EPLA is whether any of the 25 (soon to be 27) member states of the European Union are allowed to ratify it on their own. The European Commission's legal services say that the EPLA can only be concluded by EU member states as a so-called mixed agreement, which means that the EU (or in legal terms, the European Community, but to most people that's the same anyway) would have to become a virtual contracting state to the EPLA.

    I have already predicted in my blog that the European Commission is going to ask the European Court of Justice (ECJ) for an opinion on this question. They're not going to take their chances and create a court that might later be illegal from an EU perspective (with the effect that all of its rulings would be invalidated overnight).

    If the ECJ were to support the opinion of the European Commission's legal services, the immediate follow-on question from our perspective is whether the European Parliament, which is the most important bastion of balanced patent policy in Europe, is going to have a decisive role or whether it's just going to be consulted (in which case its opinion could be ignored). I already discussed this question with specialists of the European Commission more than five months ago, and they said that the EPLA would require modifications to certain parts of the existing EU law (the so-called "acquis communautaire") that are subject to the codecision procedure. The codecision procedure is the one under which the parliament has more influence in the EU than under any other procedure. My book No Lobbyists As Such - The War over Software Patents in the European Union discusses in detail the way the codecision procedure works: it's the procedural framework under which the software patent directive got rejected.

    Therefore, it's little surprise that certain die-hard proponents of the EPLA take the position that the EPLA can be ratified by any European country, including any member state of the EU, without EU involvement, while we (the anti-software patent camp) very much hope that the European Parliament is going to be needed.

  15. As usual, Stallman has a cogent argument by Zirtix · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Actually several arguments, some based on free sofware and some on the hazards of developing any kind of software under patents. The 'pros' of software patents are only for large multinational companies and patent trolls.

    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/fighting-software-pa tents.html
    http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/savingeurope.html

    Stallman: "Imagine that each time you made a software design decision, and especially whenever you used an algorithm that you read in a journal or implemented a feature that users ask for, you took a risk of being sued."

    The key difference is that one person can easily create a single software product that sinultaneously contains any number of 'patentable' ideas. This is the opposite of patenting in eg. chemical engineering or pharmaceuticals, which tend to focus on a single complete process or product (such as a compound).

  16. Turn the court to our advantage by stites · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The basic problem with the current European patent law is that it disallows
    software patents but is vaguely worded to the point that some courts interpret
    it to allow software patents. Thus in Europe today some countries' court
    systems allow software patents and some disallow software patents. The pro
    software patent lobby is trying to create a single Europe wide court that will
    allow software patents all over Europe. The anti software lobby is trying to
    block the single Europe wide patent court in an effort to keep software patents
    from spreading. Part of the problem with fighting the proposed new court is that
    aside from the software patent issue the single Europe wide patent court is
    basically a good idea.

    I propose that we block the single European patent court as a delaying tactic
    only. In the meantime we should lobby to get the European patent laws amended
    to where the anti software patent clause explicitly bans software patents in no
    uncertain terms. There is a fair bit of support for such amendments among the
    members of the European Parliament. Once we get the law amended then we could
    enthusiastically support the creation of a unified European patent court
    because the new court would disallow software patents all across Europe.

    ------------------
    Steve Stites

  17. Re:Patents are bad! by radtea · · Score: 3, Informative

    The drug companies need to recover enough money to support all their research -- including trials of the many compounds that just don't work out. And they also need to self-insure against liability should one of their products kill or maim a bunch of folks even after all the testing.

    Drug companies need to recover enough money to support all of their marketing. Research budgets at drug majors are always considerably smaller than marketing budgets.

    --
    Blasphemy is a human right. Blasphemophobia kills.
  18. Re:But that's not (my) problem with software paten by crosbie · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Of course, who would object to the principle of rewarding worthwhile investment?

    It is the unethical nature of the reward that is the problem.

    Think of a king that rewarded the inventor of chess with a hundred slaves and concubines to do with as he would. Perhaps a financial reward would be better than one that involved the enslavement of one's fellow men - irrespective of whether such power is in the king's gift?

    Software patents are a reward that consists of impacting the freedom of all other software engineers for a limited period, in order that the unscrupulous patent filer, blighter that he is, can enjoy making hay while his competitors' hands are tied.

    Don't you think, for just a moment, that perhaps it's a tad unethical to restrain everyone's right to practice their craft, just because it might possibly encourage some genius who has an algorithm that no-one else has thought of, that this genius isn't even willing to tell anyone else about, to publish that algorithm?

    Without software patents, such a genius must demonstrate to his fellow men that he has an amazing algorithm, and why it is so fantastic, and that he is prepared to disclose it to any person, or group of persons, in exchange for a goodly chunk of money. Why on earth can't this chappie be satisfied with money?

    And if he can't find anyone who is interested in buying his secret, and yet continues to believe that his secret is amazingly powerful, well, perhaps he jolly well should simply keep it secret. When he has successfully exploited it, people can start offering him money for it.

    If the point is, that's it's highly likely that someone else may think of it, well then, it bloody well shouldn't be patentable!

    And if the problem is that the idea can't be exploited unless it is disclosed, well, no need for patents to encourage disclosure. The public acclaim would easily be sufficient to tip the balance between keeping a privately unexploitable algorithm secret vs published.

    I will not accept the enslavement of my fellow man, nor any imposition upon his liberty, as reward for my ingenuity.

  19. hear, hear! by N3wsByt3 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is about the same thing I said to the FFII: our struggle is too passive; we're just waiting and fending off attempts to get softwarepatents validated.

    What we *should* be doing is being more pro-active, and try to get a law passed (or at least proposed) which would unify the patent law (which, on itself, is a good thing), but which explicitly forbids patents on software.

    We can never win on the long run, if we only defend, and the megacorps keep attacking: WE have to be pushing forwards with our goal as well, so THEY are in the defense!

    --
    --- "To pee or not to pee, that is the question." ---