Linux Hackers Offered Early Access to Next-Gen DVR

An anonymous reader writes "Linux hackers are being given the first crack at beta units and early release versions of a new Linux-powered DVR. The new device, available from Neuros Technology, is able to record MPEG-4 video from many media sources including cable, broadcast TV, and DVDs allowing the user to then transfer that video to portable media players or serve the media over a network. From the article: 'Neuros says "hundreds" of open source community members helped finalize the OSD's design. About two dozen purchased an early hardware prototype earlier this year. Partly to thank the community, and partly as a way of getting the device into the hands of highly critical users early on, Neuros will offer an initial "beta" production run exclusively to hackers.'"

Comments

Almost worthy..

[nicpottier]

This is almost REALLY cool, but is missing a few big things.

1) video inputs and outputs are analog.. lame, this isn't next gen, this is last gen.
2) no display. Even a one line LCD would go a long way... I don't always want my TV on to play music for example.

I love the business model though, and allowing the community to build things is great. Much like the Squeezebox.

Re:Almost worthy..

[JoeBorn]

I'm from Neuros, we talked about a display but decided a small one wasn't worth much and a big one was too expensive. We've focused more on a two way wifi remote ala Sonos, or the Creative audio streamer. So we'll be addressing the "music without a TV" with a "remote" control like that.

DVR I/O

[neonprimetime]

12Mbps USB 2.0 interface
SD/MMC/MemoryStick, Pro, Duo socket
CF socket supporting I/O mode
RS-232 serial console port (also used for controlling tuner boxes)
10/100 Mbps Ethernet
Infrared detector for remote control
Infrared blaster for controlling tuner boxes
NTSC/PAL composite or S-Video input
NTSC/PAL composite video output

Re:Mmm, DVR.

[Nos.]

What you do with the signal after it comes out of your digital cable box is up to you. Hook up myth or any of the other PVRs you can find out there. You can definitely put one together for less than $750.

Neuros seems interesting

[Kadin2048]

Neuros seems like a really intriguing company. I haven't (yet) purchased any of their gear, mostly because I'm currently happy with my third-gen iPod and relatively ancient USB EyeTV tuner, but I like the way they seem to be developing products.

The killer is going to be software, though; if they can't get a cohesive user experience down, the best software in the world isn't worth more than a VCR. With all the digital covergence stuff, interoperability and ease of use are the two main pillars that support everything else. By using open standards and free software, I'm confident they'll have interoperability on the technical side, but I wonder about the ease of use and vertical integration with other parts of the "user stack." (That is, the applications that let the users do particular tasks, like pull a recording from the STB and burn it to a DVD; will there be one integrated app to do that? Or will it require an awkward chain of tools?)

But in general, I think they're on the right track, and it's refreshing to see a company produce a product that honestly looks neat. It's been a while since I've seen that.

Now, if only they made one that would record DTV without dropping it to an analog signal first...an ADC is nice, but it seems a little late. TV is going digital, and I'd love to see an unencumbered recording device that worked there, before the FCC gets in there and starts crippling things.

Re:Neuros seems interesting

[JoeBorn]

Speaking for Neuros, I think your comments are absolutely right regarding the "cohesive user experience." We know that hackers will add features and get all kinds of "proof of concept" stuff working, but at the end of the day, it's our job (as the manufacturer) to stitch it together to make it work for the average person, that "doesn't need another hobby," as someone else said here. The first stage of this product's life will be geeks and hackers, but we need to get the user experience right to broaden the appeal. If we do that, I'm not so worried about the fact that this unit is SD v. HD and analog v. digital, we'll address that with future (more expensive) models. This one will serve a need for users that want a way to stitch together their SD video, digital audio, photos and connect that content (or internet content like Youtube, etc) to their TV and Stereo at a reasonable price.

IR Blaster

[Kadin2048]

I think most TiVO units have "IR Blasters" which are little dongles that go over the IR port on your cableco's box, and switch the channel and otherwise control it.

So basically, you "watch" the output from the TiVO on your monitor/television, and do all your programming and stuff. When the TiVO wants to get a particular signal from the cable box, either so you can watch it live or so it can record it, it sends a signal via the IR blaster into the cable box, switching the channel.

I don't know how reliable they are, and the whole thing reeks of 'kludge' to me, but I know some friends that swear by this setup.

Personally, I think it's too bad that nobody thought to mandate some sort of standardized control interface for cable and TV tuners; a serial port on the back of those DTV boxes would make all the IR stuff unnecessary.

S-Video only ... lame.

[Kadin2048]

Yeah, I was surprised when I saw that it didn't have a DVI port. I mean, it's got everything else that it would need to be a really slick product ... except that it's analog only.

So really it's just a glorified 480i ADC with a network card and a USB port. I'm somewhat unimpressed. The card reader slots really don't add anything for me, either. Except as storage for the machine itself, I can't ever foresee myself using them.

But ... SVideo? I mean, hello, 1986 calling. What's the purpose of that, so I can connect it to my SVHS deck? How about my Laserdisc player?

As I said in another comment, I find Neuros very intriguing as a company, and I hope that they sell enough of these things to stay afloat and make a better model that will do digital recording, preferably soon, before the media companies and their lackeys at the FCC push through a Broadcast Flag.

Corporate PR

[SuperBanana]

Partly to thank the community, and partly as a way of getting the device into the hands of highly critical users early on, Neuros will offer an initial "beta" production run exclusively to hackers

Bzzzt, I'll take "corporate PR lines" for $500, Alex.

This is to:

• "get the devices to highly technical users who will find all the bugs Neuros didn't before it gets shipped to the grandmas and grandpas of the world" Meanwhile, they get a lot of leeway for simply slapping a "beta" label on it.
• get them around any brand-wide or device distribution agreements to garner them a bunch of direct sales (which are worth their weight in gold, since you're not paying a distributor- yes, even if you discount the "beta" version under the retail by a fair bit. Distributors take a BIG cut.)
• get the bloggers posting (more like bragging) about how they got a device, how cool it is, etc. This gets everyone else reading the blogs whipped into a frenzy so that when they DO go on sale, everyone ignores the magazines if the thing isn't ACTUALLY the best device since the bread slicer. Apple's strategy (namely, a complete lockdown on ANY product details before it goes on sale) is similar; whip people into a pre-ordering frenzy and ship ship ship before anyone has so much as touched it.

This is a calculated PR move first and foremost; anything a corporation does is motivated almost exclusively in self-interest (more appropriately, the interests of the shareholders.) Anything about "thanking the community" is a secondary (or lower) concern. If they wanted to thank the community, they'd fold back bug fixes, feature additions, and technical innovation into the open-source software they are (no doubt) using.

Re:Corporate PR

[JoeBorn]

Speaking for Neuros, we are folding back bug fixes, and feature additions into the open source software we're using. In fact, the applications we've written ourselves are GPL too. There's a little more here than standard corporate schtick: http://wiki.neurostechnology.com/theneuros/index.p hp/Developer_Welcome

Form factor

[pe1chl]

I have two big stacks of "set-top-boxes" and other A/V related equipment, and I would appreciate it when manufacturers, even if they do not want to stick to 17" cabinets, at least put their products into square boxes that allow some stacking.

When everyone starts to use cases like this, space below my TV runs out very quickly...

Wrong Forest

[fm6]

Dude, stop looking at the trees — you're in the wrong forest. This device not only lacks an internal hard disk, its resolution choices are way below what you'd need to capture HD streams. Component outputs would be like tailfins on a Honda.

Judging from their web site, Neuros is mainly interested in creating devices that use portable devices for playback. Hence the emphasis on flash memory for storage. When this product goes GA, I'll certainly consider buying one to use with my TV — but my TV is not only analog, it has maybe a 10-inch screen. This DVR is aimed at people like me, with shallow pockets and modest requirements, not high-end video lovers like you.

Neuros stranded THIS user...

[PRMan]

I have one of the first Neuros Audio MP3 players and was promised a USB 2.0 upgrade as soon as the spec was finished and access to the loading software and the firmware as open source code.

As far as the USB 2.0, I was supposed to know that when they offered an ALPHA version (not BETA, ALPHA) of the USB 2.0 dock online that I was supposed to jump on it. No e-mails, no notification, I was just supposed to know somehow that the ALPHA version was my free upgrade. As soon as the USB 2.0 dock was finalized, I called them up and asked for one, since I bought it during the appropriate time period. They responded that I missed my window to upgrade for free. I responded that when I bought the player, they didn't say they were going to give me an ALPHA USB 2.0 dock, the implication was that I would get a fully-tested one. Eventually, they agreed to ship me one for a very reduced price. It never worked. I was finally refunded minus 2-way shipping (over $50 on a $250 player).

They NEVER provided the firmware as open-source code even though that was prominently displayed when I bought it. Their excuse? "It takes a $50,000 piece of hardware to compile it and nobody will be able to do anything with it." Several of us responded that there are some REALLY smart people in the world that make emulators and stuff and you might be amazed. Just put it out there. Still waiting.

They finally did release the C#.NET source code of the loading program, but that thing was so slow it would take 14-16 hours to load up a 20GB player. It would lock up for about 6-7 hours with no status just when you dropped your MP3 folder on the window, but it would eventually finish. After that, it would take about 8-10 hours to load up the player over USB 1.1.

Also, I would be remiss if I didn't mention that they did add several nice features to the player including an equalizer, all in firmware updates. So they did support it some, but not in a way that was usable for me (or promised to me).

Bottom line: beware of this vendor and their promises.

Re: S-Video only ... not so lame.

[Em Ellel]

Yeah, I was surprised when I saw that it didn't have a DVI port. I mean, it's got everything else that it would need to be a really slick product ... except that it's analog only.

Erm, outputing analog video source over DVI is completely pointless. Cudos to the company for not making it twice as expensive to give people an ILLUSION of quality while actually making it look worse.

So really it's just a glorified 480i ADC with a network card and a USB port.

Exactly. Except it also has a low power CPU capable of running its own code. Pretty much we are looking at AV equivalent of a linksys wi-fi router. Only unlike cisco they are encouraging people to write their own code.

I'm somewhat unimpressed. The card reader slots really don't add anything for me, either. Except as storage for the machine itself, I can't ever foresee myself using them.

The roots of this device is in capturing analog video into MPEG-4 for viewing on portable devices... you know, like the ones that READ flash media. The card slots ARE EXACTLY for storage for the machine.

Given the cost of this device ($230) what they packed in there is pretty impressive.

-Em