So What If Linux Infringes On Microsoft IP?

Mr Men writes to mention a ZDNet blog entry by Adrian Kingsley-Hughes wondering aloud if maybe, just maybe, Microsoft isn't lying about having patents that are part of Linux. "Come on, no matter how much of a Linux fan you are, you have to admit that there's at least a chance that Linux does indeed infringe on Microsoft's patents. After all, Microsoft does hold a lot of patents and while Linux is open source and we can all take a look at the source code, only Microsoft has access to most of its source code so it isn't all that difficult for it to prove — to itself at any rate — that there are IP infringements contained in Linux. After all, before IBM handed over some 500 patents to the open source community, it's pretty clear that Linux was infringing some of them. Given that, why is it so hard to believe that the same isn't going on with Microsoft?" Even then, he goes on to say, so what if they do? It's not like they're going to go after us with a 'Linux tax.' Kingsley-Hughes imagines that, for the most part, Microsoft is just going to sit on this info and use it to form more and more profitable deals. Better than the alternative, I guess.

Comments

I live in EU

[imbaczek]

so I don't care.

For now, at least.

Re:I live in EU

[ComaVN]

A lot of Linux distros are not US-based. Why would they remove code?

Re:I live in EU

[Tim C]

t will then most probably not exist in an separate european version because of the amount of work for the developers which would be needed to maintain two versions.

I believe we have one or two programmers of our own here in the EU...

Re:I live in EU

[tambo]

I think we can reasonably say that the risk is about patent infrigment here, and not source code copying.

And that's exactly the point that the author of the article misses. With statements like this:

Microsoft does hold a lot of patents and while Linux is open source and we can all take a look at the source code, only Microsoft has access to most of its source code so it isn't all that difficult for it to prove - to itself at any rate - that there are IP infringements contained in Linux.

...the author proves that he really doesn't understand patents anyway.

Patent infringement is not determined by comparing the infringer's product against the patentee's product. Rather, the infringer's product is compared against the invention claimed in the patent. The patentee's product is irrelevant to this process.

But let's get down to brass tacks. The problem is that Linux is fighting FUD with FUD. Microsoft is kinda-sorta playing the SCO Card by using veiled threats over its IP. Since Linux (as a whole) hasn't done any kind of research, it has to fall back on its own wholly conclusory claims that everything's A-OK, and stupid veiled threats over GPL v3. (The latter tactic strikes me as the equivalent of "bringing a knife to a gunfight," only it's more like a toothpick.)

This sucks, folks. At the end of the day, FUD is worthless - Linux's as much as Microsoft's. And since that's all anyone has at the moment, we're deadlocked.

But let's look at this another way. Patents are open documents. The Linux community has a ton of free manpower. And the open-source community loudly touts its decentralized-group-organization powers.

The solution write itself, people: The Linux community needs to conduct a comprehensive review of Microsoft's patents.

At this moment, Microsoft owns 5,844 patents. It wouldn't be all that impossible for the Linux community to divvy up the work, and have three people look at each patent to see how it impacts Linux. A coherent review of every such document would have pretty strong power - some power for legal purposes, and much more power for business and social purposes.

- David Stein

Re:I live in EU

[Movi]

Umm, i already asked Shuttleworth fir this, and I'm gonna repeat the question here: Why is ALWAYS that the rest of the world should suffer for the poor laws made in the US ? Why dpes Debian ask me if I want to install a piece that may infringe on some US patent laws, instead of just installing it and saying that if I'm in the US i should uninstall this piece of software because i have crappy laws? Seriously, it's NOT all about you Americans.

Re:I live in EU

[SpinyNorman]

I think the GCC folk are pretty careful and knowledgeable about patents. I've seen a number of previous discussions where they've avoided certain optimization methods because of patents. Anyway, given IBM's involvemnt with Linus, and the fact they they doubtless hold a gazillion more compiler patents than Microsoft, I'm sure there's nothing that gcc needs to do that couldn't be switched to an IBM patented technique if the need ever arose.

Balmer's suicide note: a 10 point guide

[nagora]

1. American directors have a legal responsibility to defend shareholders' interests.
   
2. Ballmer says that Linux is infringing and therefore damaging shareholders' interests.
   
3. Linux/OS programmers have access to their code only.
   
4. Linux/OS programmers have said they will remove infringing code.
   
5. Ballmer can see both the Linux/OS programmers' code and Microsoft's.
   
6. Ballmer is therefore the only party able to give the infringers what they need to know to stop damaging shareholders' interests.
   
7. Ballmer will not/has not said which code is infringing.
   
8. Ballmer is the party damaging (note: imperfect tense) Microsoft shareholders' interests.
   
9. Ballmer is therefore, by his own admission, in breach of American corporate law.
   
10. Someone call the police.
    

Re:Windows Infringes Patents

[Vlad_the_Inhaler]

One side effect of any patent attack by Microsoft on Linux would be a large number of technically savvy people looking for reasons why that patent was invalid. There is a precedent for this - when SCO launched their attack, everyone started digging. Given that a large number of patents out their are dubious at best, exposing them to that level of daylight would hurt. The only problem with this is: someone has to pay the lawyers stand up in court and beat Microsoft down. Who? IBM? Red Hat? It won't be Novell.

There is another reason for Microsoft to fight clean, it is the same reason they are careful not to be too unpleasant to Samba - the Industry would take a dim view of Microsoft attempts to torpedo something essential. Linux is essential, as is Windows / Unix interoperability.

Finally, if Microsoft did pull some patent attack, there is a good chance someone would be able to rewrite the code held to be in violation.