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Australia Backs Down on Draconian Copyright Laws

AcidAUS writes "The widely-publicized reforms to Australian copyright — which would turn iPod, camera phone and DVD recorder owners into criminals — have been significantly amended. The amendment bill was passed this past Friday, after the changes were put into place. The Labor and Green parties still have problems with the bill as it exists, but the Labor party (at least) wants to let it go based on the fact that it is 'a million times' better than the original proposed legislation." From the article: "Following an outcry by industry bodies and the public, [Attorney-General Philip] Ruddock amended the bill. 'The Government has listened to the Senate Committee and stakeholders and has improved the effectiveness of the reforms,' Mr Ruddock said in a statement. 'The amended reforms make it clear consumers can transfer the music they own onto devices such as iPods and enable the next wave of technology by allowing people to record a TV or radio program on mobile devices to watch it at a more convenient time.' The amendments also removed on-the-spot fines for some copyright offenses, to ensure they didn't 'unintentionally capture harmless activities of ordinary Australians'."

15 of 113 comments (clear)

  1. So the original authors get what they want! by Spazntwich · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ask for something insane. "Compromise" down to what you wanted in the first place. Everyone is happy.

    Good God, some strategies are so old and obvious I'd be amazed that they still work if I didn't know most people are idiots.

    1. Re:So the original authors get what they want! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Most people (sometimes even on /.) think sticking to your guns makes you an idealist and that idealism is naive or worse. It seems to transcend politics as well. Employers, policemen, other people in a position of authority... they all seem to see people unwilling to compromise as the problem.

      I think its because most people like to avoid confrontation and thinking as much as possible.

  2. Bad Laws by njko · · Score: 2, Insightful

    they need to first identify the crime, then make the law accurate. they always mess with the technology, they love to define computer terms like hyperspace e-mail then make ridiculous laws and impossible to fulfill

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    \n.\n
  3. American cred by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The US is losing credibility, and other countries no longer feel the need to curry favor at all costs.

    -b.

  4. Mod parent up! by msobkow · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The parent poster has the issue dead bang on. Propose something insane and jackbootish, then compromise so it's "merely" oppressive.

    On the flip side, it does sound like the current issue is explicitly and expressly granting media conversion and playback rights to people. That isn't what I'd call "oppressive", but a clarification of personal use rights that should have been obvious in any country.

    --
    I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
  5. Ah, Daddy I want a pony by tkrotchko · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is a pretty common thing to do. We call it "Daddy I want a Pony".

    Here's how it works:

    Kid: Daddy, I want a pony
    Dad: Honey, be reasonable. A pony requires land, a stable, and constant care!
    Kid: But Daddy, I want a pony!
    Dad: It would cost thousands of dollars, we can't afford it, you don't know if you like horses.
    Kid: (crying) BUT DADDY, I WANT A PONY!
    Dad: Uh uh uh... How about a dog instead?
    Kid: (crying stops) Oh okay, I can settle for that.

    So dad thinks "Phew! That was close, I almost had to buy a pony" ... ...and the kid thinks "Easiest way to get a dog!"

    You see this with taxes all the time. They threaten to tax everything... cars, boats, children, blades of grass, pimples on your chin. And then they "settle" for raising income tax another few points. And then you're supposed to feel "relieved".

    --
    You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
    1. Re:Ah, Daddy I want a pony by cayenne8 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      "You see this with taxes all the time. They threaten to tax everything... cars, boats, children, blades of grass, pimples on your chin. And then they "settle" for raising income tax another few points. And then you're supposed to feel "relieved".

      Actually...they do the opposite, which kids...and I don't understand it.

      They really should tax you for children...rather than give you a tax break. People children are an extra burden on society...schools, medical, social services (for so many people that are irresponsible for their own kids). In short, people have kids, which use up extra resources. Why should they not take a larger role in paying for them, rather than getting a cut in taxes, and costing those without kids more?

      I mean, I hear the arguement, that tax breaks encourage people to have more kids. Why? People will always f*ck. F*cking will result in kids...I don't think anyone needs encouragement to screw more. I don't think that any couple has said to each other.."Hon...I just don't wanna have any (more) kids.". "But babe, look at the tax write off we'll get for the kids if we have it"."Ok, babe...take them panties on down there then!!!"

      Anyway, so, if they're looking for revenues that target a burden that uses the resources that these taxes pay for...tax parents for each kid they have.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    2. Re:Ah, Daddy I want a pony by Alsee · · Score: 2, Insightful

      they do the opposite, whi[th] kids...and I don't understand it.
      They really should tax you for children...rather than give you a tax break.


      I'm not arguing for or against anything here... if someone has concrete effective improvements to suggest to the system, great. I'm merely trying to adress your stated not-understanding why things are the way they are.

      In theory people should build up a signifigant cash nest egg before creating a child, to properly supply that child's needs.

      Unfortuantely I'm not aware of any acceptable means of actually ensuring/enforcing that in practice. Any means I can think of to attempt to enforce it would require inherently "evil" means and/or would be wide open to abuse in one way or another. You need a licence to get a dog, but any incompetent jackass gets to pop out kids. As bad as that is, I hardly want to contemplate a governement rounding people up at gunpoint and forcibly sterilizing them or forcibly preforming abortions on them, or anything else within ten thousand miles of that.

      So in practice a signifigant number of people will produce kids without building up the advance savings to fully cover the costs of turning that child into a maximally productive 18-year-old citizen entering society. In practice a malnourished and/or uneducated and/or substandard medical cared child will result in greater long term indirect social costs upon you and me than the cost taxes to help ensure that those minimum standards are met. For example you cannot run a democracy with an uneducated population. Even with (tax based) universal public education we already have a hard enough time maintaining the quality of our democracy. Paying taxes to run a public school system is a small price to pay to ensure minimally prepared citizens entering the elecorate, and minimally prepared workers entering the national workforce. Paying those taxes are worth it and benefit you and me, even if we have no children of our own.

      Now more specifically to the "child tax credit". Unfortuantely most people are rotten at planing ahead, and in particular have a rough time adapting to a drop in available cash flow. You may be able to get by fine on an $X budget, but if you have established mortgage payments and car payments and food shopping etc etc etc based on a higher $Y budget can make it extremly difficult to move to that lower $X budget... especially when you can't change the mortgage payment or the car payments. Even a reasonable well off middle class family can get "crunched" by child expenses when they had a previously balanced budget with substantial fixed exppenses like a mortgage.

      The idea is that you don't want the child.... the future citizen... to get caught in that crunch and wind up long-term "impaired" with the inevitable long term costs and negative impact on society itself... the long term impact on you and me. The $1000 child tax credit ensures at least a $1000 buffer to shield the developing child from suffering the worst brunt of that crunch (food / clothing / medical care).

      Again, I'm not fighting for anything here. Well, I *would* argue for public school taxes but I'm not taking any sort of side on child tax credits. I see it as an ugly solution to an ugly problem. Offhand I don't have anything to offer I consider much of a better answer to the ugly problem... I don't have much interest in the subject and nothing particularly to fight for either way. If I have nothing to offer on an ugly problem then I'm fairly content to with whatever other poeple (who do have an interest/position) work out on that ugly problem.

      So you may well disagree with the reasoning/justistification for child tax credits (I agree it's an ugly solution), but hopefully you now understand it. Maybe now you do agree with it, or maybe now you can rationally try to improve it. I'd say understanding and dissagreeing is a step up and more productive than not understanding.

      -

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      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
    3. Re:Ah, Daddy I want a pony by syousef · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Except that your argument ignores the invention of birth control, and would lead to a system where people could tax themselves into extinction. Oh and you're also conveniently forgetting that while it is a burden on society to bring a child into the world, that burden is also shared by the child who is suppose to have decent prospects of growing up and contributing to society and taxation. What you're talking about limits the population which actually decreases revenue in the long run. Even the politicians won't do that because while they will hold a specific office for a 2-4 year period, they hope to be leeching taxes from people in different positions for as long as they live. Well until population becomes so unsustainable that the standard of living drops, then you're looking at a situation like China where they limit the number of children you're allowed and are draconian about enforcing it.

      Yeah apart from all those GAPING HOLES you've thought this through real well pal. Couldn't possibly have anything to do personal issues and resentment of children.

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
  6. Boy, that's some mighty hot water... by Overzeetop · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...could you turn the temperature down just a bit so I can get used to it before you make it any hotter.

    Thanks,
    Kermit

    --
    Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
  7. Smoke and mirrors by sterno · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This sounds a lot like a deliberate strategy. Put out a proposal that's totally extreme and ridiculous to freak people out. Then when they reject it out of hand you come back with what you really wanted in the first place and it'll pass without dispute. Given labor's reaction, it looks like it worked.

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    This sig has been temporarily disconnected or is no longer in service
  8. Here they're more subtle. by Kadin2048 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    In the U.S., the pro-copyright lobby hasn't been quite so audacious as they were trying to be in Australia; here they've been more subtle, and thus have avoided much public controversy. Via the DMCA, they made it illegal to upload DVDs or next-generation audio formats to an iPod (unless you've re-purchased it specifically), and created an artificial distinction completely without precedent between works protected by DRM, and unprotected works. Then they got Congress to extend the term of Copyright, to prevent any of their generations-old horde of cultural IP from leaking out into the public domain.

    The U.S. and Australia have much the same disease, it's just that they seem to have gotten hit with a more virulent form, and thus noticed it; here we seem to have the creeping, cancerlike version, and for the most part are still ignoring it and hoping it'll go away.

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
  9. Truly Faulty Logic by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 3, Insightful
    wants to let it go based on the fact that it is 'a million times' better than the original proposed legislation.

    A bad law that's now a less bad law is still a bad law. Such faulty rationale only leads lobbyists to ask for the truly impossibly unreasonable, knowing that the compromise will still give them the mostly unreasonable.

    Reminds me of a recent case where one woman won a major lottery jackpot, and immediately another woman claimed this was her winning ticket, which she had lost in the convenience store parking lot. The compromisers in the public media were claiming that, because so much money was involved, that it would be fair to just split the money between the two claimants. I don't know whose idea of fair this is, but certainly not mine. The woman claiming to have lost the ticket eventually admitted to lying about this, and the true winner was paid all of their winnings.

    Moral: Don't fall for the trap that the fair solution would be to give us half of what we originally asked for. Some people deserve none at all!

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  10. But do they realize... by ChilyWily · · Score: 2, Insightful

    why such a draconian proposal would be made in the first place? Isn't it just a ploy to scare people into "look what could've happened" to "we are your saviors, we understand the little guy" - I call shenanigans. When citizens are called "consumers" and big business threatens the ordinary little guy by LAW, something is seriously messed up. Think of it, when was the last time you read a headline that did not involve a big corporation/lobby influencing a government to do something that runs completely opposite of what the role of a government is. Why does the little guy get so jacked everytime!

  11. Re:But seeing the close ties that this govenment h by Znork · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "I have yet to hear of any decent ways to change it."

    Solving that problem depends on refactoring the foundations of the concept and realizing that copyright in itself is an actual tax (extracted from the economy by means of legal monopoly pricing).

    Once you realize that copyright _is_ a tax, despite its masquerade, it becomes a problem no more or less difficult to solve than any other government incentives and financing situations (ie, is the tax base as equitable as possible, does the taxation do as little secondary economic damage as possible, is the money going to the intended recipients and achieving its purpose, etc).