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Norman & Spolsky - Simplicity is Out

guanxi writes ""As simple as possible, and no simpler", you might have heard a few time, or KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid). No more! The new hot trend is complexity: '[I]f you think simplicity means ... "does one thing and does it well," then I applaud your integrity but you can't go that far' says Joel Spolsky. 'Why are Yahoo! and MSN such complex-looking places? Because their systems are easier to use [than Google]' explains Donald Norman, who also also tells us that Simplicity Is Highly Overrated. Are they trying to make a subtler point, are they just consultants making a splash, or complexity the Next Big Thing in design?" From the 'highly overrated' article: "After touring the store my two friendly guides and I stopped outside to where two new automobiles were on display: two brand new Korean SUVs. Complexity again. I'm old enough to remember when a steering wheel was just a steering wheel, the rear view mirror just a mirror. These steering wheels were also complex control structures with multiple buttons and controls including two sets of loudness controls, one for music and one for the telephone (and I'm not even mentioning the multiple stalks on the steering column). The rear view mirror had two controls, one to illuminate the compass the other simply labeled "mirror," which lit a small red light when depressed. A rear view mirror with an on-off switch? The salesperson didn't know what it did either."

18 of 381 comments (clear)

  1. ROTFLMAO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why are Yahoo! and MSN such complex-looking places? Because their systems are easier to use [than Google]

    Please stop already...the laughter is painful.

  2. Swimming against the tide by tverbeek · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They have a point, in that there is a population that doesn't mind complexity (aka "clutter"). Just look at a typical 16-year-old's bedroom, or a college student's MySpace page. But nearly everyone I know over 40 tends to prefer "simple". "Just give me a cell phone that makes phone calls," they say. My parents would pay double for a TV remote with half as many buttons.

    But if these "experts" think clutter is the Next Big Thing, I have some demographics to share: the adolescent/young adult cohort that routinely thrives on oodles and knobs and buttons is entering a shrinking phase, and that overpopulated cohort known as the Boomers are all on the high side of 40.

    --
    http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    1. Re:Swimming against the tide by tacocat · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's cyclic?

      When you make something that works. You start to play with it to make it do more. It's complex. Then it fails. Then you make it simple.

      These are opposing forces to make it complex to better address the niche market potential and improve the customer experience. All the general marketing and sales initiatives to make things better and new and improved.

      Contrary to this is the force to simplify things in order for you to concentrate on other issues. This is not a force that is recognized or embraced by the marketing and sales thinking in business.

      If you make something that is basic and effecive. Say a round ball. Then marketing will start asking people why they didn't purchase a round ball. Based on the feedback they start applying modifiers and options to the round ball. Before you know it you have colors, textures, handles, AM/FM radio... Some of which is useful (colors and textures) and some of which is a detraction from the original design (AM/FM radio balls break when you treat them as a ball).

      All of this is also the pressure of product convergence. First there was the cell phone and now it's a cell phone, gamestation, television, ipod, PIM and more more more every week.

    2. Re:Swimming against the tide by fyngyrz · · Score: 3, Insightful
      ...and that overpopulated cohort known as the Boomers are all on the high side of 40.

      I'm on that list; 52 and very boomy. But I still prefer my Marantz 2325 in the bedroom to my Denon surround system in the living room because the 2325 provides a full front panel with control of everything on a knob right there in my face instead of hidden "for my convenience." Is the Marantz more formidable to look at? You bet it is, there are thirty adjustable controls, three sets of jacks, a slew of status indicators, a dial readout and two meters on the panel. The Denon has two knobs and a display; even if you open the sub-bay, most of the functionality isn't directly accessible.

      Likewise, my Kia Sportage is full of controls and conveniences, and I simply love that vehicle. I suspect that when that salesman does his due diligence and learns what the mirror button does, he'll be well rewarded. There are no "trivial" things in my sportage; everything has been useful, convenient, and a real relief from the dumbed-down controls of my previous vehicles.

      Finally, the software I prefer is powerful, full of features, and doesn't hide them under layers and layers of menus, and furthermore, that's the design approach I take with software I write. The primary reason why is the countless times I've seen customers go "I didn't know that was even there!" with all kinds of software. As far as I am concerned, when an operation is selected, as many of the options as possible, preferably all of them, should be right there for your selection. I know it makes it a lot easier for me to use software, and I know it addresses those folks who wander through software instead of studying it (and those are few and far between.)

      Google's got the right idea for its search clients. But then again, come in there without having been there for a while and try to find where to submit URLs as a content provider... that's pretty minimalist and obscured under a few layers of stuff, there's no particular hint on the home page. Reminds me of my Denon. Sounds great, and you can't argue that the volume control and source selection are right there, which is what most people use most. Can you EQ the room or select what kind of inputs a source has? Sure you can. Big time. Better not have arthritis, though... you've got some menu navigation chops to exercise, and like Google, it's not all that obvious. In fact, frankly, its a pain in the butt.

      I'm "that guy" who will be more inclined to buy something if the controls are in my face. The more knobs, buttons, meters, displays, and UI elements it has that are connected directly to particular functionality, the happier I am. I don't want my bass control buried under layers of menus, and I don't want my software controls buried, either. So I dunno about that boomer argument. We grew up with complex interfaces. Someone took that idea away from us right about the time the programmable VCR came out, and ever since then, there's been a whole class of people who "can't run stuff." Coincidence? I think not. Just bad design, started by some clown who thought that minimal == better. It doesn't. It just == minimal.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  3. Bullshit by neuro.slug · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If simplicity is out, why is the iPod doing so well? One wheel, four buttons, clean white box. Sure, it's not the only reason, but it does look ever approachable. Why do you think that, in the age of a camera-mp3-omg-do-fucking-everything mobile phones, Motorola is developing a bare-bones cell phone?

    I call bullshit.

  4. eeejit! by Fallus+Shempus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    KISS isn't necessarily referring to the user interface, which is all TFA is on about

  5. It's never simple by Centurix · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Complexity scales badly. Flexibility is usually the first casualty of war.

    --
    Task Mangler
  6. What a crackhead... by MustardMan · · Score: 4, Insightful

    MSN and Yahoo are easier to use than google? Huh? He goes on and on about how all of yahoo's options are right out there in the open - which is the ENTIRE FUCKING PROBLEM. Too many options is overwhelming and confusing. Plus, he makes ridiculous factually incorrect bullshit statements, like implying yahoo's front page is customizable, while google's isn't. This is just some jackass trolling for page hits by taking up the contrary view.

    1. Re:What a crackhead... by spellraiser · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Amen to that.

      Regarding MSN; I guess somebody forgot to tell Mr. Norman about Microsoft's blatant ripoff of Google. If Google is doing things so wrong, why is Microsoft copying their look and feel to the letter?

      --
      I hear there's rumors on the Slashdots
  7. What about the Vista shutdown interface, Joel? by GGardner · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In this article, Joel on software claims that simplicity is overrated, that users want more features, and the single thing his company does to drive more sales is to release a new version of an existing product with more features. What's notable is that a week earlier, he wrote this well-circulated post lambasting Microsoft for having too much choice in the shutdown menu in Vista, and advocated for a simple, one-button shutdown solution.

  8. Differing requirements: marketing vs. users by fractalus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Simplicity is still better. Norman basically makes the case that, from a marketing perspective, simplicity does not sell. People perceive a complex UI as being more powerful and capable. This makes market pressure favor the complex UI.

    However, that doesn't mean it's better. It means maybe you'll sell more, but it doesn't mean the device will work better or people will use more of the features. If you care about the user experience after the sale, simplicity still wins. If all you care about is separating the man from his money, slather on the complexity.

    --
    People are never as simple as their stereotypes. This applies equally to Christians, Muslims, and Emacs-lovers.
  9. Re:Really... by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Perhaps the best compromise is a complex design with a simple UI...?

    Since TFA mentions cars, I'll mention things like VW's Direct Shift Gearbox. Basically all the advantages of a stick shift (it *is* a manual gearbox) with auto-like shifting smoothness since shifts are done by releasing one clutch while engaging the other one. A simple interface, too - 2 pedals.

    If anything, cars are getting *simpler* to drive. Automatics are available on more models (unfortunately, I *like* manual cars). No more manual chokes or carburetors. It's the auxilliary features that are getting more complicated, but driving itself is getting easier.

    -b.

  10. Define Simplicity... by bockelboy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That's a disappointing article from Joel, he's usually more observant than that. I'd expect him to be able to make the distinction between "simplicity of an application" and "simplicity of an interface". You can have a feature-rich application which has an extremely simple interface.

    My Mac laptop has a simple interface that both me and my wife enjoy. However, it is perfectly as functional as my linux desktop, who is much more complex.

    An iPod's interface is simple; the device itself is complex. Same with gmail.

    Both authors make the mistake of equating "ease of use" with "lack of features".

  11. Re:Simplicity is not dying, it's being killed off by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 3, Insightful
    And just more things to break. Honestly. The more crap you shove into a compact space the higher chance something's going to break, fail and cost hundreds in repairs.

    Cheers! What we need is a modern equivalent of the Volvo 240. Rugged, simple without being cheap, and capable of carrying the kitchen sink, too. The closest thing on the market is probably the Subaru Legacy Outback series. If only they sold it with a hybrid powertrain or diesel engine and it made over 45 mpg, I'd buy on in a second. And, no, hybrid drivetrains don't have to be more complicated than "normal" powertrains - if you look at the Prius, it has only a single (planetary) gearset for the transmission and no clutch or automatic clutchpacks to wear out.

    I have manual windows. I wouldn't trade em at all. (I do wish I had automatic doors though; at least those can be used manually...for now)

    The doors that automatically lock at over 5 mph and then don't unlock until you manually unlock them really annoy the living shit out of me. I can understand the motivation - fear of lawsuits if someone carjacks you at a stop, but please provide an easy way to turn this misfeature off!

    -b.

  12. Norman is confused, and has no idea what Google is by chill · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "True, but that's because you can only do one thing from their home
    page: search."

    Ummm...that is because almost everything you're doing from one of
    those portal pages can be called a search.

    If you want a map at Google, just type the address or location into
    the search bar. The top links will be maps of the location. After
    all, you're searching for a map.

    If you want to check something on Scholar, just type the info into the
    search bar. The top links will most likely be answers from Scholar.
    After all, you're searching for scholarly information.

    You can also do things like basic math, currency conversions, get
    dictionary definitions, find books, etc. all from the search box.

    The other services you mention give you an array so you have to think
    "what tool does what I want", whereas most of the time Google *just
    does it*.

    http://www.google.com/intl/en/help/features.html

    Google is what simplicity SHOULD be. Not just doing one thing, but
    just doing what you want -- whatever you want.

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
  13. When the handle breaks it's cheap by anomaly · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Recently the power window in my Grand Caravan failed. I took it to the shop to have it repaired. A sensor needed to be replaced - $370 for parts and labor.

    When the handle falls off, I can call JC Whitney and order replacement handles and install them myself in 10 minutes.

    Simple is good. Geezer indeed.

    --
    But Herr Heisenberg, how does the electron know when I'm looking?
  14. Complexity is Preserved by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The iPod is not a simple device. It appears simple because it was designed to be easy-to-use; however, its complexities are evident from just a quick test drive.

    Apple has a saying inside their development organization "Complexity is Preserved".

    What this means is that given any task, it's always the same level of complexity. All you can do is shift around where the complexity is. Apple would like to think it's the best game in town for taking the complexity off of the user and putting it into its computer code.

    If it's not blindingly obvious to everybody, it takes more work on the developer's part to make something that's easy to use. 'Exposing the implementation' is easy.

    --
    My God, it's Full of Source!
    OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
  15. Re:Sadly, they weren't joking. by Uncle_Al · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Hmmm...
    1. Maybe people mostly search because it is such a hassle to do anything else
    2. Sorry, I entered some street addresses and it didn't work. And now?
    3. some "clutter" is better than having to click 5 links to go to where you want to

    Nobody argued that googles search interface is bad(It's hard to beat it actually). It's just that that's all there is.

    I remember the proverb:"If all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a nail!"