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End of the Blu-Ray / HD-DVD Format War?
Next week's Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas should shake up the format war. The NYTimes reports that Warner Brothers will announce the Total HD disc that can store both Blu-ray and HD-DVD content. The article also mentions that LG (along with "possibly other gadget makers") is expected to announce a player that can play both formats. According to Yahoo, LG has not announced pricing, but the Times notes that such dual-format devices are bound to cost more than existing players. And the Times outlines the many considerations that would come into play before studios decide to release their content in both formats on a single disc.
This will end the Blu-Ray / HD-DVD war much in the same way that DVD±R drives ended the DVD+R / DVD-R war.
And to a lesser extent the Betamax / VHS war.
Summation 2
Um, HD-DVD uses the blue-violet 405nm laser too.
I'm keeping out of this arguement though, I really don't care which is better until one of them fails. Too much DRM, too many faults and cost is just too much.
Monkeyboi
superior just based on the fact that it can hold more data
Brilliant. A single criterion for superiority.
"Blu-Ray is an always has been superior just based on the fact that it can hold more data"
Yeah. I have some backup tapes that can hold more than my hard drive but I still use my hard drive as my primary source of data storage. Why? Because storage capacity isn't everything. I'm not saying BluRay is or isn't superior but I'd wager data throughput will be a much bigger factor. The cost of the reader and writer will also be significant, especially if the only difference is indeed storage capacity.
Blu-Ray is an always has been superior just based on the fact that it can hold more data (and it uses that cool blue laser).
Both HD-DVD and blu-ray use blue-lasers, so that is a non-issue. Blue-Ray has more capacity per layer (25GB/layer) as opposed to HD-DVD (15GB/layer), but a dual-layer HD-DVD has more than enough space to hold a movie and all the crappy extra feature, especially when using h264 or VC1 codec. So extra space for blu-ray is also irrelevant. Extra space may be needed for games, and IMHO thats where Blu-ray will shine. But for movies HD-DVD is a better deal because in the end you get same audio/video quality as blu-ray at half the price. Blu-ray might just end up being a gaming-format for ps3 and nothing more.
As has been noted in an earlier post, Blu-Ray disks hold more data. Those behind Blu-Ray would not be happy to see their disks reduced to computer archives rather than media as Warner Bros. sells content to happy consumers. This could be a considerable loss for Blu-Ray as empty disks sell for much less than disks with media.
Something that is not mentioned in the article is why consumers would want either format anyway.
I have a 1080i television and a seXbox-360, but I don't want either format because of the DRM and the lack of features. Maybe in the future when they can offer something substantive, as DVD did when it displaced video tape, I'll consider Blu-Ray, HD-DVD, or Total DVD. Right now, DVD looks just fine to me.
We have always been at war with Eurasia!
If the manufacturing costs of these disks is comparable to HD-DVD/Blu-ray disks, it might just click.
I doubt it. Both formats' relative failure up until this point has nothing to do with the "format war". I use quotes because there really isn't any war to speak of; nobody cares. Look throughout recent history, and you'll see that nobody cares about incremental quality improvements in media format. If the media's physical shape or size changes, that's something else, but there aren't any physical changes here. Even broadcast quality upgrades have been ill-received, and have only come about because the FCC has mandated it. In this case, I don't believe a regulatory agency even exists to mandate media format upgrades.
So, dual mode discs or dual mode players or even a total end to any disagreement between content producers will change nothing; HD-DVD/Blu-Ray will each go the way of DVD-Audio (do most of you even know what that is?).
The new Warner Bros. "Total HD" hybrid disc and LG Electronics (re-announced) combo HD DVD/Blu-Ray drive are solutions for a problem we didn't ask for: studios being idiotic and only releasing movies in one format.
WB and Paramount get free passes for being the only studios to support both formats. Everyone else gets Fs.
The HD market is a tiny swab of moist air in the filled water bucket of DVD revenue. I think sales are still under 1%. I can guarantee you that they would be at 5% or more if this stupid format war never came around. That's the main issue.
I don't understand why Universal (and to some extent WB) continue to make these HD DVD/DVD combo discs. For the uninitiated, these are dual-sided discs, with the DVD on one side and the HD DVD on the other. Dual-sided discs are always more complicated and expensive to manufacture and they're really not a value-add to consumers. Most big releases on DVD go with multiple discs rather than multiple sides. So, it makes it a crappier product and on top of that, they charge a premium, anywhere from $10 to $20 (MSRP) for our "benefit"! Note: expect this to play out in this new/twin/hybrid Blu-Ray and HD DVD format. Why pay $25 for one movie when you can pay $40 for both, one of which is unnecessary?
And here LG joins the fray, offering a dual-format player for $800-$1300. Nevermind that at that price range a savvy shopper would be already able to buy both players. HDTV owners aren't buying the new formats because they don't want to pick the losing side. Why don't they want to pick the losing side? Because they don't want to buy a new player for the winning format years down the road. Mind you, in 2009 or 2010 HD players are going to be $199. So these people are holding off because they don't want to spend $199 in another year. And a new $1000 player is supposed to calm these fears?
I can't put it any clearer than this: they fucked up. Everyone did. And now to make up for their mistakes, we should pay extra. And we won't.
The best part? The statements we'll hear in 2008 that the HD market isn't catching on. And who's to blame? Why, not the studios, but pirates! Pirates took our profits.
This whole ordeal is being played out by giant billion-dollar corporations that are basically repeatedly hitting themselves and each other in the groin with a hammer. When we ask them to stop and re-think what they're doing, they just ask us for money to cover the medical expenses. And then they use that money to buy more fucking hammers.
Small potatoes make the steak look bigger.
An interesting side note on formats...
Most of my friends who have the new wide screen HD TVs don't have HD service. Furthermore, they stretch standard TV to fill their wide screen which makes everyone look fat. They end up with a low quality distorted picture but they are really impressed with their new "media experience". This is the real HD experience. I doubt there is any real demand for true HD.
I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
Where "the cheaper format to produce" == standard-definition DVD, right?
It's the wrong format.
Make a standard that takes solid state memory, capable of arbitrary resolution and supports the best quality and the most most common formats. Make it cheap (no lasers or moving parts should help a fair bit). Initial market will be home videos and people with media on their PCs that they want to view on their television screen.
It will take a few years for media to become cheap enough for it to be worth releasing pre-recorded movies but if there's enough of a market without them then they will become too large a market for the movie industry to ignore.
There's also ease of manufacture, but that's a major, major win for HD-DVD, instead. It's essentially free for a DVD pressing plant, and the yields are almost as good as normal DVD. Meanwhile, everything I hear suggests that BD-50s are pretty much still test pressings at the Sony lab, with roughly 10% yields.
"I Know You Are But What Am I?"
This would sound like a really good point unless you've ever actually purchased or rented one of these DVD sets, and wondered why there's only two episodes on a disc. The reason for this is that you can charge more for a 5-disc set than you can for a 2-disc set. Even though the content is the same, the customer feels like they're getting more if they have a big box full of DVDs. Just take a look at the back of any TV series disc, and observe how much of the burned area is used. Usually it's only about 30% of the total disc area.
If they can already fit more content on these discs, there's no reason to believe they'll add additional content in the space Blu-Ray provides. If anything, they'll just throw more crap extras on there that nobody wants (like trivia games, previews, and links to their website, since the interesting stuff like interviews and behind the scenes footage costs money to create).
Money I owe, money-iy-ay
"I'm not sure if you're making your story up, your brother is a blind moron, or his TV sucks wastewater, but one of the three is true -- an HD signal cannot be mistaken for an SD signal by anyone with eyesight! "
Wrong. It depends on the size of the TV screen and the distance you are viewing it from. With a small TV from far enough away you won't be able to tell the difference unless you have binoculars and that distance isn't as great as you might think. Also with a 40" screen it's near impossible to tell the difference between 720p and 1080P if you sit more than 6-7 feet away.
Brilliant. A single criterion for superiority. (holds more data)
So since the two formats are otherwise the same physical size, support the same codecs, and support the same protection system - do you need any other form of superiority to declare it better, especially as someone who may potentially look to be storing or moving large amounts of data on these discs? What is it you are looking for?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
when was the last time you purchased a monitor that couldn't display games or video at HD resolutions? when was the last time you saw a laptop advertised with a 4:3 screen?