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Expensive U.S. Spy Satellite Not Working
Penguinshit writes to mention a Reuters article about some trouble the U.S. is having communicating with a spy satellite. The sensor package was launched last year by the U.S. National Reconnaissance Office, and is worth hundreds of millions of dollars. It has apparently hung in a low orbit for months now, and efforts to communicate with it have been unsuccessful. From the article: "The official said the problems were substantial and involved multiple systems, adding that U.S. officials were working to reestablish contact with the satellite because of the importance of the new technology it was meant to test and demonstrate. The other source said the satellite had been described to him as 'a comprehensive failure.' There was no suggestion by either of the sources that the satellite had been purposely damaged as part of a terrorist attack. Another government official said he had no information about any attacks on U.S. satellites."
"Windows has encountered an error from which it cannot recover and needs to restart. Please press any key to continue..."
The NSA: The only part of the US government that actually listens.
So that's what my DIY laser cannon shot down... I was worried that I built it wrong.
Bet ya this is a case of converting form Imperial to Metric again. Guess the military never got NASA's memo :P
"Nothing to see here... at least not with your security clearance."
why mention it? Why raise the 'boogeyman' of terrorism for something unrelated to it, other then to reinforce the culture of fear created.
Come on now - a terrorist attack? I really think that any reporter or journalist that's gotten to the point of asking if terrorists are involved every time something goes wrong should be fired, or at least whacked with a Clue Stick and put on probation or something.
"Huh. This turkey sandwich I got from the commissary is a little dry today..."
"Really? Do you think it could be some kind of terrorist attack on Lunchtime?!"
Absurd.
If anyone actually did something to kill the satellite, there is a list of countries that I would suspect long before looking at terrorists. Countries like China, Russia, etc., have greater reason, not to mention resources, to damage an orbiting satellite.
Why is always terrorists that are the culprits when something goes wrong? The nations that used espionage before the "War On Terror" are still there, and still have vested interest in denying the US the ability to spy on them.
does anybody else feel that the mention of terrorists in this article is just absofuckinglutely retarded? that anyone, for even an instant, seriously entertained the notion that any terrorist group has both the capacity and wherewithal to take out something in LEO, UNDETECTED, is beyond idiotic.
we must be living in the bizarro universe.
my pet machine
Anyone remember the pioneering days when real men (and women) weren't afraid to light a giant roman candle under their posteriors? Back in those days, we would have retasked a spaceflight, go and check the sat out, and get it running again. What I woudln't give for that space capability again. ;)
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
This is what happens when you outsource your communications to EDS and NMCI "What do you mean by 'I forgot to turn it on...'!?!"
I'd be hard pressed to call it "terrorism" in either case. Most definitions of "terrorism" that I'm aware of describe attacks against civilian rather than military targets, whose goal is to cause more harm than the actual physical damage by provoking fear.
In this case it could conceivably be that a terrorist organization also sabotaged a military target, but that would not be an act of terrorism in and of itself. That's more like conventional espionage. The military knows that it is a target and is capable of responding, and so it's generally considered a valid target. The world gives a kind of grudging acceptance of your right to do it.
The third general requirement of terrorism, as compared to a valid military attack, is that the enemy hides itself. If the US takes out somebody's spy satellite, you know where the US is if you want to engage in a military response. Al Qaeda doesn't have such a place. This isn't just a playing semantics; it goes back to the civilian/military distinction. When a true terrorist organization attacks the US, civilians nominally on their own side die when the US counterattacks. By contrast, to attack the US there are valid targets.
(This gets a bit murky in espionage, where you do hide among the civilians, and that's the closest the US comes to true terrorism, at least for its avowed activities. We can discuss the various covert CIA activities later, but there's so much misinformation that it's hard to know what's real and what's paranoia.)
Terrorism comes much closer to Clausewitz's "total war". Why should any opponent restrict itself to "valid" military targets and make itself known to counterattacks? No reason, except that the end of "total war" is always the complete destruction of one side: if you engage in it you're putting lives at risk out of proportion to your goals. That will earn the world's opprobrium, and perhaps that opprobrium will increase the chance of your defeat, but beyond that it's your choice.
I agree.
Terrorists = those who attack on civilians to induce terror (presumably to induce civilians some kind of change driven by the civilians).
Resistance, Insurgents, Freedom fighters = those who attack military and government units (not 5 year olds).
Nihilists = those who attack civilians really just because they like death and destruction and not because they have any particular goal of any kind in mind.
"Total War" is not really terrorism. You are not trying to induce a civilian population attitude change- you have decided to kill everyone on the other side.
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
The military knows that it is a target and is capable of responding, and so it's generally considered a valid target. The world gives a kind of grudging acceptance of your right to do it.
Tell it to the people talking about the U.S.S. Cole.
Terrorism comes much closer to Clausewitz's "total war".
Beware of leaving your opponant without options.
KFG
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Building, launching and fly a spacecraft is complex and difficult. But ever since the mid 1990's the industry thinks that cutting costs (which inevitably means cutting late life cycle costs such as operations) can be overcome with automation and hand-waving. The launch vehicle gets the spacecraft off the ground, but then some silly operations error or engineering flaw not uncovered by operations results in a catastrophic failure (e.g. JPL/Mars English vs. Metric debacle). Back in the day - agencies fully funded operations personnel that shook out both procedural and engineering defects ahead of time. Just because an agency doesn't/can't pay for the same level of effort in today's fiscal environment does not mean that these types of defects magically disappear.
It used to be said that of "Better, faster, cheaper," you could only have two out of three. As time goes on, I wonder if these expectations are too high.
Space missions have cost overruns for sure, but in my experience those overruns come from unrealistically low bids from major vendors and the fact that these dinosaur companies build spacecraft in pretty much the same way as they always have. They used to run of of money about a year before launch and they still run out of money a year before launch. IMHO, the only way to reduce the frequency of catatrophic failure is for early life cycle vendors to becore more efficient so there are funds for operations to shake out the bugs before it gets up on orbit.
What kind of bullshit fear-mongering is this? There was no suggestion that it was caused by Martian attack or canabalism in the British Navy either. Why not mention that?
Lee conquering the south?
I know that most US schools aren't big on teaching history any more unless it can somehow be related to a teacher's pet cause, but hopefully your comment is just a typo and you really meant something like Sherman's march to the sea.
Just in case it isn't clear, Lee led the Southern Armies in the Civil War, he didn't conquer the South.
The party of stupid and the party of evil get together and do something both stupid and evil, then call it bipartisan.
First of all, it is My Lai. Second, the massacre was in 1968. Third, the massacre was not done in a an attack on the village, it was done AFTER an initial attack on the village, where the US soldiers had full control of it.
Check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_massacre for more details.
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Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
Reading the comments posted above is chilling. Generally, people don't even begin to understand the issues.
Weapons and spy contracts can be mostly secret. In practice, that means there will be less supervision and much more opportunity to make and sell junk at very high profit. It is very common that an entire project is so poorly designed that it is useless; however, the politics is such that the failures are kept secret. The U.S. government has been corrupted by secrecy and dishonesty.
Here is my summary of U.S. government corruption: George W. Bush comedy and tragedy. I hope you will write your own summary and send it to friends and government leaders.
Why does this even mention terrorism? Go back and read that again. "There was no suggestion by either of the sources that the satellite had been purposely damaged as part of a terrorist attack." Duh. Last time I checked, spy satellites were not exactly high-profile ordeals, making them less-than-desirable targets for any kind of terrorist. So then WHY include that sentence? Power of suggestion? Keep terrorism in our collective consciousness? Why is it there?
Well, I doubt if NRO launches anything-- they probably sign a check to Martin-Marietta, who coordinates things and rents a pad at Vandenberg.
>and is worth hundreds of millions of dollars.
Well, it probably cost hundreds of millions of $. What it's worth, especially in the light of it being unusable, is debatable. Back when CMOS sensor arrays were custom made for $70,000 each the technology was gee-whizzy. Nowdays your basic disposable camera isnt that far behind what's in the current sats.
>It has apparently hung in a low orbit for months now.
"Hung"? as in hanging from something? Or hung as in "windows hung on me"?
>and efforts to communicate with it have been unsuccessful. The official said the problems were substantial and involved multiple systems.
So it probably had several radio links and none of them seem to be working. That's bad. There's usually at least one last-ditch fail-safe really simple telemetry and command link that doesnt depend on the main power source or antenna aiming. If they can't talk to that thingy, things are mighty grim.
>adding that U.S. officials
"Officials"? More likely a bunch of hairy and now sweaty peons.
>Were working to reestablish contact with the satellite because of the importance of the new technology it was meant to test and demonstrate.
So they wouldnt bother if it had old technology but cost $200 million?
>The other source said the satellite had been described to him as 'a comprehensive failure.'
Well, if you can't talk to it, that's pretty comprehensive.
heh the very idea that terrorists could possibly do something to a satellite after launch makes me laugh. i mean did it go like this?
Osama - "OK Zawawhatshisname, show me this big plan you have for taking out the satellites of the great satan?"
ZAWA - "ok, basically we strap a bomb to young Uday here..."
Osama - "ok, not bad so far, pretty standard, then what?"
Zawa - "then we have this big slingshot and...."
Osama - "whoa whoa waitasec.... are you serious??"
Zawa - "yeh, well he gets in then we tie the camels to the basket and..."
Osama - "what somebody cracks the whip and pulls a string c'mon man!! Is this what I pay you for?!?!"
Zawa - "well, I..."
Osama - "You're fired..."
Zawa - "but..."
Osama - "dude, just...leave...ok?!"
nah...my spidey sense tell me it was a launch damage f-up or micrometeorite, something normal like that. maybe even a bug, a software glitch like the poor MGS or polar lander (inches, meters, what being difference?!?!? haha!!)
sometimes, i wonder if i'm the only conservative on teh intarweb. ah well, back to mah hogs and warmongerin'....
Well, it is not only the former vietcong that regards 'vietnam' as a major defeat for the US, and thus a bloody victory for Vietnam, the whole world (minus the US-minority) does so. As for understanding for attacks on civilians: none is ever justified. Not then in Vietnam, not now in Iraq. Killing people is always wrong, but killing innocents is even worse. What part of 'thou shalt not kill' do you not understand?
This space is intentionally staring blankly at you
I just wanted to let everyone know that my left butt cheek is fine. Any damage that it may have sustained is not related to any terrorist attack or plot. We must be ever vigilant though, less the terrorist forces do manage to injure my left butt cheek.
This has been a public service reminder. Remember, be afraid of terrorist, you need us, we keep you safe, you have nothing to fear from an oppressive government unless you are an enemy of the government.
-Rick
"Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
Not working. Sure. I believe that. It's up there and it's, ahem, NOT WORKING. See, we can't really see that there's a pot plant growing in the backyard of the house that's 3 from the corner of Halsted and Magnolia. And we can't see that brunette sunbathing nude at Latitude 39.518 Longitude -71.426.
Right. The old "tell them it doesn't really work" routine. Gotta give those spooks credit for creativity on this one.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Wait a minute! You tricked me! Those coordinates are about 120 miles off the coast of New Jersey in the middle of the atlantic!
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