Florida to Scrap Touch Screen Voting?

AlHunt writes "Florida Governor Charlie Crist is calling on the Florida Legislature to spend $30M to replace the troublesome touch screen voting machines with an optical scan system that allows a voter to mark an oval next to a candidate's name before slipping a ballot into an electronic reader."

Comments

Will they ask ES&S for a refund?

[symbolic]

I think one is certainly due - faulty, unreliable equipment that failed to deliver as promised.

Re:Will they ask ES&S for a refund?

[Anonymous Coward]

"I think one is certainly due - faulty, unreliable equipment that failed to deliver as promised."

You say this as if it were uncommon for a government contract.

+1 Sad.

Re:Will they ask ES&S for a refund?

[Intron]

• What about power outages?
  
• What about machine breakdowns or corrupted data?
  
• What about aligning the display with the touch input?
  
• What about making sure totals aren't added twice?
  
• What about making sure totals aren't skipped?
  
• What about preventing people from voting twice?
  

Anyway, it's about time we got rid of the fiction of "one person, one vote". Just put the candidates on eBay and let people bid on them. Give every voter a certain amount of toy money to select the candidates they want. They can either put $10 on every candidate they like, or put it all on the presidential candidate, or split it any way they want. When the auctions close, the highest bid candidate in each race wins. This makes the most sense in a capitalist, market-driven society like the US.

Re:Will they ask ES&S for a refund?

[plover]

The difficulty is not in the machines, but in the very idea of the machines. It's all about the concept of "trust". Sure, the machines have some code just to paint a couple of boxes marked "John Jackson" and "Jack Johnson", and some more code to count button clicks. But how do you, the voter, know what happened in the mind of the machine? What assurance do you have that when you clicked "John Jackson" that the accumulators for Jack Johnson weren't accidentally or deliberately incremented? You have none.

The short answer is that without the machine producing a physical token (usually in the form of a printed receipt) representing your vote, you don't know. More importantly, you can't know. Any screen you can see assuring you that the machine is perfect can be faked. Promises that the code is perfect are based on inspections and testing, not mathematical proofs. Even if they were, how would you know that they weren't being faked? A bad guy could always replace the program with one of his own that paints a copy of the official "Seal of Assurance" screen.

There are some difficult-for-the-common-man-to-understand signature schemes that could offer more confidence that the program is honestly the one that is supposed to be present, but none of those are in place; even if they were, they can only provide assurance that the program is the one that was signed. They do not offer proof that the code actually works properly.

As I said, physical tokens are the only way to ensure the machines are working accurately. After the election, you count tokens and compare them to the accumulators. But if you have to go as far as producing and counting tokens, why not simply vote by token instead? It's worked for thousands of years, it's as cheap as a pencil and paper, and everybody capable of voting can understand it. You can even count the tokens by machine if you're in a hurry, as long as you can count them manually to prove the machines are honest.

There's a reason Americans vote in November but the politicians don't take office until January. It's to give time to count the votes and certify the elections. Nothing in our laws requires the T.V. news to inform us of the election results within 15 minutes of the polls closing. That's a fabrication that sprung up recently, and has nothing to do with democracy.

Why not best of both worlds?

[davidwr]

Remember the old punch-card machines coders used 30 years ago?
You could punch them out with a punching machine or with a single-hole punch, it didn't matter.

Do the same with ballots:

Let people fill in an optical scan ballot by hand OR give them a touch screen that will mark the ballot for them.

You get all the advantages of the touch-screen, including multiple languages, different ballots in the same polling place, accessibility for the blind and disabled, and more and you keep the advantages of optical-scan ballots, including a voter-verified paper ballot and a way to vote if the electricity goes out.

Electronic voting for a better democracy

[vivian]

If it can be made to work reliably and securely, electronic voting is by far the best way to go as it offers the possibility of having a much more direct democracy instead of democracy-by-proxy as we have now.

Consider this. You only get one vote every few years, which is then supposed to show your support for every decision your elected representative makes. It would be much better if you could vote on all the major issues, such as major bills, decisions to start wars, etc. With a physical based voting system though, it would be all but impossible to do this as the amount of effort to collect votes is enormous - hence we have political representatives we vote for who act as proxies for our wishes, and hopefully make decisions that the majority of the people would wish for. As we all know, this is often not the case. (eg. Copyright extention)

Now that nearly everyone has a computer (in developed countries) or has easy access to one via internet cafe's, libraries, etc. then imagine what it would be like if you could directly vote (via te internet) on bills such as say, the patriot act or extending copyright, instead of having to depend on some guy to make that vote for you? Apart from anything else, it would take a lot of the current power away from special interest lobby groups (read:big business), as they would have to convince a large slice of the population on how to vote, instead of a small group of senators etc. You would still need a body of lawmakers to put forward bills and propositions, but the general public would have much greater control over the acceptance or rejection of those bills.

The challenge of course would be:
1) ensuring everyone only got one vote, (say, through the use of a hardware keygen or something) and
2) your votes remain anonymous. I don't personally believe this is as valuable as being able to vote on every bill, and would happily sacrifice a little theoretical anonymity for a more direct democracy.

I'm with GodinHell

[chocolatetrumpet]

The counting of votes must be observed by humans. Since people can't see electrons moving, no electronic vote counting should ever take place.

I'm willing to wait for election results. Isn't that a worthwhile price for democracy?