Slashdot Mirror


Some European Moves Towards Linux

Readers VE3OGG and FFFFHALTFFFF write in with three pieces of a global picture that is emerging of governments and corporations moving away from Microsoft and towards open source. First, France: the French automaker Peugot Citroen has announced that over the next several years they will be integrating up to 20,000 Novell SUSE desktops as well as 2,500 SUSE servers into their facilities. (Let's hope that, in Novell, Peugeot Citroen hasn't bought a lemon.) Next, Sweden: the Swedish Armed Forces has made a decision to migrate its Windows NT servers to Red Hat Enterprise Linux. Finally, Russia. VE3OGG writes: "It would seem that after the recent Russian piracy debacle that could see a school headmaster jailed in a Siberian work camp for purchasing pirated copies of Windows for his school, the Ministry of Education in Russia has decided that the school boards will no longer be purchasing any commercial software."

10 of 181 comments (clear)

  1. A good move by linuxci · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Let's just hope the Russians don't decide to accept a deal from Microsoft for cheap software, ultimately if they do that they're just setting themselves up for future problems down the line. When funds are tight it is very useful to be able to have software where it's legal and encouraged to copy it. The amount of piracy that goes on with Microsoft products just shows how much that people consider Windows the only option, once they have other choices then more people are going to go for free and legal over free and illegal.

    Back when I was a student Linux was a great way to free and easily get all the tools needed to learn Perl and C. The documentation on the internet provided most you'd need but I still bought a few O'Reilly books for reference, I learned a lot more using Linux in the 90's and using Linux gave me the skills to get a better paid job when I left university, people coming out with only Windows skills do not get the same salaries.

    Some people say that teaching Linux in schools is a bad thing as the commerical world is all Microsoft on the desktop. That's total rubbish too, people should not be taught 'Word' they should be taught general word processing skills and preferably be exposed to a few alternative apps so they don't think there's only one way to do it. Versions of Microsoft applications change the UI between versions so even if they do end up working at a Microsoft shop they'll adapt better to the changing UI's between versions. Also a better all round education will open up alternatives to businesses, if the staff are better trained then switching to alternatives will be easier, it can save the economy a fortune in the future.

    1. Re:A good move by beerdini · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Some people say that teaching Linux in schools is a bad thing as the commerical world is all Microsoft on the desktop. That's total rubbish too, people should not be taught 'Word' they should be taught general word processing skills and preferably be exposed to a few alternative apps so they don't think there's only one way to do it. I used to work at a school where I fought furiously for Linux only to have the IT manager say it is the job of the school to prepare students for the real world, and Word(Microsoft) not Linux is what the real world uses. Also there was no way anything was going to use Linux.

      In the mean time she was trying to cut costs, so got a new Linux server, and ran out to buy a MacBook because it was pretty. With leadership like that can anyone figure out why I left?
    2. Re:A good move by danpsmith · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Some people say that teaching Linux in schools is a bad thing as the commerical world is all Microsoft on the desktop. That's total rubbish too, people should not be taught 'Word' they should be taught general word processing skills and preferably be exposed to a few alternative apps so they don't think there's only one way to do it. Versions of Microsoft applications change the UI between versions so even if they do end up working at a Microsoft shop they'll adapt better to the changing UI's between versions. Also a better all round education will open up alternatives to businesses, if the staff are better trained then switching to alternatives will be easier, it can save the economy a fortune in the future.

      I honestly think this is a very good point. The fact of the matter is that the way we instruct computers now is fundamentally flawed. Instead of teaching conceptually how to perform operations with a computer, teachers often instruct students to double-click there and click there, hit F3 and whatever. Computer education should be about education of concept. The ability to adapt from one interface to another is the important ability, not the ability to go through a set of instructions. I had often been worried that if I didn't run Windows I would fall behind in the interface and not be of much use in tech support. The opposite is really true. The more you learn different ways to use different interfaces the more commonality you ultimately see, the better you understand the concepts and the better able you are to diagnose and solve problems of any nature, on any OS.

      It's probably harder to teach concepts than it is to teach point here and click that, but I believe it's essential for computer education. Kids nowadays are already getting interface education free of charge, as most cell phones have different interfaces from one another and portable devices tend to differ in interface as well. The fact that not everyone owns one type of portable and one type of cell phone or camera gives them a chance to explore doing the same tasks with different "menu options" meaning the same thing. The older folks who aren't used to using interfaces are quickly finding themselves behind the ball.

      Fortunately, I'm young enough to keep up. If you have a general idea how certain devices *should* work and options they *should* have, you can often diagnose problems with the more sophisticated printing equipment, applications, just about any OS or portable device. People need to learn the concepts of how things work instead of just finding a windows keyboard shortcut to launch the control panel.

      --
      Judges and senates have been bought for gold; Esteem and love were never to be sold.
  2. backfired by DaMattster · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It would seem that Microsoft's campaign against the poor, Russian school teacher backfired miserably. Microsoft has now incurred the wrath of the Russian government and has just locked itself out of a market. That's a real smooth way to do business and has just opened the flood gates for open source software. Bill Gates' tacit denial of Gorbachev's appeal shows an utter lack of foresight and has caused an ultimate loss for Microsoft. And all of this occurred because Bill wanted to make an example of a poor, Russian school teacher whom was using Windows, not for commercial gain, but for education. If Microsoft were wise, they would have provided free, genuine copies because this teacher is educating future Microsoft consumers. Instead, they caused alienation, and, as anyone can tell you, alienation is a bad thing. So now, Red Hat has the chance to build loyal users. Go Red Hat!

  3. We've seen this before by UnknowingFool · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Clearly MS hasn't learned its lesson yet. While I don't begrudge MS for trying to protect their copyrights against piracy, they do need to learn about subtlety. Does Ernie Ball come to mind? Ernie Ball had more copies than licenses; they didn't keep up with the licensing like they should have, and they admitted it. They were a good MS customer and would have preferred to work with MS on any licenses problems. But raiding their offices with armed federal marshalls? Now, they're a Linux shop. MS lost a good customer and got bad PR. All for 70 something licenses that Ernie Ball would have glady paid for had it had the chance.

    --
    Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  4. Re:Threatening to use Open Source is Negotiating P by a_n_d_e_r_s · · Score: 4, Interesting

    In Sweden one university was thinking of switching to Linux - a couple of days later it got a sweet deal from Microsoft.

    According to rumours they got a 90% rebate on the normal licensing fee for software.

    --
    Just saying it like it are.
  5. Re: Teacher sent to jail for buying Windows by shadowspar · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "It would seem that after the recent Russian debacle that could see a school headmaster jailed in a Siberian work camp for purchasing copies of Windows for his school, the Ministry of Education in Russia has decided that the school boards will no longer be purchasing any commercial software."

    Excellent! This is exactly the kind of strong government action we need to see more of. Obviously the Russian government sees quite clearly that Windows' DRM, lack of security, and general brokenness presents both an economic and security threat to the state, and is willing to take a stand to prevent this cancer from spreading any further. I think anybody who voluntarily buys a copy of Windows deserves to spend time behind bars, and now it's time for Western governments to step up to the plate and make this a reality.

    --

    There is a spellbook here; eat it? [ynq]

  6. Re:Threatening to use Open Source is Negotiating P by SgtChaireBourne · · Score: 2, Interesting

    From 2004 : " Uppsala universitet betalar mindre än en tiondel av ordinarie pris för Office. " , which translate to English as "The University of Uppsala pays less than a tenth of the ordinary price for {MS} Office"

    Word on the street was that UU was going to go completely FOSS, or at least completely non-MS, on its workstations. Many other institutions were heading that way until 2000-2002. Turku was a notable case, but there were quite a few others that weren't able to move even that far before MSofters flew in and thus didn't get as much press.

    Other bad decisions were made around that time, too: People got sold a lot of junkj hardware, too: gross income deduction in exchange for last year's hardware, at this years full retail prices, delivered 6 to 12 months from now. That gross income reduction cuts rather deeply into the pensions, given the new pension system.

    It would be useful, though nearly impossible, to find out all the places that have been trying to dump M$ junk since 1998, but have been threatened with raids, or threatened with audits, or given 95%+ discounts in order to keep or extend the lock-in. As you can see it's been part of the business model for a long time. The BSA/FAST raids seem not just about licensing but about even getting rid of non-MS commercial software.

    --
    Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
  7. If it's mainstream it's ok ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting
    What people teach in MBA's is that if a certain business practice is "mainstream" you won't be able to distinguish yourself either positively or negatively by adhering to it. In other words, being unfriendly towards customers (after sales) won't net you any competitive disadvantage.


    It's a widely spread misundertanding that you need to be special to your customer. Please understand that you only care about *marketshare* and about *margins*. Not about "the customer". If you work in a business where customers have names and faces, then _yes_ ... your *treatment* of the customer is important. In mass markets (which MS operates in) the impact of the customer relationship is much more diffuse and much less important. Sorry but there it is. If there is one thing they teach you at MBA schools, it is to get your priorities straight ...


    And unless you really need to grow "organically" there is no percentage in offering better terms than the competition other then where it doesn't cost you much and costs are directly controllable ... e.g. as in product features, product image (*not* "vendor image" but just product image) etc. If you need to grow, it's generally quicker and safer to buy marketshare than to grow it.


    The point is that MS already *has* the marketshare, they're just not getting the sales. So if you do revenue projections, your spreadsheet will contain a large number of people who run an illegal copy of Windows. Multiplied by list price this shows enormous potential sales ... so company policy will be to go after unlicensed Windows.


    So err ... sorry to disappoint you, but in the market MS operates in their policies aren't stupid at all.

  8. Re:Threatening to use Open Source is Negotiating P by mattcasters · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It made me wonder about the profit margin Microsoft has on this software.
    I know that in general the price of retail software is as virtual as you can possibly imagine it, but still.
    The real question then is: if all their software would be sold at 90% discount, would Microsoft still have a profitable software business?

    I'm sure that the answer to that is still a wholeheartly "Yes!".

    --
    News about the Kettle Open Source project: on my blog