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Google a "Wake-Up Call" For Microsoft

wooha points out coverage of a talk Microsoft's chief software architect, Ray Ozzie, gave at a Goldman Sachs conference in Las Vegas. Ozzie said that watching Google rake in advertising revenue was a wake-up call within Microsoft. He said Microsoft plans to do more than simply follow Google's lead by creating Web-based versions of desktop programs or duplicating its search and advertising model. (Despite Microsoft's massive investment in promoting and improving Web-based search, the company still has less than 10% of search engine market share, compared to Google's ~50% and growing.) Ozzie, who has only made a few appearances since his promotion last June to replace Bill Gates as CSA, told analysts and investors that he has been laying the groundwork for programmers across the company to build Internet-based software.

25 of 173 comments (clear)

  1. Moo by Apocalypse111 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And thus, Microsoft continues its grand tradition of being late to the scene, introducing technologies we've been seeing for years in a new and annoying format, and generally maintaining the status quo in the fashion to which we have become accustomed. Mediocrity, ho!

    --
    There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
    1. Re:Moo by tha_mink · · Score: 4, Funny

      And thus, Microsoft continues its grand tradition of being late to the scene, introducing technologies we've been seeing for years in a new and annoying format, and generally maintaining the status quo in the fashion to which we have become accustomed. Mediocrity, ho! But what about the "ribbon". Surely you find that a new technology. There's NO WAY anyone could consider THAT an annoying format.
      --
      You'll have that sometimes...
    2. Re:Moo by mikeisme77 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Google has never claimed that Google Docs was an office replacement--they've always said it was meant to supplement traditional productivity suites. The main advantage of Google Docs (if you've ever used it) is the ability to easily collaborate with other writers of a document that are miles away. Yes, you can do the same thing with a wiki; however, many wikis lock users from editing a document if one user is already editing it--Google Docs doesn't (although if two users are editing the same section of a document, it will warn a user that their changes will be discarded and pop up a Window displaying the changes so they can be copied and re-added). Google Docs, unlike a wiki, also allows easier, more intuitive formatting that will stick when you export it to a traditional productivity suite (wikis don't allow you to export--you must copy and paste into the productivity suite). Plus, not all users need a full featured productivity suite and for those who don't, Google Docs serves as a great alternative solution. I also greatly enjoy the ability to have access to my document no matter where I am as long as I have access to the Internet--yes I can do the same thing with a flash drive, but I really do find Google Docs to be the more convenient solution.

    3. Re:Moo by thrillseeker · · Score: 4, Funny

      But what about the "ribbon". Surely you find that a new technology. There's NO WAY anyone could consider THAT an annoying format.

      Let me see what the Bob thinks ...

    4. Re:Moo by RyoShin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's what I thought when I read the synopsis. Microsoft isn't waking up, it's just working harder to play catch up.

      On another forum I go to, someone has as their signature (roughly) "IE7- a 7th generation browser in a world of 8th gen browsers", and it's true. Microsoft didn't include tabs in their browser until FireFox and Opera had already been doing it for a while.

      As Linux becomes a more viable OS, especially if Google's new apps take off, Microsoft is going to find itself more and more strained as it offers less and less innovation and improvements- the leap from Win98 to Win2K was quite a large one, the leap from 2K to XP less, and XP to Vista even less than that.

    5. Re:Moo by BrokenHalo · · Score: 3, Funny

      The only success they've had seling to consumers is the XBox.

      You're forgetting the Zune, of course. The brown one. :-P

    6. Re:Moo by Pollardito · · Score: 5, Funny

      You are forgetting the biggest innovations of Microsoft - Clippy, and UAC! it seems like you are [trying to make a joke on Slashdot], would you like to start with one of the [Slashdot Joke Templates]?

      1. "in Soviet Russia..."
      2. "...you ignorant clod!"
      3. "Natalie Portman & hot grits"
      4. "We welcome our overlords"

      -Clippy
    7. Re:Moo by joshetc · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I've used all 3 major engines (Yahoo!, MSN, and Google) several times. Here is what I found:

      Yahoo -> tons of annoying ads
      MSN -> tons of annoying ads
      Google -> a few text based ads

      To me it really doesn't even matter who has the "better" search engine.

    8. Re:Moo by hey! · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Why should this be surprising?

      The key is that consumer != user.

      When your IT department won't buy you the laptop you want, it's because the consumer is them and the user is you, and in this case you have different interests.

      I was working professionally in IT in the era 1983 - 1995, the rise of Microsoft, and this was a very common scenario: senior managers got Macintoshes, everyone else got PCs. The reason was that senior managers had enough clout to steer the acquisitions. The argument that the incremental value of equipping two users with PCs was greater than the incremental value of equipping one user with a easier to use system didn't cut it when you were talking to the boss.

      With the exception of the people in accounting, nearly everybody who saw both systems side by side, and was not already a user of one or the other platform, nearly everybody was more attracted to the Mac. We even had TCO data showing that Macs were cheaper. But nobody wanted to admit that training was a cost, and nobody knew how to measure differences in productivity, so the equip two users with a PC vs. one with a Mac carried the day. I was there, and I saw it happen.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
  2. This is news? by DelawareBoy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Come on.. This really isn't news. Does anyone not believe Google is a wakeup call to Microsoft? And if Steve Balmer's Chair throwing is any indication, they were aware of it long before Ray Ozzie was promoted to CSA.

    1. Re:This is news? by Apocalypse111 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Cry Havoc, and let slip the chairs of war!

      --
      There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
    2. Re:This is news? by skoaldipper · · Score: 5, Interesting
      > Does anyone not believe Google is a wakeup call to Microsoft?

      Yahoo is the only search engine that appears to be holding Google off.
      Does anyone not believe Yahoo is a wakeup call to Google? Why have all others declined while yahoo's cleats are so firmly entrenched at the 3 yard line? That should at least give google inc some pause for concern. I say the reason is in small part because yahoo mail is so popular - driving so many users to their other services in part from clickity click convenience alone. Personally, I still find myself using yahoo mail exclusively over gmail. That thing ever gonna move from beta?
      --
      I hope, when they die, cartoon characters have to answer for their sins.
  3. Waking Dream? by griffjon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Microsoft didn't "wake up" to the right set of ideas - it's not google's services that are beating Microsoft into the ground, it's their general openness and interoperability. Microsoft can put Office online and create a search technology that can find a needle in a haystack not even linked by RFID tags to the tubes, but if they continue to play their embrace/extend/extinguish games instead of opening up, as an internal cultural change, what they produce will continue to be hindered by this proprietary mindset.

    (It's not even like they have to jump ship into OSS - Google's technology by and large is closed source, they just play ball better)

    --
    Returned Peace Corps IT Volunteer
  4. Internet-based? by TWX · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ozzie, who has only made a few appearances since his promotion last June to replace Bill Gates as CSA, told analysts and investors that he has been laying the groundwork for programmers across the company to build Internet-based software.
    You mean, ActiveX-based software, right? It's not like these applications are going to really function on any platform other than Internet Explorer (and even then, probably 6.0 MINIMALLY) and Windows XP, and there will be no support for Linux, UNIX, OSX, Windows 2000, etc...

    Google offers a great opportunity for those who want to break themselves of the Microsoft habit. Cross-platform, functional on multiple OSes, web browsers, and with minimal requirements.
    --
    Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
  5. "Integrating" them into the OS. by khasim · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Remember, Microsoft still has their desktop monopoly. That gives them the edge is "integrating" new tech.

    Which is also why Microsoft cannot follow Google's lead on this. Microsoft's revenue is based upon the concept of:
    one user
    per physical box
    per licensed OS copy
    per licensed office suit copy.

    Microsoft will not do anything that could harm those revenue streams.

  6. Google is cherry picking MSFT's lunch by 140Mandak262Jamuna · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The most difficult market to take out of MSFT's grasp is the Office software, with legacy files, macros, APIs, integration with workflow etc. And since Office is tied to Windows OS, it allows MSFT to continually tweak the OS, foist upgrades in a never ending cycle. But another big cake in MSFT's plate is the license revenue from the Microsoft Exchange Server. It is not bulk priced, every email id created by the its corporate clients not MSFT, creates license revenue for MSFT. This is the market most easily wrenched from MSFT's grasp.

    A good browser is all the interface needed to deliver email. And not being tied to a machine but being available over the net is a useful thing. So the Google Calender and email can compete with MSFT. That is where is Google is making a move. The corporate email market is so big and is such a huge revenue generator, there is place for both Google and Exchange and Lotus Notes and may be yet another player. If Google corners anywhere between 20% to 33% of the corporate email market, it can outfox MSFT. If the next upgrade of Vista is not compatible with Gmail's corporate clients, they would even consider not upgrading. Already there is some reluctance in the marketplace to upgrade and people are getting upgrade-weary. If the OS upgrade forcing Office grade cycle gets broken, and if some corporations demand true interoperability instead of settling for MSFT compatibility, cracks will develop in MSFT's dominance. But it is all well into the future. Might take 5 years for this to happen.

    --
    sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
  7. Ads in Vista by moxsam · · Score: 4, Funny

    What's next is advertisements in Vista.

    1. Re:Ads in Vista by UnknowingFool · · Score: 3, Funny

      Microsoft would like to send you an ad. Cancel/Allow. [Cancel]
      Are you sure you want to cancel? Cancel/Allow. [Cancel]
      Microsoft has added you to the list of people who will receive ads.

      What the hell just happened?

      --
      Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
  8. Always too little too late by JoeCommodore · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As the story states Microsoft is after the advertising revenue, not really actually interested in providing the rich content that google strives for.

    There is where the difference lies, Microsoft does not see this or many of the other markets it shoves it's foot into as a "we can do this better because we care", it's more like "hey, there's someone making money on this, lets do it too!" and that's how they approach it. They make a shortlist of competitive features and try to cover those.. and little else. Then talk the talk of what people are saying about thier competition ("we're secure, you can share, we're open, we got what you are looking for. etc.")

    Microsoft hasn't been innovating for years, it's more like they play a continual game of catch-up.

    --
    "Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
    1. Re:Always too little too late by nuzak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      > Microsoft hasn't been innovating for years

      Microsoft Research innovates like crazy. It's just rare that anything ever escapes alive and in recognizable form from MSR.

      Hell, what has Linux innovated lately? Desktops on spinning cubes?

      --
      Done with slashdot, done with nerds, getting a life.
    2. Re:Always too little too late by notaprguy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I'm sorry but what "rich content" does Google provide? Google is the yellow pages so I guess if you consider advertising "rich content" then your statement is accuraet. If you think that Google isn't motivated by financial interests then you're a very scary type of pollyanna. Also, if I were the paranoid type (which I'm not) I'd be way more scared of Google than I am of Microsoft. Google knows who you are, what you do on the Internet, who you conduct transactions with, who you send email to (if you use Gmail) etc etc.

    3. Re:Always too little too late by WhiteWolf666 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well, as other posters have said, Linux is just an OS kernel, not a distribution; having said that, there is a great deal of innovation going on in the open source world.

      Linux:
      1. User-space file systems. FUSE. This stuff is neat. Linux supports a panoply of filesystems that Windows users can only dream of, and a lot of these are worlds and worlds ahead of Windows stuff. Take a look at FunionFS, and Wayback FS.
      2. Abstract, granular CPU and I/O prioritization and scheduling. Linux can be realtime in ways that NT can only dream of; which is impressive considering the scale of Linux.
      3. LinuxBIOS. Anyone stuck an NT kernel into Motherboard firmware? No? Why not?
      4. KVM. Linux kernel virtualization. Microsoft is talking about duplicating this for the NEXT version of NT.
      5. A fully relocatable kernel. New in 2.6.20
      6. How about a native IPv6 stack? Linux did it first.
      7. How about boot time switching between 64-bit and 32-bit, or ACPI and noACPI? How about probing/autoloading of modules on boot? How about all possible drivers being installed, all the time, even ATI and NVIDIA's closed-source drivers now, using the Novell KMP system?
      8. POSIX compliance (uncertified), AND Win32 compliance (uncertified). First OS to do this.
      9. Support/scaling for an unlimited number of processors?
      10. How about a flat memory model (4GB/4GB split), even on 32-bit?
      11. Don't forget about ALSA. Wanna change how your sound is mixed, in userspace? No problem. Wanna reroute your mid-rear-left speaker to your record slot? No problem. Want 3D sound in older applications? OpenAL is there for you (unlike DirectSound in Vista). Here's a list of ALSA plugins, all of which are utilized in userspace: http://alsa.opensrc.org/ALSA_plugins .
      12. Vast improvements in Kernel security all the time. Things like selinux, and AppArmor (AppArmor is really cool stuff) are worlds beyond UAC and group policy.

      And that's just the OSS Linux kernel. Wanna talk about other subsystems?
      CUPS versus Windows printing?
      1. Autodiscovery of local subnet printers? Not possible in Windows, even Vista.
      2. End to end Postscript printing, even on $15 crapprinters?
      3. Out of box support for IPP, CUPS, LPR, SMB, and other kind of printing system you can dream of.
      No matter how you slice, CUPS is worlds away from Windows printing. Never, ever have to deal with printer drivers as you move from network to network; this is a dream avaliable for years in the CUPS world.

      X? Xorg is a thing of beauty.
      1. Full network transparency (2D/3D). Not avaliable in Windows. Best of breed network performance using NX.
      2. A fully modular windowing system. Remove or add components at will. No Internet Explorer required.
      3. Extremely high performance, with decades of support for both 2D and 3D operations.
      4. The sky's the limit in terms of scalability. 1 monitor? 4 monitors? 64 monitors spread across 12 systems? No problemo.
      5. Xgl is the beginnings of a pure 3D windowing system with legacy support. Xegl is the future of this pure 3D windowing system, at performance levels that put Aero's hybrid 2D/3D setup to shame.
      6. Yes, spinning cubes. And a whole lot more eye candy. On a whole lot less hardware than Aero requires. Geforce 5200 mobile with 32 MB of RAM? No problem.

      GUIs?
      I don't know much about Gnome, as I'm a KDE guy, but:
      1. KIO-slaves. ftp:// ? of course. bzip2:// ? torrent:// ? fish:// (this one is amazing, directory browsing over plain SSH). beagled:// ? how about man:// or programs:// ? how about klik:// ? KIO-slaves are one of the coolest features in GUIs out there, hands down.
      2. Kparts. Click on a PDF url, and you get KPDF in your Konqueror window. Click on a DOC url, and you get Kword in your Window. Click on an RPM, and you get either YaST2 (for SuSE), or KPackage. And all of these are user configurable, of course, on a user-by-user basis. This is something that neither OS X or Windows have worked out correctly.

      --
      WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
  9. Re:But will they actually wake up? by sumdumass · · Score: 3, Informative

    Don't fall alseep just yet. Remeber that skit back in the 80's were microsoft was touting the web browers as a programs front end or GUI?

    I think they called them web apps back then too but the idea was you could use a web browser instead of all the other fascinating things microsoft had their hands on at the time. I think this lead into some of the IE security problems too. It is likley, This was a ploy to just lock in IE and create a need in 98 past what critics were aying. But they do have experience in this area in more then one way. (MSN games and such)

    So, to discount microsoft for being asleep at the switch when they did alot of this stuff in the late 80's could be disasterous. Outside the being on another computer part, Some might says they were farther along then Google and whoever else are right now.

  10. What the hell? by kimvette · · Score: 4, Informative

    Why is it that when Microsoft, dominating an entire industry, sees another company doing well in a quasi-related niche, feel compelled to enter and dominate that industry as well?

    I'm a capitalist through and through but I'm so fucking sick of Microsoft.

    I'm sick of hearing how secure Vista is, when their Vista security features are so annoying 99% of users will probably disable them.
    I'm sick of hearing how much of a vast improvement Vista is over XP, when OS X and KDE on x.org have been there/done that for ages now -- ESPECIALLY when the truly major "improvements" in Vista restricts' customers' Fair Use and Right of First Sale activities.

    Oh, and what about MSIE 7.0? Where are the improvements? It does not pass the acid test (even though every other browser on the planet worth mentioning passes now), designers still have to bend over backwards for modern techniques to render correctly in MSIE, and it breaks differently than MSIE6, so things are more interesting. On the plus side, at least they DID fix .png rendering, so I have to give them some credit there.

    I used to be a Microsoft fan, and I've hated practically everything they've done after Windows 2000, because I see it as predatory, self-serving, and providing FAR less value to the customer, all while prices are tripling and quadrupling for Windows. For what? restricted activities on the computer? Revocation of First Sale rights? Restriction of Fair Use?

    Sorry, I had to vent. This is not intended to be insightful, informative, or even interesting; it's merely a good opportunity to vent in a place where hopefully some Microsoft drone will read this and say "Hey, are we REALLY that bad? I guess we are alienating our customer base." In summary: Fuck Microsoft. There is no need for them to dominate advertising, and quite honestly, I rather they didn't even try, because if there is one thing Microsoft truly excels at, it's annoying and alienating customers.

    Posted using Firefox 2.0 on Linux.

    --
    The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
  11. Re:You know... by TraumaTrout · · Score: 3, Funny

    I have to see my proctologist next week. I hope he doesn't microsoft me up to his wrist.