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Microsoft Responds to DOT Ban on Vista, Office, IE

Posted by samzenpus on from the words-words-words dept.

roscoetoon writes "From the blog of Mary Jo Foley: What's Microsoft's response to the DOT's charges? A corporate spokeswoman sent this statement, via e-mail: (caution: microbrain double-speak ahead) ... "We respect the customer's decision. As with any of our other Federal customers, it's our job to help DOT maximize the value of its Enterprise Agreement through the adoption of our technology. We are engaged with large, strategic customers across government at every level, and are working closely with them on these products through their participation in our Technical Adoption Programs.""

16 of 218 comments (clear)

  1. Well... by 7of7 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Actually for anyone who's actually tried Vista and Office 2k7 it is clear that there are massive improvements in security, stability, and most importantly ease of use. I haven't shut down my Vista box since I installed it almost 2 months ago and it's still snappy even on a Pentium M with 1GB of RAM. What's more important is that the intuitive interface and time saving features such as searching and sorting significantly decrease the time spent mucking around with the OS and leave you to do your work. As such Vista would have a huge impact in increasing productivity not only through its stability but through the amount someone can get done with it relative to XP, its only real competition. Further, Office 2k7 has similar improvements which allow you to get more things done quicker. Instead of digging blindly through cascading menus the things you need most are there on the ribbon when you need them. The instant preview feature means less guesswork when applying formatting. There are scores of other usability improvements that in total allow me to save a significant amount of time. As a bonus it loads and runs much quicker than OO.o ever did on the same box in Ubuntu. Those are simple facts. Those people claiming Vista and Office 2k7 are somehow not ready for the big time are sadly mistaken and perhaps shouldn't be in charge of making decisions when their decisions will amount to their companies and governments missing the opportunity to dramatically increase their productivity.

    --
    *The most erroneous stories are those we think we know best - and therefore never scrutinize or question.*
    1. Re:Well... by anomalous+cohort · · Score: 4, Interesting

      anyone who's actually tried Vista and Office 2k7 it is clear that there are massive improvements in security, stability, and most importantly ease of use

      I, personally, believe that menus improve ease of use on a windowing application. Many menus appear to be either removed or cleverly hidden in Vista, IE7, and Office 2k7.

    2. Re:Well... by _merlin · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You're a troll, but I'll bite.

      Actually for anyone who's actually tried Vista and Office 2k7 it is clear that there are massive improvements in security, stability, and most importantly ease of use.

      Straight out ridiculous assertion. I use it because I have to for compatibility testing at work. It is anything but easier to use. MS had it right as close to right as they ever have with 2003 server. Now they've moved everything around for no good reason in Vista, so we have to re-learn everything. Some things are just silly now, including, but limited to:

      • Some menus drop down and some expand to the right, which is inconsistent. Also, the ones that expand to the right obscure the titles of other menus, making it harder to navigate.
      • Some menu bars are above toolbars and some are below. Irritating inconsistency.
      • Some explorer windows have no titles, so you can't tell what they are when they're minimised.
      • Control panels have been renamed for no good reason making them harder to find.
      • Many views have less empty space, making them look "busy" or "crowded" and harder to find things.
      • Supplied desktop pictures all cause eyestrain after extended use.

      I haven't shut down my Vista box since I installed it almost 2 months ago and it's still snappy even on a Pentium M with 1GB of RAM.

      People said the same things about XP. Anecdotes then are the same as anecdotes now. Just because it's been stable for you means nothing. You haven't said what you actually do with the machine.

      What's more important is that the intuitive interface and time saving features such as searching and sorting significantly decrease the time spent mucking around with the OS and leave you to do your work.

      Searching the start menu is only a huge time-saver in Vista because they've made it completely impractical to use with a mouse. Instead of thinking about improving the start menu, they crippled it and added a search box as compensation. See my previous comments about dubious UI "improvements".

      As such Vista would have a huge impact in increasing productivity not only through its stability but through the amount someone can get done with it relative to XP, its only real competition.

      See above for my comments on stability and usability. Also, Mac OS X, Linux, Solaris and to a lesser extent, AIX are all very real competition. At home I have no Windows PCs. All Mac and Sun, and I'm very happy with them. At work I have a Windows PC for compiling and testing. For everything else (including editing source code that's compiled on the PC), I have Macs.

      Further, Office 2k7 has similar improvements which allow you to get more things done quicker. Instead of digging blindly through cascading menus the things you need most are there on the ribbon when you need them. The instant preview feature means less guesswork when applying formatting. There are scores of other usability improvements that in total allow me to save a significant amount of time.

      I haven't used it enough to comment on this, but if it's anything like the "improvements" in Vista, it probably makes life harder.

      As a bonus it loads and runs much quicker than OO.o ever did on the same box in Ubuntu. Those are simple facts.

      You have a point there. OO.o is bloated and slow. Thing is, I never need most of office or OO.o - HTML and LaTeX/PDF are better for 90% of tasks. I do however use Visio a bit.

      Those people claiming Vista and Office 2k7 are somehow not ready for the big time are sadly mistaken and perhaps shouldn't be in charge of making decisions when their decisions will amount to their companies and governments missing the opportunity to dramatically increase their productivity.

      Another ridiculous asser

    3. Re:Well... by jeevesbond · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Was the labotomy painful?

      Perhaps you'd care to read an article on how Vista is less intuitive than previous versions? Perhaps a simple Google search would sway your opinion on Vista being slow? What about one of the countless articles on the net advising that Office 2007 has no added value, just a steep learning curve?

      No? Didn't think so.

      The reason, Mr Shill (and I hope you're getting paid for this), all these companies are refusing to upgrade is that all this won't actually give them any greater functionality, or improve their workflow (due to the learning curve). Especially when you take into consideration how much this software costs! Even considering the heavy discounts these organisations will doubtless get, Microsoft should not expect money for nothing.

      OpenOffice might be bloated, but at least it uses a file format that's open and supported by many other office suites. Unlike that binary bilge Microsoft keep peddling and trying to force through standards agencies. My hope is that the DOT realise that before they get labotomised and start speaking like Microsoft drones: 'in order to leverage interoperable cross-markets, we're standardising on Microsoft Bullshit Ultimate Shill Server Lazy-Wanking-Bastards Edition'.

      --
      I'm going to transform myself into a mighty hawk. Either that or I'll just go and work at Dixons, haven't decided yet.
    4. Re:Well... by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Implementing new software (and let's be blunt, new hardware) for critical applications without adequately testing it would be nuts. What's more, governments have these things called budgets, and the hardware demands of Vista likely mean busting it, for little in perceived benefit. I mean really here. What does Vista or Office 2007 offer that's so wonderful that a manager is going to blow his budget and risk the stability of his existing systems?

      Beyond that, this is not the wonderous positive message I'm getting from those who are heavily into MS. They're telling me there's no compelling reason to upgrade, and that the risks of incompatibilities with existing software is still very much real. As a general policy, most IT departments I know err on the side of caution, waiting at least until the first service pack before rolling out the upgrades. As well, where a substantial reinvestment in hardware (upgrades and replacement) is required, I can well imagine many managers are going to say no way. Let's not even talk about licensing costs.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    5. Re:Well... by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 4, Interesting

      As much as I dislike Microsoft- I dislike Slashdot's scummy moderating other times.

      This guy has as much right to express his opinion as anyone and it's shitty and cowardly to mod him down just because he's pro-microsoft.

      I personally am happy with OOO2.1 which finally loads my most complicated documents and I can see the day that I leave microsoft behind entirely approaching rapidly.

      I mean -- come on-- $1300 for full office- maybe $200 for the "discount"- with vendor lock-in by microsoft and a stated preference that they want to go to software as service in the future.

      Compared to ... $000 for the full OOO and $0 for the discounted version and it will continue to be free in the future. AND my bloody documents in OOO are about 1MB smaller on average than in Word 2003.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  2. Even Intel is waiting on Vista SP1 by Taelron · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Heck, even Intel, whom Microsoft laudes as a partner in embracing Vista has publicly stated that they, as a corporation, will not even install Vista on their computers until after SP1 is released... So now you have a technology partner publicly stating they wont be so quick to upgrade either... http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/03/07/intel_wati ng_to_go_vista/

    1. Re:Even Intel is waiting on Vista SP1 by rbanffy · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "It was hard to bite the bullet and give up my Windows standard theme. Now that I have though it makes OS X look like an afterthought."

      Are sure you ever used a Mac before?

      Well... I have. My main computer runs Linux and Gnome, but sitting next to it is an iMac running 10.4 and I can tell you every little bit of it transpires the attention Apple pays to detail. From the extreme elegance of Exposé and the graceful way it solves the ages-long problem of having too many windows - to the minimalism of the screen savers, everything is in the right place. It sure is not a computer for everyone, but for those who appreciate fine things, it's next to unbeatable.

      On the other hand, everything in Vista screams "me too!". They are so desperate to look cool that it makes me feel uncomfortable. I tried Vista up to the final version and each and every time I felt less productive than I am under XP, so, the Windows box here will continue running XP.

      Too bad X support under OSX is not stellar and there is no decent package manager that can take care of the whole system.

      --
      http://www.dieblinkenlights.com
  3. Remember DOT wants broken ie6 by oneeyedelf1 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Remember the reason the DOT doesn't want to upgrade is because it needs ie6 compatibility for its websites. So because ie7 is better towards standards they won't use it. And the reasons that Office and Vista are lumped in there is because they upgrade to ie7. Frankly I wish the websites were better so the DOT had the option of upgrading to a better version of windows, or even the possibility of changing to another operating system.

  4. DOT may already be paying for Vista by Animats · · Score: 5, Interesting

    ..it's our job to help DOT maximize the value of its Enterprise Agreement through the adoption of our technology.

    In other words, DOT is already paying for Vista, even if they're not using it. Remember how Microsoft enterprise-level "software assurance" works. You pay by the year, upgrade or not.

  5. Re:Really? by JohnnyGTO · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I think thats "May you live in interesting times."

    In a speech in Cape Town, South Africa, on June 7, 1966, Robert F. Kennedy said, "There is a Chinese curse which says, "May he live in interesting times." Like it or not, we live in interesting times..." Journalists picked up the phrase and it has become a commonplace.

    However, the popularity of this "Chinese curse" puzzles Chinese scholars, who have only heard it from Americans. If it is of Chinese origin, it has somehow escaped the literature, although it may be a paraphrase of a liberal translation from a Chinese source, and therefore unrecognizable when translated back to Chinese. It might be related to the Chinese proverb, "It's better to be a dog in a peaceful time than be a man in a chaotic period."

    Stephen DeLong, who has been researching this quotation for several years and details his quest on his own website, has traced the quotation back to a 1950 science fiction story: "U-Turn" by Duncan H. Munro, a pseudonym for Eric Frank Russell.

    --
    Si vis pacem, para bellum! For evil to succeed good men need only do nothing!
  6. "Microbrain double-speak"? by Tim+C · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Are we actively trying to appear childish now?

    The place for commentary is down here with us unwashed masses, in the comments, where it can be moderated and replied to properly. It's bad enough that the editors do it, can we at least avoid submitors doing it please?

    --
    It's official. Most of you are morons.
  7. Re:Dramatic improvements? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    No one in Government should be using those products yet as they haven't yet met Acquisition Requirements, namely Common Criteria.

  8. Getting rid of MS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting
    FYI: I work for a government agency that works closely with DOT.

    "We respect the customer's decision. As with any of our other Federal customers, it's our job to help DOT maximize the value of its Enterprise Agreement through the adoption of our technology. We are engaged with large, strategic customers across government at every level, and are working closely with them on these products through their participation in our Technical Adoption Programs."


    "We respect the customer's decision. ..."
    Bullshit! When we tried to switch from Windows to Linux MS lobbied Congress to prevent us from switching. We received a nasty-gram from Congress to cease and desist.

    As with any of our other Federal customers, it's our job to help DOT maximize the value of its Enterprise Agreement through the adoption of our technology.

    Read: If you won't buy our products, we'll grease the palms of Congress and make them force you to buy our products.

    We are engaged with large, strategic customers across government at every level, and are working closely with them on these products through their participation in our Technical Adoption Programs.

    Read: We have our heads so far up Congress's ass all we have to do is sneeze and our paid for representatives catch a cold.

    Am I bitter? Yes, I hate to see where Americans tax dollars go and how little they get from the waste I see on a daily basis.
  9. Re:Watch out by LaughingCoder · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Ugggh. Must preview. Must preview. I forgot the brackets on the above URL. Sorry.

    http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_dona tions/Bill_Gates.php

    --
    The more you regulate a company, the worse its products become.
  10. Re:Watch out by rajafarian · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "... it's our job to help DOT maximize the value of its Enterprise Agreement through the adoption of our technology..."

    "You forget, we already have your money."