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Why Dell Won't Offer Linux On Its PCs

derrida sends us to an article in the Guardian by Jack Schofield explaining why he believes Dell won't offer Linux on its PCs. In the end he suggests that those lobbying Dell for such a solution go out and put together a company and offer one themselves. Quoting: "The most obvious [problem] is deciding which version of Linux to offer. There are more than 100 distros, and everybody seems to want a different one — or the same one with a different desktop, or whatever. It costs Dell a small fortune to offer an operating system... so the lack of a standard is a real killer. The less obvious problem is the very high cost of Linux support, especially when selling cheap PCs to naive users who don't RTFM... and wouldn't understand a Linux manual if they tried. And there's so much of it! Saying 'Linux is just a kernel, so that's all we support' isn't going to work, but where in the great sprawling heap of GNU/Linux code do you draw the line?"

9 of 628 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Ignorance is just so wonderful to see in action by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    I support a bunch of Windows boxes, in addition to a bunch of OpenBSD machines.

    As far as Windows and daylight savings goes, XP/2003 boxes were all patched by standard patch-tuesday patches. For win2k it took me a grand total of 15 minutes to research it on MS's website, write (+ copy/paste) a few text files, and roll them out on the Active Directory Domain. Not really tough. There are lots of problems with Windows. Daylight savings time just wasn't a big one.

  2. Support by delirium+of+disorder · · Score: 3, Informative

    Dell couldn't manage to support GNU/Linux, but lets not forget that Dell doesn't really support Windows either. Sure it's impossible to explain to your average user that the Internet and their web browser are different things. This doesn't change if the browser is IE or Firefox or Konqueror. However, as a "geek" I regularly need to provide tech support to friends and family. I have a much easier time doing this once I have switched them over to Ubuntu from Windows. It's simply more user friendly and secure. If you are looking for a new PC, I would highly recommend system76, not any big OEM that functions as a division of Microsoft.

    --
    ------ Take away the right to say fuck and you take away the right to say fuck the government.
  3. Acer from Walmart by dattaway · · Score: 4, Informative

    Several months ago I bought a cheap laptop from Walmart. I found out from Acer's website they had a Linux cd distribution that I could download. What did this mean to me? Everything worked together, including wireless, sound, and accelerated video. Trying a different distribution, like Ubuntu worked without any hassles. Since then, I bought several other laptops from Walmart knowing they took time to make sure their laptops supported a free operating system. They have been the most trouble free units I have had the pleasure of giving my family. Its a shame Dell doesn't latch onto this idea.

    1. Re:Acer from Walmart by dattaway · · Score: 3, Informative

      The first pulldown box under system software, "Linux Software" is listed before "Windows Software" :)

      http://global.acer.com/support/download.htm

  4. Re:Ignorance is just so wonderful to see in action by arth1 · · Score: 3, Informative

    I'm a Unix/Linux guy myself, but I have to say that you miss the target entirely here if you think that daylight savings time patching is easier on Linux than on Windows.

    On Windows, patches came with the standard Tuesday updates, and all I had to do was accept installation. Ok, for boxes without outbound internet access, I actually had to copy the patches and install them manually, but that was pointy-clicky-done, with no hassle whatsoever.

    On my Linux boxes, I had to install (which for my Gentoo boxes means recompile) a new version of the timezone-data package (Arthur Olson time zones), then manually copy /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/New_York to /etc/localtime, then also manually copy a zoneinfo file to etc/localtime in the chroot jails for both named and dhcpd, and restart these daemons, as well as ntpd (time server).
    Then I had to repeat the whole procedure again, because a new version of timezone-data came out, because of bugs in the first one. Then I had to repeat the whole procedure YET again a third time cause the bugfix release wasn't complete. All in 2007.

    Then, on Sun boxes, I had to, in addition to a system update, also install a java runtime environment update, because of course java can't use the same timezone data as the system, but has to have its own embedded implementation. And with more than one jre per system, that meant one update per jre instance.

    I still prefer Linux and Unix, but it's not easier, and I bet many people forgot to update the zoneinfo files manually for chrooted daemons. Hopefully, most of them will only see odd logging timestamps. (Which in itself can be bad enough, if RIAA asks who used a DHCP IP address at a certain time between now and when the "old" DST kicked in.)

    Regards,
    --
    *Art

  5. Re:sell without operating system by Leto-II · · Score: 3, Informative

    Actually, FreeDOS doesn't come preinstalled. It comes on a CD and there is a paper that says, in a big bold font, the system can't boot until you install an operating system. This paper also says that Dell is giving you FreeDOS without any form of support whatsoever.

    --
    Do not anger the worm.
  6. The answer's pretty simple by gjuk · · Score: 4, Informative

    It matters because soon as a major PC manufacturer starts shipping machines without the Windows tax, we can finally get some real competition in the OS world (how ironic that if I want to try free Linux, I usually have to buy Windows - which comes with my PC - and I can't get a discount if I don't want Windows).
    Basically - Dell don't offer it because - and I have to be careful here- Dell get a volume discount on the Windows licenses they preinstall. If they start to offer Linux, they'll fall into a lower discount level on Windows and suddenly be uncompetitive in the crucial Windows market.
    My experience (in a slightly different sector) of such deals is that they always coincidentally have break points remarkably close to what happens when the reseller starts dealing with a competitor of the dominant vendor. Of course, MS cannot charge Dell more for Windows just because Dell happens to ship some Linux machines, but it can double the price of Windows if Dell falls below a certain sale volume - which they can vary any time they like.
    The solution? Manufacturers could [be forced to] [by France?] publish the embedded cost of software which ships with each machine so MS shenanigans could be spotted, but I'm sure plenty of fellow readers will point out the impracticality of that. The alternative is whistle blowers...

    1. Re:The answer's pretty simple by TechForensics · · Score: 5, Informative

      There is always a Windows tax, even on Linux PCs. M$ even used to charge PC manufacturers for Windows based on the number of PCs they SHIPPED, because "all of them would be running Windows eventually". Just try and find a Linux PC cheaper than a Windows PC with the same hardware specs.

      --
      Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.
    2. Re:The answer's pretty simple by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Informative
      Let's take your examples. From the Linspire site:
      • Linspire Balance notebook - not available when you click on the link, and a crappy Via 1GHz laptop with a whole 1.5 hours of battery time.
      • LinuxCertified Laptop - if this beast is still available, you get a $1400 P4 notebook from a vendor that hasn't updated the prices on their site since 2004.
      • Sub300 laptop - to call this obsolete would be an understatement. Another Via 1GHz machine, this one for over $800! You could get the crappiest Dell or even an old G4 iBook and out-perform this thing. Yes, it is light - as it should be since it has no optical drive.
      • "UK-based Tiny Computers offers Linspire Desktops" - yeah, until you click on the dead link! I went to their home page and could not find a Linux computer.
      • "The popular Walmart.com Linspire desktop!" - another dead link. However, you can search for Linspire at walmart.com and get a single match for a $348 Sempron 2.0GHz system. Out of 28 systems, that's it, and it's "online only". Bare system, no monitor.
      • "Powerful Northgate L-series sold at Staples.com. Just $499!" - bad link, and a search on Staples.com for "Linux" or "Linspire" comes up dry.
      • The IBM link is interesting, until you actually click on these VERY expensive systems to configure them and find out that they are the same price whether or not you order Windows.
      • The Dell link is even more interesting, as the same systems configured with Windows are actually CHEAPER!
      • The HP link, like the IBM link, points to workstations/servers in the rather expensive department. In any case, trying to click on the links to buy them gave me a network timeout.

      This isn't about demand or ideology. This is about shady business practices that, as a practical matter, guarantee that most people won't buy a pre-built PC without paying Microsoft. Do you really think that someone with a Windows2000 install disk from their last PC wouldn't have been perfectly happy to use that on their new PC if the new PC were $100 cheaper? This isn't demand for Windows - hang out in a Best Buy for a while and listen to what gets asked of the computer salesmen - people don't even know that Macs don't come with Windows. My wife can't even tell you when she is on a Windows vs. a Macintosh computer. I just helped a friend set up his Vista notebook, and he doesn't understand that it is not XP (though he does now after buying some incompatible peripherals and software).
      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.