Germany Rejects Microsoft FAT Patent

Askmum writes in with news that a German patent court has ruled Microsoft's patent on FAT invalid in that country, finding that it is "not based on inventive activity." Just one of 6,000-odd patents Microsoft has amassed since a 1991 memo from Bill Gates turned around the company's attitude to patents.

Comments

Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[stratjakt]

I don't fault MSFT for patenting everything they can. Apple does it, Google does it, everyone does it. Eolas does it.

The system is broken. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[Anonymous Coward]

The system is broken. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

We hate MS for many reasons. Just because we hate the patent system too, doesn't mean we cant enjoy a little chuckle when MS takes a much needed slap.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[stratjakt]

Yes, you hate MSFT for all the business practices you love from Apple or Google.

I know slashdot is a bunch of young'uns who personify corporations as either friend or foe.

I'm just pointing out that corporations are things, not beings, and they are a part of a system, and behave as they are supposed to within the system.

It's the system that was set up to allow robber barons to swindle stockholders, stifle innovation with patents, and clog our legal system with crap.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[mstahl]

While it may be best to think of corporations as things and not beings (I don't think it's healthy to think of them as best buddies or arch nemeses either), there really isn't much personification going on. They actually are (at least in the US) legally identical to individuals. That's in the sense that they can commit crimes and get sued or pay taxes.

It's probably a good thing that corporations can't get married.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[dreamchaser]

No, MS is executing it's legal obligations to maximize profit. It *is* the system that your ire should be directed at in this case. I notice you didn't make mention of Apple, etc. They *all* do it, and currently they have to.

Fix the patent system, and save your ire towards MS for things like illegally leveraging their monopoly power.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[kcbrown]

I'm just pointing out that corporations are things, not beings, and they are a part of a system, and behave as they are supposed to within the system.

Not really.

Corporations are supposed to act in the best interests of the society in which they function first and foremost. If that were not the case, then a corporate charter and business license wouldn't be required, now would it?

The problem is that most people have lost sight of that fact. In exchange for limited liability and effective immortality, corporations are supposed to act with restraint. And in a sane, balanced society, such restraint would be enforced by the revocation of corporate charters in the case of misconduct, just like it was done in the (relatively) distant past.

People like you have been brainwashed to believe that it's okay for corporations to act in evil ways (if intentionally harming others for personal gain isn't evil, then I don't know what is) because "they're responsible to their shareholders" or some such bullshit.

But it's not okay. It never has been. Such behaviour is very harmful, and many ills of the world exist because of it. You might say that it's the responsibility of the government to hold corporations accountable for their actions and you would be right about that. But that in no way excuses the behaviour of corporations. That someone might not have been punished for murder doesn't make the act any less wrong.

People like you need to wake up, and fast, because we're almost out of time. The U.S. is pretty much unrecoverable now but there's still time for the rest of the world. But if corporations aren't held to a much higher standard than we hold them to now, it won't be long before they rule the rest of the world the way they rule the U.S.

And trust me, that would be a bad thing for just about everyone. The experience with the British East India Company is one of the things that led to the founding of the United States, after all.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[mpe]

They actually are (at least in the US) legally identical to individuals. That's in the sense that they can commit crimes and get sued or pay taxes.

Except that corporations don't tend to have their freedoms constrained at the point they are charged with a crime. Not many real people can be "business as usual" whilst awaiting a trial, let alone only only have their lawyers attend the trial. Even if found guilty there is no corporate equivalent of a prison sentence. When it comes to criminal law corporations and individuals are treated (very) differently. Even if the same statute theoretically applies to both situations.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[Bozdune]

Yes, this is the classic Libertarian argument. The robber barons of the 19th and early 20th century wouldn't have amassed their monopolies had it not been for government regulations that allowed them to do so, blah blah blah.

Unfortunately for the Libertarians, laissez-faire capitalism is unstable. One company will emerge as the leader; and if it behaves rationally it will ruthlessly eliminate its opponents by out-competing them and out-spending them. Government is often an enabler in this process, but even if it wasn't there at all, the end result would still be the same -- monopoly.

Should AT&T have been broken up? No? Then are you interested in paying $30 for a long-distance call? Don't worry, it may still happen if the FCC continues to rule in favor of putting AT&T back together again, and in favor of locking everyone else out of the "last mile" wires.

The answer is not "less" government regulation, but "better" government regulation. Unfortunately, since government is corruptible, it tends to enable monopolists like Microsoft to persist until the abuses become so apparent that even a suitcase full of cash can't keep the politicians in office. Then, finally, they'll act -- but not before.

Re:Ya gotta fight fire with fire

[Ciggy]

Maybe, but whilst awaiting tral, a person is encarcerated in jail - with their freedoms of movement, action, normal everyday business, etc curtailed, unless bail is paid; whilst corporatons are awaiting trial are they incarcerated, unable to do normal everyday business, unless they post bail - do they even post bail?

Whoa!!!

[Bullfish]

You have to invent something to patent it! Say it ain't so! An awful lot of companies are going to go into panic over this! Why, it could threaten the entire patent holding industry!!

Re:Real land of chocolate

[Anonymous Coward]

Not Switzerland either. It's Belgium.

One way to look

[CSHARP123]

From the second article link - Emphasis mine

If people had understood how patents would be granted when most of today's ideas were invented, and had taken out patents, the industry would be at a complete standstill today. I feel certain that some large company will patent some obvious thing related to interface, object orientation, algorithm, application extension or other crucial technique. If we assume this company has no need of any of our patents then they have a 17-year right to take as much of our profits as they want. The solution to this is patent exchanges with large companies and patenting as much as we can.

Now that large company is MS and is trying to patent the obvious.

Re:"FAT" - who cares?

[Noryungi]

Whoa!

Not so fast! Off the top of my head, there is a lot of stuff that still uses FAT: SD-Card, USB sticks, most of the little thingie you stick into a cell phone, a digital camera, and use in embedded systems. Basically everything that can emulate (and does emulate) a floppy disk And what about real floppy disks themselves?

FAT has got a lot of problems, but it's convenient, simple to implement, and relatively stable. And most of the systems in use today can read and write to it (Linux, BSD, Solaris, Windows, MacOS, you name it), so it is also convenient for quickly transferring data from those small thingamajigs into you main PeeCee.

So yeah, FAT is here to stay. It does not do a lot, but what it does, it does well. And that's why rejecting the FAT patent in Germany is Good News(tm).

FAT patent

[rongage]

You guys know how Microsoft folk like to toss about that Linux violates Microsoft's patents...

You guys know how "we" like to shout out "put up or shut up"...

Opportunity is right in front of our noses - right now!

Whether we think the patent is valid or not is irrelevent - it's been held as valid by the USPTO. The existance of a patent is considered prima facie evidence of validity in a court of law. It takes LOTS of money and time to get a patent declared invalid in court. LOTS of money - a million dollars would not be unusual for legal costs in a patent fight. Unless YOU have the money to put up for the fight, the battle is already lost here.

Microsoft has a valid patent on FAT (or more specifically FAT32). Linux implements FAT and FAT32. Unless someone has a signed document from Microsoft stating that Linux has a royalty-free license to use the patented technology, we are violating the patent - period.

Time to get coding - people talk about "coding around" a patent issue should one be found. Well, one has been laid directly at our feet. Time to get coding...