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How To Request Better ATI Linux Support
An anonymous reader writes "Michael Larabel, the editor of Phoronix, has outlined some strategies for contacting ATI's customers (OEM/ODM/AIBs) to seek ATI Linux fglrx driver improvements. He opines that contacting ATI or AMD directly is the 'wrong approach.' He also states, 'I know for certain that at least one major OEM would like to see improved Linux support but is afraid that the Windows support would then be at risk.' Michael cites examples from the past where Lenovo had sought improved Linux display drivers, which resulted in several new features last year. He provides links to the feedback pages for a number of the vendors to whom ATI actually does listen."
Simple: If you buy a Linux desktop, take care that it has a graphic card from NVidia. These drivers may not be open source, however they are easy to install, work and have a decent performance.
Get yogether with your buddies and collect a pile of ATI and competitor proofs of purchase.
With the ATI ones say that you are a customer and would really like to see Linux support. With all the competitor ones, say that you would have bought ATI but for the driver issue. make sure you youtube it, blog it,...
Engineering is the art of compromise.
at least one major OEM would like to see improved Linux support but is afraid that the Windows support would then be at risk.
Hmm, could it be Dell?
Libertarian Leaning Political Discussion Forum.
If you want Linux drivers, you have to let these companies know:
ASUS
Lenovo
HP
Power Color
HIS Tech
Sapphire
The suggested letter is:
Subject: Product Feedback
To whom it may concern,
I recently purchased one of your [graphics cards || notebooks || desktops] that had contained an ATI GPU. While I realize your products are catered toward Microsoft Windows users as they are your largest consumer base, I wish to use this product with Linux. I had used the [your model number for their product] with the ATI Linux drivers, and while they have improved a great deal recently, I still feel there is much room for improvement. The drivers in their current form run much slower under Linux than Windows, lack support for AIGLX (a visual desktop feature), and other features found within the Windows Catalyst drivers but not Linux.
I do realize you may not officially support Linux and that you have limited control over the development of these drivers, but I would kindly ask that you forward this comment to AMD and that you ask them to channel additional resources to the development of these drivers. In good time you should make Linux support from AMD a requirement. Another step that I would hope to see is including the ATI Linux display drivers on your support/driver CD. As the adoption of Linux on desktops continues to increase, I hope you are able to jointly improve your Linux presence with ATI/AMD.
[your name]
IF ATI had open source drivers, even if they sucked as much as the current FLGLX drivers I would recommend them over Nvidia.
This is because if they did have open source drivers, they wouldn't remain bad for very long.
Currently all free softawre drivers for Nvidia and ATI (except for 'nv' driver) has to be reverse engineered from hardware that is purchased well after they are relased to the public.
therefore it's a miracle they work at all. But as it stands open source drivers exist for R200 up though the R480 video cards (the ATI 8700 thru ATI x800) and although those drivers are slow, they do offer good 3d desktop support and are more stable then ATI's propriatory stuff.
How about requesting ATI/AMD to take care of the already existing free X11 drivers, by giving informations about newer cards and manpower to develop all features, so that we have something readable (and working), and fixable by the community ?
I doubt that it would work. As far as ATI is concerned, the market for people who are (A) building their computer from components, _and_ (B) run Linux on it, _and_ (C) didn't buy a cheap 9200 or 5200, is very very very small. Especially look at that last part. Keeping even 1000 people satisfied when they bought the cheapest chip and made you barely a couple of bucks each, hardly justifies the salaries of a driver team.
I know, we all like to think that the customer is king, and that just because you have a proof of purchase for an old $30 graphics card, it means that a major corporation must bend over backwards for you and catter to your every whim. They should instantly hire a big team to code whatever you fancy today, open-source all their programs... Why, they should even come over and do your laundry. Dream on.
When cattering to mass-markets, you have to think in terms of ROI. If it costs X dollars to do something, will you even get those X dollars back? Is it likely that you'll even make a profit? If not, it's actually smarter to ignore that market segment.
Drivers nowadays are complex and expensive things, and frankly the Linux hobbyist market is tiny. And then they're likely to buy the lowest end card, or not even that as they're busy bitching about how binary drivers are evil.
So, basically, fully expect someone at ATI to at most have a chuckle as they dump your letter into the garbage bin.
OEM's are a whole other affair, because they move millions of boxes. If one of those says "we need linux drivers", then:
A. they probably know what their many corporate customers want. Dunno, maybe some major corporation or government department decided to standardize their desktop on Linux and actually needs 3D accelerated drivers. Basically if a big OEM bitches, they probably aren't doing it out of zealotry and fanboyism, but they know something about demand that you don't. You listen and take notes when those guys speak. And,
B. even if not, you want to listen to those anyway, because they're the guys who make your money. They're the "R" in "ROI". The last thing you want is Dell or IBM (Lenovo) standardizing exclusively on nVidia cards because you told them to fuck off when they complained that lack of Linux drivers hamstrings their server sales. If that were to happen, you'll see a big dip on your income chart, and the mere rumour would make your shares dive and the shareholders demand blood and rolling heads.
Basically you'll have a chance with your proofs of purchase when you fit at least one of the two criteria, preferrably both.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
... versus having good relations with the software manafacturer that makes the operating system that is being used by 90% of your customers...
I gave up asking for and waiting for ATI to wake up to Linux. If they don't want to play on linux they don't play on my computer. When I buy computers I do make sure I at least mention to the sales staff that I want Nvidia or Intel because all other gfx cards have crappy Linux drivers, I hope I may be educating the salesperson so they know if someone else mentions running Linux they'll offer them a real gfx card. I don't buy from big names, because then I get big headaches, and bad support. So my hopes of my OEM somehow having any influence over ATI isn't going to happen.
I've never seen an Intel onboard video card on any AMD compatible motherboard...
Nothing to see here. Move along.
I have put off buying ATi in favor of nVidia for years. nVidia used to have the hands down better hardware, and the drivers have been outstanding for years. ATi has gotten the slight upper hand on hardware for the price point now most of the time with slight model deviations between them and nvidia. However, what's the point of better hardware if you can't take advantage of it?
If you require performance for LInux desktop that goes beyond free software 3d games and good 3d desktop support and have requirements for newer video games or need 3d performance for your work then you have no choice but to buy nvidia.
... cue car analogy...
There exists no open source 3d drivers that can support high end 3d performance nearly as well as what Nvidia provides.
But if your looking for cost effective and stable (much more stable then Nvidia) 2d/3d performance then Intel onboard video cards are the logical choice.
He concedes the performance point, but merely says Intel is fast enough for desktop use. I don't play doom, so I really could care less if my Intel video is fast enough to play it.
It is fast enough in the same way that my 92 Accord is fast enough to get me to work and back every day. It isn't as fast as a (insert high performance sports car here), but it gets me where I am going reliably and quickly enough (faster than one can legally go in my jurisdiction).
That's a pretty strange opinion really. Sure, *whining* isn't going to solve anything, but how is this whining? The GGP has a point when he asks for documentation so he can make the hardware he bought actually work, but even if you disagree with that and think that he doesn't, you shouldn't troll him by labelling his opinion as "whining" simply because you don't agree with it.
butter the donkey