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EU Moving to Ban Online Hate Speech
WED Fan writes "Several members of the EU Parliament are moving to ban online hate speech. 'The draft of the declaration, which heise online has seen, calls on providers in somewhat vague language to make provisions against "hate pages" part of their standard terms and conditions.'"
Libel and slander, like yelling 'fire' in a crowded theater, are not crimes of speech. They are crimes because of the actual harm they cause (such as monetarily verifiable damage to a professional reputation or physical injuries caused by a panicked mob).
We already have laws for the things you are talking about, involving things like inciting violence.
How often have you heard about a case where someone caused actual harm to anyone, that went unprosecuted, that would have been a violation of your vision of a hate speech law?
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Just because we have a first amendment doesn't mean that the powers-that-be will follow it.
For example, consider the Alien and Sedition acts, passed by the Fifth congress (1798) under the direction of John Adams. The Federalists at that time were trying to consolidate their hold on the government. The Alien and Sedition Acts were passed, as part of a Federalist blitz to prepare to defend the United States from French attack. Never mind the fact that France currently busy invading Europe, making an attack on the US unlikely. The Federalists were fearful of foreign subversion by French and Irish immigrants, especially since both groups were active in the Jeffersonian party, the Federalists opposition. To counter this threat, the Federalists passed the Alien and Sedition Acts.
Part of the A&S acts, the Sedition Act, "made it a crime to publish 'false, scandalous, and malicious writing' against the government or its officials." (Wikipedia: Alien and Sedition Acts). Publishing such offensive information against the government would lead to fines and imprisonment. This act was used to stifle the Jeffersonian opposition, and lead to the imprisonment of several key Jeffersonian printers, such as David Brown.
Fortunately, all of the A&S acts, except the Alien Enemies Act, were repealed. However, the fact is that the constitution was blatantly violated for the reason of protecting the nation from the dangerous French subversives.
The scary part is, our congress and president are now casting similar laws (*cough*Patriot Act*cough), to protect us from dangerous Islamic terrorists.
"Hate speech" is just a label placed on a subset of what some politicians don't like. Since politics differ from country to country, the meaning changes along with the politicians. In Canada, publicly disparaging Muslims or homosexuals without a list of references is "hate speech". In some European countries, claiming the number of Jews killed in the Holocaust is less than six million is "hate speech". The US has a somewhat vague cultural definition of it, but it doesn't hold much legal water, rendering it more of a character assassination weapon than a criminal charge.
As far as I'm concerned, if one person is threatening another with violence without provocation, they're already violating an existing law in most countries, and there doesn't need to be another one. If they aren't threatening another with violence, it's none of the government's business.
Having spent some time living in Germany, and more than a little touched by the horrific things the Nazis did myself, let me point out that freedom of speech in the 1930 and 1940's did NOT do that.
It was simply a streak of evil that ran through the Axis, and one that is still not fully resolved today. That streak was exploited by the DDR for example - freedom of speech was not something East Germans knew about, but murder, torture and discrimination were still common right up to 1989.
Today Nazism is rampant in the former Eastern German states (nearly 1.8 million votes at the last election) and the current policy on banning free speech in Germany disguises what a truly significant and growing problem it really is.
Or expressions of religious belief?
This is little more than a thinly veiled attempt by the EU to outlaw religion (both Muslim and Christian religions believe homosexuality to be immoral; the reasoning goes that even condeming immoral behavior (as opposed to people)is sufficient to trigger the statute.
What a rubbish! I can equally claim it's some overly religious tribes that are fuelling this type of "Moral" legislation.Not that the Socialists would be above it, as a matter of fact any political or other group, left or right, has enemies it would sometimes like to silence.
IIRC, a similar law has been passed in the Netherlands, with pastors being warned that there are certain sins they are no longer allowed to mention in public.
Living in The Netherlands I can tell you your memory is failing in a catastrophic manner.Even if you are an atheist, the premise is troubling. I would be likewise disturbed if questioning the existence of God was made illegal - certainly this development is not going to expand and enlighten public discourse on sensitive subjects.
Truly a troubling development.
I would sooner say you are troubled to voice such outrageous claims...Europe is a continent with many very different cultures that have fought bitterly in a not so distant past, just take the troubles in the Balkan.
It does not take much imagination to see new flare ups of extremely damaging violence in parts of Europe when certain scrupulous groups and individuals would not be constrained.
It is regrettable this type of legislation is needed but in countries that have had this legislation for many years the advantages have generally outweighed the worries.
"The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
French right wing politician um thats spinning it a little isn't it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Marie_Le_Pen
"Jean-Marie Le Pen (born June 20, 1928, La Trinité-sur-Mer, France) is a French far-right nationalist politician, founder and president of the Front National (National Front) party."
"He has been charged with Holocaust denial several times, and has unsuccessfully sued some who had accused him of this."
right wing i would think gwb et al, This guys more reminiscent of the KKK I guess by your reckoning Stalin was a left leaning liberal...
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Oh please you can't even say "fuck" on US tv..
Europe has similar protections. They're enacted differently, but the end efect is the same. If a State or the Federal Government tried to enact similar legislation in the USA, my understanding is the constitutionality could be challenged in court; if it's enacted in Europe its compliance with human rights treaties can be challenged in court.
As the saying goes, "There's more than one way to do it".
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In most countries in the EU, people can say just about anything they want, like in the US. Inciting others to commit crimes is a crime, like in the US.
There are some exceptions, like in France where there are special laws to protect the Jews. You will be arrested in France if you deny that the Holocaust existed.
In some countries, there are even extremist right-wing parties. In my particular country, the fascist ideology is forbidden, because we had a fascist dictatorship for 48 years that ended in '74. But, in my opinion, the prohibition of fascism wouldn't be necessary, because many of the things that constitute fascism would be made crimes by other laws, like race supremacy or encouraging the use of violence. The same for left-wing extremists, and by the way, extremists of any kind.
I don't like the idea of the nazi scum being able to propagate their bullshit freely. But maybe it would be better to just let them speak. They would lose much of their strength if people just ignore them, making them look silly.
About being a bastion of civil rights, your affirmation sounds just like anti-Europe senseless bashing. Just look at the vast majority of countries in the World, and you'll find that the freedom enjoyed in Europe, US, Canada and a few others is not the rule, but the exception. My people only knew what freedom was exactly 33 years and 1 day ago. And it feels fucking gooooood!