Slashdot Mirror


Tech Billionaire Boot Camp

theodp writes "Forget the Summer of Code. If you've got a hot idea for a start-up, Newsweek says Y-Combinator, the boot camp where Silicon Valley meets 'American Idol', is the place you should be. 'Some critics scoff that Y Combinator's investment is peanuts for that amount of equity. But the opportunity is unparalleled -- total immersion into Silicon Valley start-up culture, advice from Graham and a fast track to the top angel investors and venture-capital funds. When Graham calls the winners, the founders have only five minutes to accept. "If people turn us down," he says, "as far as we're concerned they've failed an IQ test."'" We've previously discussed the program on the site, just over a year ago.

18 of 178 comments (clear)

  1. Barely an investment by Anarchysoft · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How much do you usually invest?
    Usually $5000 + $5000 per founder. So $15,000 for two founders, $20,000 for three. Occasionally we invest more. The goal is usually to give you enough money to build an impressive prototype or version 1, which you can then use to get further funding. This is peanuts. If this is all the money you're going to get, it's probably a better use of your efforts to keep your day job and do your startup on your own spare time.
    1. Re:Barely an investment by ShakaUVM · · Score: 5, Informative

      He also didn't invent Bayesian filtering. I open sourced a similar statistical spam filter a year or two before he wrote the plan for spam. And I didn't invent it either.

  2. Living in the past by geek · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I was immersed heavily in SV startup hell back in 1995-2001. I will happily admit that I would now fail hs IQ test. I wouldn't touch that dead horse with a ten foot pole. These guys are living in the past. SV is no longer the hub it once was, nor should it be. The boom that happened there KILLED their cost of living. Firefighters and teachers were living in homeless shelters because the cost of living got so high. People are tired of that shit. Seriously, just move on. Branch out. There is no reason for every tech related startup to be cenetered in one tiny little community.

    1. Re:Living in the past by The+Vulture · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I work at a Silicon Valley startup that has been in existence for four years now.

      It's funny in that the engineering team that I work with (who cannot afford a house) agree with your sentiment, but of course, the management team (who do have houses) refuse to even consider relocating the company (or a part of it). My informal poll has showed that everybody in the engineering team would gladly pick up and move if given the chance. This company has no need to be in the Valley, the customers that we are going after are either outside of the United States, or have offices nationwide, which are generally not in the Valley. The company founder could easily save money by relocating us.

      I would gladly take a small pay cut to live and work in a nicer area with a lower cost of living, and be able to lead a better life. After this job, I'm out of the Valley, and not looking to return. There's too much BS in the Valley, and California as a whole.

      -- Joe

    2. Re:Living in the past by achacha · · Score: 4, Informative

      Then this is what you should do. There are plenty of tech friendly cities with affordable housing and relatively low cost of living. Portland, OR; Austin, TX; Vancouver, BC; Raleigh-Durham, NC; Heck even Boston, Seattle and New York City are a steal compared to SV (if you live in one of the suburbs nearby). I lived in SV for 5 years and could not reasonably afford a house and family with developer salary (pure interest loans never sounded good to me); so I moved to Austin and managed to buy a house without much trouble and enjoy it a lot and glad I moved away from the valley (not to mention all the fun life outside of work which the valley sorely lacks unless you want to drive to SF every night).

  3. Too Late for Spring...Wait for Winter by Listen+Up · · Score: 4, Informative

    "If you want to apply, please submit your application online by midnight PST on Monday, April 2, 2007. Groups that submit early have a slight advantage because we have more time to read their applications."

    Good timing for this article...

    1. Re:Too Late for Spring...Wait for Winter by hansamurai · · Score: 4, Funny

      Unless your hot idea is time traveling.

  4. Re:What a load by TodMinuit · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Agreed. Paul Graham isn't a computer nerd or a business man. He's a late night startup infomercial. "I got rich on startups and you can too! Just follow my 10 easy steps!"

    --
    I wonder if I use bold in my signature, people will notice my posts.
  5. Failed an IQ test - depends on perspective by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "If people turn us down," he says, "as far as we're concerned they've failed an IQ test."

    In other words, if you say no, or demand to "think about it for 24 hours", you probably might have an IQ that is too high to allow them to take advantage of you, and thus makes you ineligible to be one of their patsies.

    The smart people are the ones that after receiving the call, say no, realizing that the idea has been vetted as having potential, and should run with it on their own.

  6. Everything that is wrong with Venture Capital by Sanity · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "[if founders turn us down] as far as we're concerned they've failed an IQ test."
    Yeah, they scored too high and thus know better than to sell their equity for peanuts. I mean, wealthy or not, what an arrogant twat.

    total immersion into Silicon Valley start-up culture
    I can imagine few worse things for starting a technology business than to be immersed in the incestuous and insular world of Silicon Valley. Most Internet users don't live in Silicon Valley, why would it be an advantage to be isolated from them?

    When Graham calls the winners, the founders have only five minutes to accept.
    And they are willing to admit such underhanded pressure tactics? Sounds like these guys are everything that is wrong with venture capital.
  7. Words of code? by Anarchysoft · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Graham loves it when his little chicks take on the big birds. "These guys have written 40,000 words of code in three months!" he crows. "You never see that in a big company!" Who counts by 'words' of code? Working for big companies, I've written several thousand lines of code in a day many times. It's not typical, but it's not quite rare either. Of course, after a writing flurry I'd usually spend the rest of the week pulling my hair out because of the bugs I had added. ;)
  8. $20k , ridiculous. by adam · · Score: 4, Informative

    You're completely correct. First of all, the phrase "angel investor" should never be used to accompany a five digit figure --even "venture capital" is kindof out of place. Secondly, if they're investing (up to) $20k into a startup, it is they who are failing the IQ test. [in my experience] Serious venture investors want to see startups that have already bootstrapped a significant amount of funding (at least six if not seven figures), have PhDs onboard, etc. Now, obviously some industries and ideas have a much larger barrier to entry than others. For instance, I'm in the cinema field, where a cutting edge product might cost between $50k (low end) and $1M (high end). So designing, manufacturing (etc) these products has a much larger barrier than say, the guy who has a bright idea for the next digg.com or whatever web-two-point-oh site is hot this week (where $20k might actually pay a brilliant developer to write much of the code needed). But, even using the American Idol analogy-- if you were going to invest in a singer, someone who doesn't have any sofware/hardware development needed, just needs the cash to get into a studio and get recorded, that alone would cost more than $20k.

    Twenty grand really is peanuts. Hell, some venture capital groups have proposal fees that can easily run a few thousand dollars (that the startup needs to pay just to present the business plan to them), not to mention cookie-cutter research for business plans alone can easily run $5-10k (I won't even get into custom research).

    My advice if you need $20k of investment capital? Put it on your Visa (worked for Under Armor). Selling off a chunk of anything you genuinely believe to be a good idea should only be considered when you have no other available means to bring that idea to fruition.

    --
    I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.
    1. Re:$20k , ridiculous. by Z0mb1eman · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Serious venture investors want to see startups that have already bootstrapped a significant amount of funding (at least six if not seven figures), have PhDs onboard, etc. That's exactly the point of YCombinator - to get your startup to the stage where serious investors will even look at you.

      The biggest draw is not the money, it's the connections, the advice, the hype and recognition you get for being a YCombinator grad, and the investor meetings they set up for you.

      Precisely because the barrier to entry is so low on the web, getting people to take your idea seriously can be very valuable. I believe one of Paul Graham's arguments in favour of YCombinator is - which would you rather do, keep the 2-10% of a company that has few chances of succeeding, or give away 2-10% of a company with higher chances of success?

      Most of the YCombinator projects are run by people in their mid-20s - not exactly experienced at running a business, and this is the point in life where connections and advice can be more valuable than standard of living.

      Is it worth it for everyone? If you already have capital, connections, and a rock-solid business plan, no way. If you have a great idea and lots of energy, but you're not actually sure how to make it work, then it might be.

      And yes, my co-founder for "the next digg.com or whatever web-two-point-oh site is hot this week" (see my signature) flew down to San Francisco about a month ago to pitch our site to Paul Graham & co. for this year's summer YCombinator. And no, we didn't get it (we weren't expecting to :p). It was a valuable experience nonetheless, we're working on something a bit more original now :p
      --
      ClutterMe.com - easiest site creation on the Net. Just click and type.
  9. Taking VC is almost guaranteed to screw you by kcbrown · · Score: 5, Interesting

    But the opportunity is unparalleled -- total immersion into Silicon Valley start-up culture, advice from Graham and a fast track to the top angel investors and venture-capital funds.

    Make no mistake: if you take VC funds, they, not you, get into the driver's seat. And it means that their priorities, not yours, are what will drive the company.

    Back in the dotcom days, before the crash, it generally meant the VCs would attempt to groom the company for a quick IPO. That meant growing the company quickly and sacrificing the long-term viability of the company in order to do it.

    It was common for the original founders of the company to be booted from the company or otherwise sidelined. The VCs would bring in their own executive management teams, all the way up to the CEO, which would answer only to the VCs, of course.

    The end result is that the startups were unable to maintain their focus on their original mission and were vastly over-committed compared with their needs. And predictably, most of them tanked shortly after their IPO. The VCs usually made a nice profit when the companies IPO'd, but once stock investors finally realized what was going on, IPOs suddenly became worthless. And thus the dot-bomb ensued.

    If I were the founder of a startup, the last thing I would do is take the money of a VC. That money is heavily tainted. Taking it would be akin to committing suicide. The only way I would take it is if it came with a contract that clearly stated that I would remain in complete control of the company as if I had not taken the funds at all. And I doubt any VC would ever sign such an agreement.

    --
    Use 'slashdot stuff' in the subject line in any email you send me if you want to get past the spam filter.
  10. a word of advice by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If you're ever placed in a position where you're offered a deal that doesn't sound so hot, but

    1) the surroundings are hyped up, for example a "boot camp for Web 2.0 entrepreneurs" that is a "combination of Silicon Valley and American Idol";

    2) you are given a ridiculously short time limit to make up your mind, let's say five minutes

    and

    3) if you don't accept, you "fail the IQ test" in the eyes of the people making the offer

    then grab your shit and head out the door as fast as possible. Don't forget your cell phone.

    (following Harvey Mackay).

  11. IQ Test by ShakaUVM · · Score: 4, Interesting

    As far as I can tell, Paul Graham is a hustler.

    Taking 5% of a company for TWENTY THOUSAND DOLLARS? Anyone who accepts that deal should be shot. Saying that "they failed an IQ test" just makes Graham out to be a fraud.

    Also, and this is a personal pet peeve for me, he wrote "The Plan for Spam" in August 2002. Bob Boyer and I (Bill Kerney) while grad students at UC San Diego wrote a very similar statistical spam filter, which we open sourced and released in December 2000 (and which some people took and continued working on it). And we didn't invent the idea either -- we based our work on the UC Irvine Machine Learning Database.

    And yet somehow he never corrects the notion that he invented the idea.

    1. Re:IQ Test by homer_s · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Here is a passage from one of his essays (which I think are very insightful):

      A while ago an eminent VC firm offered a series A round to a startup we'd seed funded. Then they heard a rival VC firm was also interested. They were so afraid that they'd be rejected in favor of this other firm that they gave the startup what's known as an "exploding termsheet." They had, I think, 24 hours to say yes or no, or the deal was off. Exploding termsheets are a somewhat dubious device, but not uncommon. What surprised me was their reaction when I called to talk about it. I asked if they'd still be interested in the startup if the rival VC didn't end up making an offer, and they said no. What rational basis could they have had for saying that? If they thought the startup was worth investing in, what difference should it make what some other VC thought? Surely it was their duty to their limited partners simply to invest in the best opportunities they found; they should be delighted if the other VC said no, because it would mean they'd overlooked a good opportunity. But of course there was no rational basis for their decision. They just couldn't stand the idea of taking this rival firm's rejects.


  12. I co-founded a company funded by Y Combinator by SwellJoe · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Alright, there's a lot of misapprehension, and perhaps willful ignorance, of nearly every aspect of the Y Combinator model. I'm the co-founder of a company that was funded during the Winter Founders Program documented in the linked article (my company is Virtualmin, Inc., co-founded with Jamie Cameron).

    First up, about the equity. YC asks for between 2% and 10%. Mostly, it's 5 or 6 percent. The companies funded are all quite early stage. It's very rare for one to be launched, and even moreso for it to be profitable. In some cases, it's no more than a mocked up demo. YC are very early stage investors, usually getting involved before anyone else will touch it--they invest in smart people, not really ideas or businesses. In the three months I've spent meeting once a week with the other founders, no one has ever even hinted that they regret giving up equity to YC. We certainly don't, and we're one of the few that had a launched product and paying customers.

    The "5 minute IQ test" is being misconstrued. Applicants know well in advance exactly what the terms are going to look like. You don't bother applying if you don't like the terms, so you never get to the yes/no IQ test. I don't think anyone has ever turned them down at that stage. It's a good punchline, and makes for good magazine copy, nothing more.

    Paul Graham is extremely smart. Wherever he goes crowds gather round, and it's not just for his boyish good looks. He's got a touch of ADD, at this point, due to his popularity, but we've never had trouble getting advice when we needed it, and his advice has generally been spot-on. YC has three other partners, two of whom (Jessica and Trevor) were as deeply involved as Paul during WFP. Paul's celebrity leads to a ridiculous array of speakers at the weekly dinners...He has an uncanny knack for bringing in the most interesting people in the valley: Joe Kraus (Excite, JotSpot), Evan Williams (Blogger, Twitter), Paul Buchheit (Gmail), Greg McAdoo (Sequoia), Ron Conway (largest angel investor in the world), etc.

    Which brings me to contacts. If you believe contacts don't mean anything, you're fooling yourself. I started a business outside of the valley in 1999, and now I've started one in the valley. Big difference. I paid my bills and bought myself a nice car with my previous business. I have much higher expectations with my current business, and a large percentage of those expectations have been brought nearer by our affiliation with YC. Try dropping a random investor an email sometime, to arrange a meeting to tell them about your great business. We've never received a "no thanks" to such a meeting, and I've been hearing from fellow YC'ers that they've always gotten the meetings they wanted (not just random VCs...they're talking to exactly the people they want to talk to). We're in talks with our first choice VC and it's going very well, and at least three of the other companies have already closed rounds. If you are in Y Combinator you increase your chances of getting funded by a good investor by a huge amount (and let's be clear: A bad investor brings nothing but money and disaster will follow...the right investor brings more contacts, good advice, expertise in the right areas, and also money...with the right investor your odds of explosive success are remarkably higher). YC brings the best contacts in the industry.

    Some other bits that aren't obvious unless you think it through and actually read the YC information on their page:

    YC pays for the incorporation and all legal stuff for issuing shares. It's about ten grand worth of legal work from a top valley firm.

    YC feeds the company founders every Tuesday night for three months. Paul cooks the meals personally (I've seen it with my own two eyes). These dinners are the single most valuable aspect of the program (aside from providing the motivation needed to get people out to the valley). Chatting with fellow founders every week about what you're working on, what they're working on, and exchanging ide