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Update On Free Linux Driver Development

Remember the offer Greg Kroah-Hartman made earlier this year, to get Linux drivers written for free for any company that wanted them? Now an anonymous reader points us to an article up on linuxworld with an update to this program. Greg K-H, who leads the development of several kernel subsystems including USB and PCI, admits that the January offer was a bit of "marketing hype" — but says it has brought companies and developers together anyway. Twelve companies have said "yes please," one driver is already in the kernel, and five more are in the pipeline.

18 of 272 comments (clear)

  1. List? by Constantine+XVI · · Score: 4, Interesting

    A list of the twelve companies, please?

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    "I think an etch-a-sketch with an ethernet port would beat IE7 in web standards compliance."
    1. Re:List? by ajs318 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I've often wondered about this myself -- could Microsoft actively prevent hardware manufacturers from releasing Linux drivers, just by refusing to certify Windows drivers for any hardware which comes with a Linux driver? And for that matter, have they been doing exactly that?

      Now that Windows is moving towards a more locked-down kernel, it's certainly technically feasible. It's probably Anticompetitive Behaviour, but that doesn't seem to be illegal in the USA anymore.

      --
      Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
    2. Re:List? by ajs318 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      ..... a problem which only arises because the existing law which already obliges manufacturers to disclose details to hardware owners is not being enforced. Write to your MP and ask for a new law, obliging hardware manufacturers to release, generally and gratis (or at any rate, for no more than the cost of copying and delivery) sufficient documentation so that independent programmers can write drivers for their hardware as a precondition before it is allowed onto the market. Independent expert review of the documentation would be a requirement alongside electrical safety / EMC certification.

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  2. Fishing for Drivers by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1, Interesting

    How about a driver for this ATI All-In-Wonder 3D Rage II +DVD PCI card I can't find drivers for?

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    make install -not war

  3. vaporware is hype by phrostie · · Score: 1, Interesting

    this is productive

  4. Re:patents, usability by QuantumG · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Perhaps you could fund an effort to get the patent invalidated.. or to buy a blanket license for linux.. or to get the patent owner to publically waive their right to sue anyone who distributes the codec or something..

    As for CUPS, maybe you could narrow down the exact problem and submit a bug report.. or put together an effort to fund someone to work on it.

    It's community software.

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
  5. Can't copy GPL code? by Skapare · · Score: 2, Interesting

    From TFA:

    While one developer of a competing open source operating system has criticized the NDA approach, developers are free under the GPL to use the Linux driver as the documentation for a new one as long as they don't copy the actual code. "The drivers are generally better written than the specs," Kroah-Hartman says.

    What? If the driver code is GPL, why can't I copy it?

    I suspect he means "copy" as in "make a derived work" that would have chunks of code taken from the original. But still, this is what GPL is about ... being able to take an existing source and make a derived work from it (that presumably would be better), and redistribute that derived work also under GPL (so someone else can derive from that later on ... and on ... and on).

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    now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    1. Re:Can't copy GPL code? by jZnat · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Only the American companies who confuse being hardware manufacturers with being software developers force these NDAs which result in drivers which are basically decompiled blobs. Projects like OpenBSD (and Linux even) have had better experience with Asian companies for example on getting documentation regarding hardware. Blueprints to the hardware are not needed to write a driver; just the op codes and messages you can send to the hardware to control it. For example, CPU architectures are quite documented when it comes to their op codes, so therefore we are able to have open source compilers (e.g., GCC). On the other hand, the op codes for GPUs in NVidia and ATI hardware, are kept completely secret for most likely bullshit reasons (or because they're already infringing on the other company's patents and don't want anyone to know), so therefore we're stuck with blobs or intensive reverse engineering processes that can take over a year to finish.

      I think Theo has a better opinion on Free Software than any of the Linux kernel developers do. Now if GNU had actually written a kernel themselves rather than adopted Linux back in the early 90's, we wouldn't have this NDA/blob problem due to RMS. I don't know how far the "GNU desktop" would have come by now, so I don't know how much success they would have in getting hardware companies to provide documentation on how to use the damn hardware.

      --
      'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
    2. Re:Can't copy GPL code? by Kjella · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I guess it boils down to "How complete can a driver be documented and still comply with an NDA?". I mean, if the code is full of setting magic memory addresses to magic values then it's not really open source because you can't make a clue of it without NDA'd docs. On the other hand, if the bit registers and opcodes are all clearly laid out and documented in the source, isn't that exactly what's covered by the NDA? Software developers don't need any circuit layouts in the first place, they just need the interface.

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  6. Re:Why... by QuantumG · · Score: 5, Interesting

    1. They're loadable modules.
    2. You should maybe leave the kernel development to the kernel developers.

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    How we know is more important than what we know.
  7. Re:patents, usability by arodland · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Maybe I'm a bit simple but I don't see where CUPS even has "usability" to complain about. You install it (if, oddly, it isn't already), you tell it what and where your printer are (preferably using the KDE print config thing because it's amazingly simple, but the CUPS web jigger isn't bad either), and then from then on you print, and you forget that CUPS exists. Where's the hangup?

  8. Re:patents, usability by QuantumG · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I wasn't able to get a printer working under Windows XP 64 bit Edition for about 9 months. Only last week did I figure out how to force windows not to try to use the drivers from the print server (which is 32 bit XP) and to stop it from overwriting the 64 bit drivers with the 32 bit ones. I guarentee it is because the date-time stamps on the drivers were out of wack.. in 3 weeks time they'll probably magically stop working again.

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    How we know is more important than what we know.
  9. Re:patents, usability by bcrowell · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Maybe I'm a bit simple but I don't see where CUPS even has "usability" to complain about.[...] Where's the hangup?
    Problems I've had:
    1. the problem I described in my original post
    2. Upgrading ubuntu to a new version made cups stop working.
    3. The web interface says administrative functions are disabled. Because of that, I tried editing the config file to accomplish what I wanted. I also downloaded drivers directly from Brother, because that was what people on the ubuntu wiki suggested, but that actually didn't work because of poor packaging. Eventually I figured out that the web interface actually did work, and started using that instead.
    4. After I tell the web interface my printer is a Brother, it lists a huge number of drivers, including a very large number for my printer. I initially picked the wrong one, and it sort of worked, but sort of didn't. Later I noticed that one of them was marked "foomatic, recommended." Well, OK, maybe I should have noticed that that one said "recommended," but I had no idea what "foomatic" was, and didn't know if I wanted foomatic or not.
    5. Every time I try to print more than 5-10 pages from a GNOME app, the printer freezes. (This never happens with lpr printing from the command line.) When this happens, clearing and restarting the queue doesn't help. Rebooting doesn't help. The only thing that unfreezes CUPS is to delete the printer in the web interface, and then reinstall it.
  10. Re:Why... by Chirs · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If you compile your own kernel you can choose to either leave out the functionality entirely, build it as a runtime-loadable module, or build it into the kernel.

    So the only permanent size increase is in the kernel source code. Assuming that the driver is part of a class of similar devices, there is basically no complexity increase as the driver will bind into the standard API for that class of devices.

    So generally there is very little downside to adding new drivers to the tree.

  11. Re:patents, usability by Hal_Porter · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The thing is, things don't stay fixed. The same old problems constantly get revisited when someone looks at something semi-widely accepted and decides the code is too ugly and makes a rewrite that doesn't add anything from the user's point of view but forces them to relearn another system.

    Hmm, that reminds me of a sad story.

    http://www.smcc.demon.nl/webcam/

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  12. Re:patents, usability by the_womble · · Score: 3, Interesting

    You could say the same for Windows:

    Windows is fine in an office environment, with IT there to fix things.

    However:

    1) Making Windows secure requires work and knowledge
    2) When things go wrong they can be hard to fix, and even when fixed they have a tendency to mysteriously go wrong again.
    3) Software is hard to find, install and update. There are no repositories of software that is safe (not malware), will install with a click, and will all be auto updated.

    In short: there is no OS that is really suitable for the home, and there are at least some ways in which Linux is better than the competition.

  13. Re:patents, usability by timmarhy · · Score: 2, Interesting
    "stuff nearly all works"

    and what happens with the stuff that doesn't? can you request your money back or ask for technical support because your trying to use linux? checkmate, i win. the distro that can focus 100% on getting everyday useage right will win IMHO

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  14. Re:so did he write them for free or didn't he by OldHawk777 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Only in politics, crime, nepotism ... and other stuff.

    Sometimes, I am just to redundant with a left and right brain tearing my mind apart.

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    Unaccountable leaders are masters, and unrepresented people are slaves. How do US and EU fare?