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Team Discovers "Throttle" For Solar Wind

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on from the all-systems-go dept.

ScienceDaily is reporting that a team of scientists have discovered that Helium may act as a "throttle" for the solar wind. The team hopes that this insight will provide them a better look inside the dynamics of space weather. "Because helium nearly vanishes from the solar wind at its minimum speed, the researchers believe helium might somehow set the minimum speed. Helium is not accelerated efficiently by any process thought to be propelling the solar wind. Instead, it has to be dragged along by the hydrogen: Solar wind hydrogen atoms exert a small electric field that drags the helium out along with it, according to the team."

65 comments

  1. If there's one thing men love by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Funny

    it's more power. ah ah ah!!! *tim allen grunts*

  2. Curiously... by packetmon · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I wonder *how* one measures anything going that slow considering there isn't something *tangible* to watch and measure... I wish the article could have explained this as I am now lost wondering... Which is faster, a slug, three toed sloth, helium or plasma...

    --
    Infiltrated dot Net
    1. Re:Curiously... by ThosLives · · Score: 1, Insightful

      260 km/s isn't very slow in my book.

      What's really goofy is TFA says that "lack of helium is what makes it slow" where it really seems like "slow wind isn't enough to pull any helium with it" - I think they have their causal relationship backwards.

      --
      "There are a dozen opinions on a matter until you know the truth. Then there is only one." - CS Lewis (paraprhase)
    2. Re:Curiously... by FuzzyDaddy · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I think they don't know what's causing what. But there is a minimum speed - below which you don't see solar wind. At this speed, the He concentration also drops to zero. So the two are linked, but from TFA, they don't have a clue as to how.

      I think I got that right, anyway. If not, feel free to make fun of me.

      --
      It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
  3. Anyone else by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Funny

    Anyone else feel like releasing a few million helium balloons right above Redmond, Washington, right about now? ;)

    --
    My blog
    1. Re:Anyone else by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      *rolls eyes*

    2. Re:Anyone else by ScentCone · · Score: 3, Funny

      Anyone else feel like releasing a few million helium balloons right above Redmond, Washington, right about now?

      Only on slashdot would someone stretch that hard to turn an astrophysics summary into an MS bashing troll. I mean, it takes WORK to do it that cravenly. Whew! You must be tired.

      --
      Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
    3. Re:Anyone else by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My parents were killed by helium balloons you insensitive clod!

  4. long range satellites by jshriverWVU · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Could this be used on long range satellites?

    1. Re:long range satellites by Moofie · · Score: 1

      Long range...satellite?

      I think we might be having vocabulary issues.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    2. Re:long range satellites by jshriverWVU · · Score: 1

      Long range as in ones that leave our system like Voyager vs ones that just float around earth.

    3. Re:long range satellites by Moofie · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm not sure I'd consider something on a parabolic or hyperbolic orbit to be a "satellite".

      Spacecraft? Absolutely.

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
    4. Re:long range satellites by Goaway · · Score: 1

      As the guy said. Vocabulary issues. "Satellite" does not mean "thingy with antennas floating in space", you know.

    5. Re:long range satellites by cswiger · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure I'd consider something on a parabolic or hyperbolic orbit to be a "satellite".


      Agreed. Elsewhere in the article in mentions the "Solar Wind Experiment" as being on the "Wind" *spacecraft*. On the other hand, it's not unreasonable to consider this thing as being a satellite of the Sun, assuming it's not going faster than Sol's escape velocity...?

      --
      "The human race's favorite method for being in control of the facts is to ignore them." -Celia Green
    6. Re:long range satellites by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      It's a common misconception that solar wind drives a solar sail. This is really incorrect - in fact, solar wind destroys solar sails.

      The momentum of photons striking a solar sail is what makes the ship go.

    7. Re:long range satellites by Moofie · · Score: 1

      That's a fair question. Is it meaningful to talk about a "satellite" if the period is tremendously long?

      Insert squishy linguistic notions here. : )

      --
      Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
  5. Space weather by Timesprout · · Score: 3, Funny

    Alpha quadrant : Freezio!

    Beta quadrant : Freezio!

    Gamma quadrant : Freezio!

    Delta quadrant : Freezio!

    --
    Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
    What truth?
    There is no dupe
    1. Re:Space weather by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Obviously I'm missing the reference here. Why is this funny?

    2. Re:Space weather by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      http://youtube.com/watch?v=ctaszjeaDK0

  6. The message is clear: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Helium must be banned.

  7. I don't buy it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Helium has no dipole moment and will be unaffected by an electric field.

    1. Re:I don't buy it by Oktober+Sunset · · Score: 1

      on a molecular level tho, there can be an induced dipole.

      --
      What if Tetris was invented by Nazis?
    2. Re:I don't buy it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      it's a plasma. without electrons, it's a positive ion.

    3. Re:I don't buy it by mbike · · Score: 5, Informative

      This is not neutral hydrogen therefore it is highly affected by the electric field. This plasma has come from the sun which is way to hot for molecules or neutral atoms for that matter. The article does make good sense.

  8. Summing up the article by Unknown303 · · Score: 1

    The link seems to go into detail that they don't really know the importants of the helium present in the solar winds. Only that the winds speeds are somehow determined by the amount of helium present in the solar winds. While the helium isn't the actual propellant of the winds it seems that the actualy speed and possible amount of helium is determined by the size of CME (coronal mass ejection) experienced on the surface of the sun.

    1. Re:Summing up the article by Lord+Lemur · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Ok, I think everyone is kinda missing what the question and answer are here...

      The question is why in the name of the sweet baby Jeebus does the solar wind have a minimum speed of about 161 miles/sec. It sounds like, according to the article that the ammount of helium asomatotically approaches 0 as the speed slows to 161 miles/sec.

      So the question becomes:

      1) why must helium be present?

      2) why is there a relationship since nothing that promotes the solar wind is thought to have an effect on the air speed of an unladen plasma of helium?

      QTF: /quote

      Because helium nearly vanishes from the solar wind at its minimum speed, the researchers believe helium might somehow set the minimum speed. Helium is not accelerated efficiently by any process thought to be propelling the solar wind. Instead, it has to be dragged along by the hydrogen: Solar wind hydrogen atoms exert a small electric field that drags the helium out along with it, according to the team. /quote

      Basically, they don't have a frigg'n clue, but they figured out how the helium might be present.

    2. Re:Summing up the article by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      2) why is there a relationship since nothing that promotes the solar wind is thought to have an effect on the air speed of an unladen plasma of helium?
      Would that be African, or European, plasma?

      Seriously, though, there was a passage in TFA that explains it. As I understahd it, solar wind has an escape velocity necessary to leave the sun; factored into this is the drag created by the He-H attraction (which I'm not too clear on, since they are both positive ions). Since He is heavier, its escape velocity is higher; at 260 km/s the only H ions that escape are ones that break free of He. At higher speeds, the plasma can escape even when there are higher concentrations of He.

      I visualize it as similar to a fine needle in a drop of water. There is a minimum speed required for the needle to break the surface tension of the water droplet; at exactly that speed, the needle will come free cleanly. At much higher speeds, the needle will drag some of the water with it due to friction. The higher the speed, the more water comes with the needle. This visualization equates the sun's gravity well to surface tension, and I think it's pretty obvious what the water and needle are. The question unanswered is, what makes the needle move?

      The speculation provided in the article is that CMEs provide the energy for the solar wind. Increasing concentrations of Helium at solar wind ejection sites (due to fractional release of H in the solar wind) result in a high-energy state relieved by a CME.
      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
  9. no one knows? by wizardforce · · Score: 3, Informative

    The team discovered that the abundance of helium increased as the solar wind speed increased, from near zero around the minimum speed to more than four helium atoms for every 100 hydrogen atoms at speeds greater than about 500 kilometers per second (310 miles/second).

    helium is heavier than hydrogen snd it requires a higher voltage potential to leave the sun's gravity well- in the case of solar wind the concentration of helium is actually lower than in the sun its self [4% vs 25%] the hydrogen has a better chance of escaping and at higher energies helium levels increase.
    --
    Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
    1. Re:no one knows? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      While you're probably right when you say that the cause of the slowing is that the alpha particle is four times heavier than the proton, you are very wrong to bring in voltages. The solar wind is blown out by the pressure gradient, electic potentials have nothing to do with it. And the wind itself is quasi-neutral, meaning that the number of positive and negative charges in a non-infinitesimal volume is approximately equal. Thus an electric field couldn't move this plasmas anyway.

      And what do you mean when you say that "in the case of solar wind the concentration of helium is actually lower than in the sun its self [4% vs 25%]"? While there probably are some differences between the solar interior and the coronal wind, the ratio of helium to hydrogen is more like 1/10 and 1/20, respectively. Coronal abundances are still under debate, though. The figure of 4% is plausible for the solar wind, but 25% is much too high for the interior.

    2. Re:no one knows? by wizardforce · · Score: 2, Informative


      While you're probably right when you say that the cause of the slowing is that the alpha particle is four times heavier than the proton, you are very wrong to bring in voltages. The solar wind is blown out by the pressure gradient, electic potentials have nothing to do with it. And the wind itself is quasi-neutral, meaning that the number of positive and negative charges in a non-infinitesimal volume is approximately equal. Thus an electric field couldn't move this plasmas anyway. And what do you mean when you say that "in the case of solar wind the concentration of helium is actually lower than in the sun its self [4% vs 25%]"? While there probably are some differences between the solar interior and the coronal wind, the ratio of helium to hydrogen is more like 1/10 and 1/20, respectively. Coronal abundances are still under debate, though. The figure of 4% is plausible for the solar wind, but 25% is much too high for the interior.
      ah but solar wind is affected by the magnetic fields and electrical fields present- also the temperature of the corona is significant but even if the primary driving force for solar wind is a pressure gradient, it still obeys equations that describe the velocity of gases and the probability of gas escape from the sun. as for the soalr abundances of helium I was referring to the total helium abundance, not just in the corona. the corona is a relatively thin envelope of gas that extends far enough out to decrease the quantity of helium that is present. the equations also predict that at higher velocities [energies] the quantity of helium increases- these equations are much similar to reaction rate cross section equations in that you calculate relative to an energy barrier- in this case the gravity well as well as the energy and mass of the particles being leaked from the corona.

      --
      Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
    3. Re:no one knows? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The flow of mass from the sun is described well using only the continuity and momentum equations without a Lorentz factor. There are certainly secondary effects caused by magnetohydrodynamics (MHD), but these are not needed to describe the solar wind in general. I don't think they apply, except at microscopic lengths, in the present discussion.

      Lots of interesting stuff happens to the helium abundance in the chromosphere and above, but below that atmospheric stratum it stays constant at least down through the convective layer. In this region it is about 10% helium and 90% hydrogen, with trace amounts of metals. It never reaches 25%, no matter how you calculate it.

  10. brake, throttle.... by Himring · · Score: 2, Funny

    So, helium is the brake and hydrogen is the gas pedal. Who's driving?

    --
    "All great things are simple & expressed in a single word: freedom, justice, honor, duty, mercy, hope." --Churchill
    1. Re:brake, throttle.... by CaptainPatent · · Score: 1

      hopefully it's not linux.

      --
      Well, back to rejecting software patent applications.
    2. Re:brake, throttle.... by Suzuran · · Score: 1

      Oh my God, bear is driving! How can that be?

    3. Re:brake, throttle.... by weighn · · Score: 1

      So, helium is the brake and hydrogen is the gas pedal. and don't forget the seatbelts that are strong enough to hold in your black hole addendum: I realise how trollish that sounds, but check the link
      --
      Mongrel News all the news that fits and froths
  11. Helium is a byproduct of wind speed, not catalyst by pffft · · Score: 1

    TFA is horribly written. Seems that the presence of helium is a result of high wind speed, not the cause.

  12. Ok, so, in other words... by eggstasy · · Score: 1

    Fast wind blows shit around, slow wind not strong enough to do so. Did I miss anything? :|

  13. LOAL! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, I stand up next to your mommy, chop her down with the edge of my wihnar
    Well, I stand up next to your mommy, chop her down with the edge of my wihnar!

  14. No by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    no man...
    shit no.

  15. A clarification by voislav98 · · Score: 2, Informative

    The Science Daily article gets stuff a bit wrong. The hydrogen mentioned is not hydrogen it's protons (hydrogen without the electron), which are accelareted by the Suns magnetic field. Helium, being a neutral atom, is much less affected by the magnetic field and it moves much slower than the charged protons. Now, charged particles have a very high probability of colliding with a neutral atom (much highr than the neutral atom has), so protons will keep colliding with helium which will slow them down. The analogy is the bumper cars, except helium is a bumper 18-wheeler. So basically, the speed of fast protons will be reduced to the speed of the slow helium atoms by all these collisions. Why is this making the /. is beyond me, not the sort of sensationalist "we're all doomed" or "we're going to be OK" stuff.

    1. Re:A clarification by cswiger · · Score: 1

      The hydrogen mentioned is not hydrogen it's protons (hydrogen without the electron), which are accelareted by the Suns magnetic field.

      True, but a bare proton rapidly latches onto any nearby atoms which have an electron cloud to form a very strong ionic bond, forming something like HeH+ (prefered) or H2H+ from the stuff likely to be readily available in the solar wind.

      Here on Earth, a bare proton is the acid part of (water-based) chemistry-- stuff like H2SO4 or HF, etc, lose a proton and it latches onto a nearby water molecule to make H2OH+ [plus several more (H2O)s clustering to that]. Anyway, so long as the proton/hydrogen atom stays ionized, the atom it's hanging out with is going to be dragged along with it when the proton gets accelerated by the Sun's magnetic fields, flares, and all of that cool stuff.

      I'd imagine that as drag slows the faster-moving gas in the wind, each molecule will have more and more time for a free electron to show up from the huge amperage in the solar arcs & flares, and de-ionize the bare proton.

      Why is this making the /. is beyond me"

      Hmm. I gather that the editor thought that topics related to the Sun would have a certain rarity factor for your typical pale Slashdot geek. :-) Besides, if you RTA, you'd notice that they said understanding this kinda plasma stuff would help us here make better large-screen plasma displays and perhaps laptop screens and so forth.

      Solar Plasma => Better Computer Displays ought to parse OK here on /.

      --
      "The human race's favorite method for being in control of the facts is to ignore them." -Celia Green
    2. Re:A clarification by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except that apparently high velocity solar wind has more helium which goes against your explanation in a way (the more helium there is the slower the solar wind should be).

    3. Re:A clarification by Zancarius · · Score: 1

      The Science Daily article gets stuff a bit wrong.

      It isn't directly their fault. This article is a reprint of the MIT press release. Admittedly, it's just as embarrassingly pathetic. SD must be hard-pressed for stories to be reaching into the press release bin for rubbish written as poorly as this...

      --
      He who has no .plan has small finger. ~ Confucius on UNIX
    4. Re:A clarification by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's normal (at least in astrophysics) to use the name of the atom even when they're ionized. That makes the naming scheme simpler, we just start at the first atom and count upwards. In the solar wind, the ionization of the atom is a given anyway because of the high temperature and low density.

      Regarding the acceleration by a magnetic field: could you please give a "back of the envelope" calculation for its strength and direction? I don't think it works the way you think it does ;)

  16. The truth by theTrueMikeBrown · · Score: 1

    I did my own study. I ran around breathing helium. I ended up forgetting where I was and falling over. My conclusion is that the wind is slower when it contains Helium because the hydrogen is breathing it, and therefore incapacitated by it.

    --
    The new MSV alpha
  17. Contextual Google Ads for this Post by TranscendentalAnarch · · Score: 1
    What is up with google's contextual ads? This was the first one of the three I saw when I opened this. The creationists must really be getting desperate.

    God's Design Curriculum
    Creation Science based program Elementary through Middle School
    url-removed.com Next thing you know they'll have online creationist universities where you can get your degree in just 10 weeks! Apply now!
    1. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I thought it only took 7 days :(
      (and you know, a lot of money)

    2. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by Fezzick · · Score: 1

      No silly... you can get your degree in 6 days!

    3. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think they're getting desperate, they're getting bolder. A bunch of Creationists with too much money and time on their hands just opened a state-of-the-art Creation Museum in Kentucky where you can see dinosaurs sailing happily away on Noah's Ark. According to one article I read, they have an exhibit explaining that all animals (even dinosaurs like T-Rex) were vegetarians before Eve ate that apple and got everybody kicked out of the Garden of Eden.

      The same people who built this museum are probably working on setting up those online creationist universities as I type this horribly off-topic comment.

      To bring this back on-topic, stories like this one about scientists studying the composition of the solar wind are totally out of the world view of Creationists. The Bible doesn't talk about hydrogen or helium or say that it's okay for us mere mortals to send scientific instruments up into the heavens on a spacecraft. Not only would a Creationist not understand this discovery about the solar wind, they would probably say that the evil mad scientists involved are working for the Devil and trying to mislead us.

    4. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by cswiger · · Score: 1

      I can easily believe a creationist would read "6 days to get a degree" literally as "6 years" in practice, but then they'd could simply believe that the time felt like it was "six eons", and it would all work out exactly as God (or the Holy Noodly Appendage) planned it.

      --
      "The human race's favorite method for being in control of the facts is to ignore them." -Celia Green
    5. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      Next thing you know they'll have online creationist universities where you can get your degree in just 10 weeks! Apply now!


      Bob Jones University Online?
    6. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by nelsonal · · Score: 1

      In the fine print it says see 2 Peter 3:8.

      --
      Degaussing scares the bad magnetism out of the monitor and fills it with good karma.
    7. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      10 Weeks? How about 6 days?

    8. Re:Contextual Google Ads for this Post by azenpunk · · Score: 1

      after that they'll fasttrack it to 6 days, graduation is on the 7th.

  18. What really matters is... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Can I use this to do the Kessel Run any faster?

  19. Boring Weather by Hoi+Polloi · · Score: 1

    The problem with solar weather is that every day is the same, hot and sunny.

    --
    It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
  20. The relevant quote... by FuzzyDaddy · · Score: 2, Informative
    "At the minimum speed--the speed where the solar wind is no longer able to drag out helium--the solar wind itself can't escape either," said Dr. Keith Ogilvie.

    --
    It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
  21. From TFA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "At the minimum speed--the speed where the solar wind is no longer able to drag out helium--the solar wind itself can't escape either," said Dr. Keith Ogilvie.

  22. Re:Helium is a byproduct of wind speed, not cataly by Zancarius · · Score: 2, Informative

    I have to agree with this sentiment. The article seems to have been targeted at a fifth grade reading level (or below) and was quite painful to read. It isn't Science Daily's fault, however, as it appears the article was not an "adaptation" but rather a blatant reprint of the original press release. Oh, silly me, I forgot one minor detail: Adaptations are little more than a copy and paste away!

    The WIND-SWE group appears to have links to some of the papers they have presented. I'm not sure of the relevancy but it might make for a worthwhile read to curious minds.

    --
    He who has no .plan has small finger. ~ Confucius on UNIX
  23. Eat your heart out by OriginalArlen · · Score: 1

    Johnny Fartpants.

    --

    Everything I needed to know about life, I learnt from Blake's Seven
    1. Re:Eat your heart out by datastrategy · · Score: 1

      No doubt you'll appreciate this thought, Johnny Fartpants. Instead of trying to use helium to throttle solar wind, how about we put it to some really good use as a throttle for gastric wind. Could first experiment on those bovine fart factories, AKA cows, to test how well the method works (and as a further interesting side effect, after they inhale the helium, we can get a good laugh from listening to their high pitched "moos"). Assuming everything works out as planned with the cows, then we can try it out on humans -- the old windbag (blowing strong at both ends) who lives next door to me would be a good place to start.

  24. About the researcher... by Theory+of+Everything · · Score: 2, Interesting

    By the way, the lead researcher happens to be one of the guys reappearing yearly on slashdot as the students who built a breeder reactor for the University of Chicago Scavenger Hunt.

  25. British TV by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    British television sketch show 'The Fast Show'; one of the sketches involves a weather presenter referring to todays weather as 'Scorchio!'

    As to *why* it's funny, don't look at me.