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Open Source Set-Top-Box Adds YouTube Support

Posted by Zonk on from the for-all-of-your-wow-pvp-video-needs dept.

mrspin writes "Media streaming boxes such as the AppleTV, XBox 360, PS3, and products from Netgear do a varying job of bridging the gap between the PC and television as well as, in some cases, delivering Internet content directly into the living room. But all are closed systems. The result of which is that users are left trying to hack these devices against the wishes of manufacturers or have to make-do with whatever official features are implemented. Bucking this trend, Neuros is taking a wholly different approach, and has open-sourced the firmware for its Neuros OSD media center, meaning that anybody is free to write add-ons that extend the device's functionality. This week the company announced that thanks to the open-source community, the device now lets users browse, search and view the entire YouTube catalog."

88 comments

  1. Dont we have this? by ampmouse · · Score: 2, Informative

    This sounds alot like MythTV with special hardware!

    1. Re:Dont we have this? by Yoooder · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ...no... Neuros is _hardware_ whereas MythTV is _software_ Granted, Neuros has and uses software, and with external storage could perform functions similar to MythTV. But it is much much broader than MythTV.

    2. Re:Dont we have this? by Lumpy · · Score: 1, Insightful

      so in other words, you need a complete PC AND this box. sounds like a worse combo as the software is windows only.

      Why dont they stop the silly special software crap and simply make the dang things play from a SMB share and call it done? Why the stupid streaming crap or silly VNC tricks like the Hauppage Media MVP?

      I am so tired of this media appliances that require "special" software or use the stupid Upnp protocols that simply suck to high heaven.

      Is SMB that fricking hard?

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    3. Re:Dont we have this? by XMyth · · Score: 2, Insightful

      AMEN!

      Lack of SMB is the only thing keeping me from switching from XBMC to something that supports HD.

      If Neuros only supported HD then I'd keep an eye on this latest development for some kind of SMB support...but without HD it has no chance of competing with XBMC.

    4. Re:Dont we have this? by tepples · · Score: 4, Funny

      Lack of SMB is the only thing keeping me from switching from XBMC to something that supports HD. If you want SMB, get a Wii. It can handle the old SMB and the new SMB.
    5. Re:Dont we have this? by XMyth · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hah....you had my hopes up...bastard. True, a modded xbox does only support the old SMB.

    6. Re:Dont we have this? by twistedsymphony · · Score: 1

      so in other words, you need a complete PC AND this box. sounds like a worse combo as the software is windows only.
      That's what I thought at first as well... but after visiting the official website and reading through it... it sounds like it can function as a stand alone DVR. It simply needs a storage medium such as an external usb harddrive or Flash memory or it can store it's files on a networked drive/on some other computer. No idea if it actually does schedules like a Tivo or something else

      I've been looking for a cheap (sub $300) solution for digital timeshifting and was considering trying to build a SageTV box using mostly spare parts an a cheap fanless mobo/processor combo. And reading this I started to think it would be a great alternative until I realized that the quality is generally crap. It only supports Composite video out, and S-video in for recording Meaning it doesn't actually have a tuner, so it relies on some other device to handle that (also meaning it probably can't do scheduling either). Once you start considering that it's really mostly crap IMO.

      Before I'd consider buying one It needs:
      -S-Video out (preferably Component and or HDMI)
      -A built in Tuner and Scheduling capabilities
      -At least a slot for a 3.5" IDE hard drive so I dump my own drive in there instead of having some ulgy external POS hanging off the thing.

      Also if they made it look like a DVD player/Receiver or some other piece of home theater equipment rather than a mini satellite dish I'd be more likely to buy one.
      --
      Collector's Edition
    7. Re:Dont we have this? by JoeBorn · · Score: 1

      The OSD does support SMB. It's supports SMB as a client for browsing other shares (as well as NFS). In addition, within the next month, it will be able to act as an SMB server. Attach an external hard drive and it'll act like a media server so to speak (sort of a PVR +NAS). In addition, some users have enabled an FTP server on the device, so you can pull your recordings off it from outside the LAN.

      --
      If you're going through hell, keep going -Winston Churchill
    8. Re:Dont we have this? by Holmwood · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How is this insightful? Did you even spend 10 seconds looking at the article or the device?

      sounds like a worse combo as the software is windows only.

      No, the product is Linux based, as in:

      The world's first open source Linux-based embedded media center
      (see http://www.neurosaudio.com/osd/osd.asp [neurosaudio.com])

      Why dont they stop the silly special software crap and simply make the dang things play from a SMB share

      Here's the awesome thing about open source. You want it to play from an SMB share? Go ahead and write it or ask someone to! I know, I know. Linux is obviously "silly special software crap" to you. Fair enough.

      And... guess what? Someone did.

      http://wiki.neurostechnology.com/index.php/OSD_Pro jects#Samba_Client_.28for_Windows_shares.29

      Now, why would you not want it to only play from SMB shares? Other people may want to be able to plug in their iPods, or FAT32-flash cards, or whatever. Personally, having to dump all my holiday photos to a remote server in some other room to have a slideshow is annoying for me; I'd much rather just plug in my camera or its memory card.

      Indeed, other people may want to hook up to youtube without requiring other specialized hardware in the house.

      I am so tired of this media appliances that require "special" software or use the stupid Upnp protocols that simply suck to high heaven.

      OK. You're tired of open source linux, because that's "silly special software". Fair enough. You're tired of any custom firmware in general. If I'm to take you at your word, you're tired of media PC's, ApplesTVs, iPods, MP-3 players, TV's (they have firmware too), PVR's, modern stereos. Sorry about "special software". Again, if you're really being sincere, I suggest you try an old TV from the 1970's; it might not have any software in it. Add an 8-track player and a sweet 60's solid-state amp, and you'll have no "silly special software" to worry about.

      As for UPnP protocols, I can cheerfully agree with you there.

      Is SMB that fricking hard?

      For you? I'd have to say yes, based on the above.

      Now, to other readers (and sorry, perhaps I should have ignored the guy, but when someone was modding him insightful and others were replying in the same tone... well, it made the discussion worse than useless)... He was saying stuff that was flatly false and being applauded for it.

      Back to the general concept: does this device actually make sense? A $249 embedded Linux device with some nice features that is upgradeable and open-sourced (on the software side)?

      Maybe. It probably doesn't make sense if you have a MythTV device hooked up. Or a Tivo/really good PVR. Or, as others have mentioned, an XBMC (Xbox Media Center). Or are HD.

      Personally, I'm intrigued, but a potential deal breaker for me is the presumed lack of upscaling in the device. It's doubtful it has the spare cpu capacity to process that in software. Apart from that, with the network connectivity, and extendability, it's tempting.

      I just have to admit I'm a bit dismayed. We all talk about Open Source here and slam MS (often rightly so). When a company comes out that is Open Source and is doing something rather unique and interesting -- not just letting its users hack the hardware, but inviting them to, guys like this jump up and down about "silly special software" and get modded insightful.

      -Holmwood
    9. Re:Dont we have this? by Cylix · · Score: 1

      I built my single tuner box for the cost of the tuner. I had a fairly nice small form factor box serving up video with a dxr3 (em8300) already. The box itself cost me nothing as I did some favors for a local computer shop. (they had a complex client).

      Now, my solution is pretty, but you could probably find a decent older p3 or p4 box and stick a pvr350 on it. Run it headless after the install with serial support or frame buffer console for booting issues. For X needs, I run vnc on the little bugger.

      I've begun investing a bit more time in it and the next incarnation will be a little more expensive. I have a dual tuner waiting to go and I'll probably pick up a QAM tuner. (something HDC5000 I think?). I'm probably going to drop the 350 as the output device and use an nvidia card.

      Either way, the setup can be complex, simple, cheap or even expensive. It really depends on how evil you want your mythbox.

      I haven't tried sage in a while, but MythTV is setup fairly nicely now.

      --
      "You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
    10. Re:Dont we have this? by The_Wilschon · · Score: 1

      Ahhh thanks for the links. I used to play SMB at my friend's house, and thanks to wikipedia, I just discovered Neverball. Well, we can all guess who won't be getting anything useful done this weekend!

      --
      SIGSEGV caught, terminating

      wait... not that kind of sig.
    11. Re:Dont we have this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are full of shit. Yes he is right that devices like this should need NOTHING but an ethernet jack and have it pointed at the PC with the video files shared. IT DOES NOT DO THAT without hacks. (I am certian he is talking OTB here.)

      Also It's playback sucks. if you stop a video playback and restart it later it DOES NOT start where you left off. WTF is that? it's because the thing is incredibly underpowered. The company is embracing Open source because the product is dying and badly designed. It wont play most mpeg4 files.

      There are hard drive enclosures that cost less that do more than this does (HD anyone? how about 720p?) and does way more.

      OP is dead on, you are simply a modded up troll who prides himself in being an asshole.

      BTW Apple TV does suck. it requires itunes. and most DECENT mp3 players act as a usb storage device so you dont need any bullshit software to use it.

    12. Re:Dont we have this? by Holmwood · · Score: 1
      Glad to see you posted using your name and logical arguments without any ad hominem attacks. Clearly you are not the OP. No chance.

      As I said, some of us like the idea of plugging in memory cards, iPods, MP3 players and playing the media off those. You obviously think that's a step backwards. Fair enough.

      And I've no idea what the OOB experience on this is. If you do, great. Enlighten us, AC who is NOT the OP.

      The company is embracing Open source because the product is dying and badly designed.
      IIRC, they embraced open source from the beginning. I guess they did so because they time-travelled back after they found their product was, according to some AC who is not the OP, 'dying'?

      There are hard drive enclosures that cost less that do more than this does (HD anyone? how about 720p?) and does way more.

      OK, please show me a sub-$249 hard drive enclosure that will plug into my TV and does everything this box does as well as HD. 1080 or 720, I don't care. I'd like to buy it. Seriously. Show it to me. I want to buy it, because that sounds (unlike this product) exactly what I need. I've never yet found such a thing, but you say it exists. I believe you, because you're an AC who is not the OP. Show us.

      OP is dead on, you are simply a modded up troll who prides himself in being an asshole.

      OP stated it was windows software. It was Linux.

      OP stated it should do SMB. It does. Yes, OK, it needs a firmware update. Sorry if that's too difficult for you.

      OP stated a bunch of things that were simply flatly demonstrably false. I corrected his bizarre assertions.

      Indeed I stated that I suspected this device wasn't adequate because of the lack of HD and (probable) lack of processing power. You seem to agree, but think I'm full of 'shit'. Hmm... guess you're just illogical, AC who is not the OP.

      Anyway, happy long weekend if you're US or Canadian.
    13. Re:Dont we have this? by timeOday · · Score: 1

      Now, my solution is pretty, but you could probably find a decent older p3 or p4 box and stick a pvr350 on it.
      It's possible. (Heck I did it years ago and still use it). But the Internet is not going to be a widely adopted platform for delivering video until people can buy something that works out of the box and plug it into their TV. It just amazes me how long it's taking for that to happen. Why haven't TiVo and Netflix teamed up and just made it happen? Or maybe Blockbuster, don't they have the clout to push out a branded PVR that can deliver content without a trip to the store?
    14. Re:Dont we have this? by LordSnooty · · Score: 1

      How come none of the downloads work, is this the most elaborate hoax I've ever seen? Pity as it looks good. Some comment on GPL software? What's the deal here?

    15. Re:Dont we have this? by The_Wilschon · · Score: 1

      There's an up to date package in the ubuntu repositories (universe).

      --
      SIGSEGV caught, terminating

      wait... not that kind of sig.
  2. What a heading/title! by bogaboga · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Open Source Set-Top-Box Adds YouTube Support...

    An individual who is not that connected to the internet might think Youtube is an application...or is it?

    You see, we are used to hearing support for "platforms" or software. Maybe I am wrong on this...!

    1. Re:What a heading/title! by semiotec · · Score: 3, Informative

      "An individual who is not that connected to the internet" probably wouldn't be reading Slashdot anyway.

    2. Re:What a heading/title! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Mario's enemy was Bowser, not browser.

    3. Re:What a heading/title! by MrCopilot · · Score: 1
      An individual who is not that connected to the internet might think Youtube is an application...or is it?

      If the article was in the WSJ you might have a point. But even the WSJ has informed the world of youtube, thanks to google buying them, and lawsuits and such.

      Pretty much a household word now.

      --
      OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
  3. PS3 not all that closed by androvsky · · Score: 2, Informative

    Yes, the RSX can't be used in ps3 linux, but the Cell can be, and Sony encourages the installation of linux on the ps3. All that's lacking are apps that take advantage of the cell fully, and I've been talking to people who are working on it. Several patches are available, just waiting to be included with various media players.

    1. Re:PS3 not all that closed by FudRucker · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Slackintosh?

      http://workaround.ch/

      --
      Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
    2. Re:PS3 not all that closed by Ant+P. · · Score: 1

      That's nice. Wake me up when they can run a blank X session at native HD res without the mouse skipping.

    3. Re:PS3 not all that closed by samkass · · Score: 1

      Why, can the Neuros (the subject of this article) do that? It sure doesn't look like it.

      I think it's pretty disingenuous of Neuros to claim that running custom software is 'hacking' the PS3 'against the wishes' of Sony when Sony provides a linux distro and switching to it is in the built-in menus.

      --
      E pluribus unum
    4. Re:PS3 not all that closed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh big baby just use a tabbed wm.

  4. Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by jmorris42 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Last time I looked, the box had no onboard storage, no component, DVI or HDMI i/o and not nearly enough compute power to need HD outputs. In other words it is an SD device is an HD world, and an underspecced device for a lot of SD uses. The lack of even an S-Video output was when I stopped reading. USB1 is also pathetic these days.

    Having brought out a product the manufacturer couldn't think of a use for they threw magic "Open Source" pixie dust on it hoping we could think of things to do with it. Which is better than nothing, but why not give us a slightly more commercially viable platform to work with?

    --
    Democrat delenda est
    1. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by stabiesoft · · Score: 4, Interesting

      agreed, this box woulda been something 10 years ago. Now though with no HD, its a joke. I have a Roku that was doing HD 5 years ago. I'm looking for a replacement and some of the the new stuff from netgear/linksys looks promising, but obviously if it was hackable it would be better. Hopefully Neuros will come out with an HD offering.

    2. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by Warbothong · · Score: 1

      "In other words it is an SD device is an HD world" Thank you for the broad generalisation :) -- Someone who doesn't rot their brain with TV and computer games

    3. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by kharchenko · · Score: 1

      Would love to see more links. I am getting a new HD TV and would like to get something expandable that can play movies/music/etc. I was thinking about Mac Mini, but it doesn't look like they're going to update it (to better processor and HDMI) any time soon. I wonder what alternatives people think there are.

    4. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by timmarhy · · Score: 1

      dvi is pin compatable with HDMI, just get a dvi - hdmi cable.

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    5. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by wall0159 · · Score: 1

      1. It's been "Open Source" from the beginning, as are _all_ of Neuros' products. It's not "pixie dust" that they've added in the hope of increasing sales.

      2. USB1 is fine for external storage. People stream video across networks for Christ's sake!

      Lack of HD is not, in my opinion, a big problem, but it's becoming one.. But yeah, lack of s-video is a prob. Especially now that the AppleTV is out, and will soon run MythTV, a much more mature system. Unfortunately, development of the Neuros OSD has just taken too long, and it has been overtaken by other developments.

    6. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by Qwavel · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I disagree.

      nothing I watch is HD. Nothing I download is HD. And YouTube certainly isn't HD. So how is this an HD world?

      I'm assuming that you (and many others) have HD TV, but this box is not meant for watching TV on.

      Regarding the onboard storage, why would I want that? With USB ports and Ethernet I can add storage to the OSD in many easy ways. Built-in storage would be inflexible and would increase the cost.

    7. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by Blakey+Rat · · Score: 2, Informative

      2. USB1 is fine for external storage. People stream video across networks for Christ's sake!

      The typical home network is 100mbit. USB 1 operates at 1.5mbit. It's designed for mice, keyboards, printers and scanners, not streaming video. USB2 is fine for streaming video, but saying that USB 1 is fine because people "stream video across networks!" is ridiculous.

      --
      Comment of the year
    8. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by Mike89 · · Score: 1

      People stream video across networks for Christ's sake!
      The theoretical maximum of USB1 is like 11-12 mbps I believe. Networks are typically (wired that is) 100.
    9. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      1. It's been "Open Source" from the beginning, as are _all_ of Neuros' products. It's not "pixie dust" that they've added in the hope of increasing sales.


      Except that it has a DSP, programmed with tools that cost a large amount of money. It can be "Open Source", but it's gonna cost you to actually do anything with it. At least Neuros' other products had easily available development tools.

      As for AppleTV - well, Apple doesn't really care what you do with it. They make money off every AppleTV sold, and as long as you don't break it and try to claim warranty afterwards, they don't care. Just helps to disable the recovery software so your hacked AppleTV won't decide it failed to boot and restore from its update partition. IIRC, people have Linux running on the AppleTV.
    10. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by eihab · · Score: 1

      If I knew this device existed 4 months ago I would have probably bought one.

      I have a nearly complete MythTV box (just need TV out) in my living room now. I spent around $120 for the Happauge 150 card which only does TV in. I also shelled out around another $100 for a 250GB hard drive (numbers maybe skewed a little, weak memory). This device is a little over $200 which is about what I spent so far on my box (other than the box itself which I'm counting as $0 since I already had it and had no need for it).

      I don't have Cable or a HD ready TV, but I'd like to be able to have PVR features with broadcast TV to record the shows that I always miss when I'm at work or even just being able to pause TV when my wife interrupts.

      Actually come to think of it, I think I'm doing the MythTV thing for the tinkering fun, but I would have still paid for this a few months back.

      --
      If you can't mod them join them.
    11. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by asdfghjklqwertyuiop · · Score: 1

      This Neuros box only has composite video out. Component or S-Video would be substantially better even for SD stuff.

      The onboard USB is USB1, which is useless for video.

    12. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by evilviper · · Score: 1

      The lack of even an S-Video output was when I stopped reading. USB1 is also pathetic these days. Having brought out a product the manufacturer couldn't think of a use for they threw magic "Open Source" pixie dust on it hoping we could think of things to do with it.

      Sad but true. It doesn't appear to even have a TV tuner, just a video capture card you have to hook up to something else and use the IR blaster...

      It cost $250 for all the capability you'd find in my PC in 1998, a $500/400Mhz K6 with a ($40) ATI Rage Pro card (composite input/output)*... And that at least had a 10GB HDD. All together, a system that is likely to go for $50 on eBay these days.

      *Admittedly I didn't have an IR remote or blaster, but remotes are free, and the sensor/blaster is maybe $10 worth of components.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    13. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by reezle · · Score: 1

      DVI has no audio signal, though.

    14. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by karmatic · · Score: 1

      For those of us with receivers (and a TV/Monitor that doesn't pass it through), that can be a good thing.

      Personally, I run all my audio optically (at least as far as I can - haven't seen optical speakers yet).

    15. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by dwater · · Score: 1

      > People stream video across networks for Christ's sake! ...and I'm sure He's very grateful.

      --
      Max.
    16. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by JoeBorn · · Score: 1

      It's USB 1.1 theoretical max 11mbit, in practice it's not that fast, but it is fast enough to stream SD video, I do it all the time.

      --
      If you're going through hell, keep going -Winston Churchill
    17. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by JoeBorn · · Score: 1

      Except that it has a DSP, programmed with tools that cost a large amount of money. It can be "Open Source", but it's gonna cost you to actually do anything with it. At least Neuros' other products had easily available development tools. Well, it has an ARM9 core (where linux and all the application software runs) and an API to the DSP functionality so there's plenty that can be done with out the proprietary tools ( in fact, the typical Neuros hacker doesn't have any proprietary tools). In addition, Neuros is also working to get free tools for those that want to develop for the DSP.
      --
      If you're going through hell, keep going -Winston Churchill
    18. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by jp10558 · · Score: 1

      IDK, there's an aweful lot of people with SDTV. Now whether those people would be interested in a box like this... I have no idea.

      --
      Opera, Proxomitron-Grypen,GPG 0x0A1C6EE3
    19. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by mshurpik · · Score: 1

      >Which is better than nothing, but why not give us a slightly more commercially viable platform to work with?

      I agree, Neuro's website goes out of its way to not mention Tivo. Since Tivo is what I have now, I'm looking to upgrade, not downgrade to a Neuros box with no storage.

    20. Re:Interesting idea, now do it with useful gear by irc.goatse.cx+troll · · Score: 1

      I don't have Cable or a HD ready TV, but I'd like to be able to have PVR features with broadcast TV to record the shows that I always miss when I'm at work or even just being able to pause TV when my wife interrupts.


      You could just torrent the tv episodes automatically to the box. Assuming you're watching stuff late anyways, the only real difference is you'll automatically have no comercials and likely better quality.

      I've been debating getting an HDTV but really, paying Time Warner extra just for HD channels seems silly. I won't bother investing in HDTV until I can afford a nice HTPC able to feed whatever hidef content I can get on its harddrive.
      --
      Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
  5. Already taken care of by AragornSonOfArathorn · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My Wii "set-top box" works great with YouTube, thankyouverymuch :-)

    --
    sudo eat my shorts
    1. Re:Already taken care of by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      Mine too. I'm actually posting this from my Wii.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    2. Re:Already taken care of by XMyth · · Score: 2, Funny

      Is it hard to type with your Wii?

    3. Re:Already taken care of by Wordsmith · · Score: 3, Funny

      Not if you're a hunt-and-pecker.

    4. Re:Already taken care of by laffer1 · · Score: 1

      hard: no. Time consuming: yes. The Wii can even handle Flash 7 content. It can not store anything locally though.

      --
      MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
    5. Re:Already taken care of by sadler121 · · Score: 1

      wow...if that isn't a perfect example of slashdot being a haven for those with geek syndrome I don't know what is.

    6. Re:Already taken care of by laffer1 · · Score: 1

      Calling someone autistic isn't cool.

      --
      MidnightBSD: The BSD for Everyone
    7. Re:Already taken care of by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah but it's getting easier every day.

  6. my new LCD HDTV by FudRucker · · Score: 1

    I recently bought a LCD HDTV that is PC compatible, I am still thinking about what to add to it, I wanted more than a DVD player, I have been thinking of just building a PC with a DVD-RW & mythTV, but this or something like this sure sounds cool...

    --
    Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
  7. PS3 open enough for a media center by jmorris42 · · Score: 1

    > Yes, the RSX can't be used in ps3 linux...

    This is true, 3D support is the only think Sony is holding out on and you don't need that for a media center. They do give you direct YUV video modes at all of the standard HD modes and that is probably good enough. Especially with all those Cell units available to do de-interlacing, upscaling, onscreen display overlays or whatever else needs doing.

    $600 for a kick ass myth front end isn't unreasonable on it's own. Compare and contrast to putting together an EPIA and compare how useful each would be as a front end. The EPIA would be (almost) equally useless at 3D, have far far less CPU power and unless you spent serious coin on a case wouldn't look as good. On the other hand the EPIA is mostly x86 compatible, meaning it can run all of the plugins and external codecs and can actually run MythTV today. So today it is advantage EPIA, tomorrow....?

    --
    Democrat delenda est
  8. Set-top box? No. PVR, maybe. by SeaFox · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If this device doesn't have a cablecard slot or any other way of descrambling encrypted digital channels, I don't know how it qualifies as a "set top box" except in the fact it can sit on top of a CRT television. Using this logic, the clock radio on top of my TV is a "set top box" as well.

  9. Inaccurate article by Have+Blue · · Score: 2, Informative

    The article complaining about the AppleTV is over a month old, and too old to point out that the AppleTV now has an official, fully-supported YouTube browser.

    1. Re:Inaccurate article by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      Not to mention that YouTube is switching over to H.264, can't wait to see what all the current "YouTube apps" will do.

    2. Re:Inaccurate article by BungaDunga · · Score: 1

      I don't think it would make much difference to the XBMC Youtube script as XBMC supports H.264 already.

    3. Re:Inaccurate article by Yvan256 · · Score: 1

      Isn't it ironic that a modded/custom install of the first Xbox can play H.264 but the Xbox 360 cannot? (unless I missed something, and even then I'd need external USB drives, and it's too late anyway since I bought a 40GB AppleTV).

  10. Xbox Media Center by anonobomber · · Score: 1

    We've had this functionality on an "open source" platform for a long time now with Xbox Media Center (XBMC).

  11. youtube on TV? by kbox · · Score: 1

    I dunno.. watching someone get his in the groin with a football just isn't the same if it's not on a computer screen

    --
    God Be Gone
    1. Re:youtube on TV? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, you could always watch this guy ringing a bell...

  12. Xbox Media Center... by steppin_razor_LA · · Score: 1

    Open source project. Plays just about everything. The only real bummer is that it really can't hack 1080 very well, but it handles 720P just fine.

    I'm not sure that there is a world of difference between Component and DVI and/or HDMI in quality. If someone would just work out a relatively easy way to upgrade the CPU/memory of the Xbox, I doubt that anyone would be able to do much better for quite some time...

    --
    Evolution: love it or leave it
    1. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The only real bummer is that it really can't hack 1080 very well, but it handles 720P just fine.

      I'm assuming you're talking about 720p mpeg-2 streams. How's it handle 720p x.264?

    2. Re:Xbox Media Center... by steve86-ed · · Score: 1

      I'm assuming you're talking about 720p mpeg-2 streams. How's it handle 720p x.264?

      It doesn't play any x.264 (really H.264, x.264 is used to make H.264 videos) media very well, not even low bitrate/low resolution. Keep in mind that XBMC does have the software support, but the processor just can't handle the decompression so it plays back way too choppily to be watchable. If, like GP post suggested that the proc and ram were easily upgraded, it may be able to handle the job.
    3. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Out of curiosity, do you have to do any modding or anything that is (technically) illegal in the US to get the xbmc up and running?

      On my own HD DVR and HDTV, I see zero quality difference between Component and HDMI. I guess it comes down to the quality of the digital-to-analog converter in the DVR vs. the one in the TV, and for my gear they are indistinguishable.

    4. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Aladrin · · Score: 1

      Yes, you do. Even the software mod for the XBox is illegal as you are circumventing copyright protection. Any XBox that can run XBMC can also run copied software.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    5. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Ogi_UnixNut · · Score: 1

      Yes, you do. Even the software mod for the XBox is illegal as you are circumventing copyright protection. Any XBox that can run XBMC can also run copied software.

      Actually no, it is not all illegal. Hacking/modding the xbox is not illegal (at least not where I live, and to the best of my knowledge (IANAL) under the DMCA it is not illegal, provided you are not doing it to commit copyright infringement). What is illegal is installing a hacked BIOS which allows you to run pirated games.

      The XBMC and Xbox Linux projects actually use an open-source, clean room implementation of the Microsoft BIOS. It allows you to run homebrew projects, but it does not allow you to play back pirated games (If you load up one of the hacked Microsoft BIOS'es, then you can run pretty much anything under the sun). Because of this Microsoft were unable to shut out the projects, and I am sure they would like to as it competes with their media centre PC and XBOX360.

      Regarding parent posters question. Yes, it is possible to upgrade the Xbox. Indeed there is a company that offers Xbox modding (or buy pre-modded Xboxes), with a new 1.4GHZ Pentium III CPU, and up to 512MB ram (I think).

      Of course if you are handy with an soldering iron, have a steady hand and quite a bit of free time, you could probably upgrade the CPU and RAM yourself, it is possible to do it, but I would not recommend it. I don't know the requirements of h.264 decoding, but I think a 1.4GHz machine should be able to do decoding at least.

    6. Re:Xbox Media Center... by mshurpik · · Score: 1

      >I'm not sure that there is a world of difference between Component and DVI and/or HDMI in quality.

      Well, if anything, component would be better, or the same. Component is 5 wires (3 video, 2 audio).

      The question is how much difference is there for Composite, since composite (RCA) is what this box supports now.

    7. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, if anything, component would be better, or the same. Component is 5 wires (3 video, 2 audio).

      Total non-sequitur. Generally, carrying the signal in it's digital format as far as possible before converting to analog is an advantage. In practice, there may be no difference. In no case is component better than HDMI unless you factor in other non-quality issues, like HDCP problems or the relative expense of cables.

      The question is how much difference is there for Composite, since composite (RCA) is what this box supports now.

      Now you're on the money. The quality of composite is detectably below that of HDMI (or component for that matter).
    8. Re:Xbox Media Center... by steppin_razor_LA · · Score: 1

      HDMI > DVI > Component > Svideo > Composite

      I don't think it is even possible to push HD resolutions out on composite

      Component is just 3 wires. Audio is independent. Optical audio outputs are only one cable. i.e. my xbox is connected using 4 cables ...

      --
      Evolution: love it or leave it
    9. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Civil_Disobedient · · Score: 1

      If someone would just work out a relatively easy way to upgrade the CPU/memory of the Xbox, I doubt that anyone would be able to do much better for quite some time.

      FriendTech used to have an X-BOX with more RAM and a faster processor. If memory serves, it was a 1.4 Ghz. Celeron (twice as fast as the stock box). It didn't take off because at the time people were just interested in gaming performance, but some games were hard-coded to expect a certain (slower) processor speed, thus games were sped-up and unplayable.

      They made a conversion kit for the CPU upgrade after their systems didn't sell, but I haven't been able to get to their site in quite some time. I even tried sending emails out to anyone and everyone involved in the project, but no luck.

      If anyone has a FriendTech 1.4 XBOX they'd like to sell, please send me an email. :)

    10. Re:Xbox Media Center... by Civil_Disobedient · · Score: 1

      The question is how much difference is there for Composite, since composite (RCA) is what this box supports now.

      There's been an HD breakout box for the original XBOX since its inception. You can get a convincing knock-off of the original (probably made in Taiwan or Korea) that works just as well for $10.00 (USD) on eBay (the real McCoy's from Microsoft go for more than $100 in some places). That gives you HD output. Plug one of these (~$20 depending where you go) in the HD pack connector and you have optical 5.1 DD output.

      Good luck getting the 700 Mhz. processor to handle 1080i. I've gotten XBMC to boot, but we're talking video rates in the single digits for most HD content. Most I've gotten is 720p, and that's full xvid encoding (or Matroska, or just about anything else you can think of). Not bad for such old hardware.

      The other thing I like about the XBOX/XBMC as a multimedia solution is that you really don't need a lot of crap in your living room. One box should do it all--movies, music... whatever. I always hated the whole "television + reciever + dvd player + xbox + pre-amp + speakers" look where half your living room looks like an alter to the gods of Home Audio.

      The XBMC guys are clever coders (I recall an attempt to use the GPU to try and aid in decoding video streams). The problem is that they are die-hard, attached-to-the-hip classic XBOX fanatics. You can't even start to talk to them about porting to another system. They won't do it. End of story. Which means no "true" open HD media box for the foreseeable future (MythTV the sole, sad exception).

    11. Re:Xbox Media Center... by steppin_razor_LA · · Score: 1

      I remember something about that... I suppose since I don't play any games on my old xbox any more that the game performance wouldn't matter. I wonder if they still sell the conversion kits...

      --
      Evolution: love it or leave it
    12. Re:Xbox Media Center... by mshurpik · · Score: 1

      >HDMI > DVI > Component > Svideo > Composite

      I'm not sure that a small form-factor wire like HDMI or DVI would have better quality than three big, fat Component wires, but I have to say...HDMI has gotten a lot cheaper. Monoprice.com...HDMI 15' $6.50!

      I would have a hard time beating that price even if I made my own component cables.

    13. Re:Xbox Media Center... by steppin_razor_LA · · Score: 1

      DVI + HDMI are digital

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Visual_Interf ace

      --
      Evolution: love it or leave it
  13. Thank you so much! by anubi · · Score: 1
    I have been looking for this for quite some time!

    Its at the top of my bookmarks lists for PVR now. It looks like one helluva neat box.

    Geez, why try to "roll my own" when I can get this? Everything I wanted and then some.

    Tips like this is why I read Slashdot.

    --
    "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." [KJV: I Thessalonians 5:21]

  14. Obsolete - no digital outputs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Please, no more stories of this box until this box is updated for this decade with DVI or HDMI outputs and SPDIF.

  15. Beta version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Here is a beta version of their product in action!

  16. "against the wishes..." bullshit! by posterlogo · · Score: 1

    AppleTV has been repeatedly "hacked" for enhanced functionality, without so much as a whimper or firmware update from Apple. They know what's happening. They like it. They even try to build on it occasionally. Don't lump this set-top box in with the rest-there's absolutely no evidence that they're opposed to user-created functionality.

  17. Re:"against the wishes..." bullshit! by mrchaotica · · Score: 1

    AppleTV has been repeatedly "hacked" for enhanced functionality, without so much as a whimper or firmware update from Apple. They know what's happening. They like it.

    Apple even liked the people that loaded standard OS X, turning it into a cheaper Mac Mini?

    --

    "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

  18. Hey MODERATOR. My PENIS is right here 2 b sucked! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Modded parent redundant? I don't see any redundancy about that, but I do have a big fat choad for you to eat. Suck it.

  19. SageTV has been able to do this... by jbarr · · Score: 1

    SageTV has been able to do this for several months now, and incorporates Google Video as well. Granted, SageTV is not an STB as such (actually an HTPC) but the functionality is there. The up side is access to lots of videos on your TV. The down side is that the video content and quality leaves a lot to be desired.

    --
    My mom always said, "Jim, you're 1 in a million." Given the current population, there are 7000 of me. God help us all!
  20. Re:"against the wishes..." bullshit! by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

    I don't see why not. The CPU is less than half the speed of the Mac Mini, it has less RAM, and no optical drive. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple made as much profit on an AppleTV as a Mac Mini.

    --
    I am TheRaven on Soylent News