X07 Not Happening This Year

For the first time since 2004, there won't be an XO event in Europe this year. Gamespot suggests that Microsoft's annual press event is superfluous this year, as last year it fell directly within the timeframe of the Halo 3 launch. "Speaking on the E3 podcast of Microsoft fan site Squad XP, Xbox Live marketing manager Aaron Greenberg flatly said that 'There's not a real X07 this year.' And while Microsoft's official spokespersons refrained from comment, last night Xbox Live director of programming Larry 'Major Nelson' Hyrb posted a small note (pictured) on his heavily trafficked blog morosely confirming X07's demise."

Comments

WTF is XO?

[Anonymous Coward]

It would have been nice to at least give a short description of what XO is. From the blurb, we do understand it has something to do with Xbox, but for those of us who aren't Microsoft zealots, XO means nothing.

Re:WTF is XO?

[Broken scope]

"X" "07"

Look at the 'X' now look at the MS products, Xbox, Xbox 360, DirectX.

See a pattern there?

Re:WTF is XO?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes I kinda deduced that, Einstein.

That still doesn't explain WTF is an "X event". Is it for the press? The programmers? Gamers?

WTF IS IT?!

Re:WTF is XO?

[PrescriptionWarning]

so its Microsofts fault everybody is using "Xtreme" somewhere in the product name to sell their products... bastards

Re:WTF is XO?

[Yvan256]

And yet Dead or Alive Xtreme Volleyball 2 doesn't seem Xtreme enough to me.

Where's my XXXtreme edition? ;-)

Re:WTF is XO?

[powerlord]

XO is a level of Cognac. MS must have been drinking a lot of it to use the name.

Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

There has been a lot of speculation about Microsoft getting ready to exit the console market after this shockingly bad month for them. Look at what has happened:

The 360 is selling as poorly worldwide as the first Xbox
Microsoft only shipped 700k new 360s worldwide last quarter
Nintendo is about to fly past them in worldwide sales next month most likely
Peter Moore gets fired
1.1 billion in costs for defective 360 repairs
Another 360 exec selling off shares just before the 1.1 billion dollar defect bill was news
X07 is canceled
Microsoft bombs at E3 with almost nothing mentioned about 2008 releases or plans
Halo 3 has become something between a yawn and a joke in the eyes of gamers
Another class action lawsuit over defective drives scratching/destroying discs
An increasing focus on Vista exclusive/online gaming
So far no solution has been found to the 360 defect problem, 9-10 million 360s out there that will continue to fail over and over again
Total Xbox losses now up to 7-8 billion over the life of the project
HD-DVD is dead

It is hard to imagine the situation getting any worse for Microsoft in the console market. Turning their focus to Vista seems like the logical thing for Microsoft to do. For a company with billions to spend on new markets you would think they could easily find the funds to hold their yearly Xbox specific conference just like the other two console makers are able to. There have to be serious discussions going on in Microsoft over the future of the Xbox project as we know it.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Jason Earl]

Even Microsoft can't afford to throw money down a hole forever. Console gaming was supposed to be Microsoft's big hope for future growth. Instead Microsoft has lost billions of dollars subsidizing console hardware for gamers. Microsoft still hasn't even managed to become more popular than the companies that were actually making a profit. The PS2 destroyed the XBox in the last generation and the Wii is looking to clean up in this generation.

Worse, XBox gaming actually weakens Microsoft's hold on the desktop. Computer games are one of the few legitimate reasons to buy a Windows box over a Mac (or even a Linux box).

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why post as an AC? Sony won't know who to send the check to.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[AKAImBatman]

I seriously doubt that Microsoft is ready to give up the fight yet. At the moment, they have Sony's "hardcore gamers" market by the balls. It would be foolish to give it up now, no matter what happens.

No, I imagine that Microsoft is regrouping and rethinking their strategy. They're examining what worked for them and what didn't so that they can focus on doing more of what works. Useless trade shows that no one has ever heard of probably fall under the "not working" category.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't see anything that is outright false, perhaps exaggerated a bit. After the six year mess that the Xbox has turned out to be, it has to be the case that pulling the plug and cutting their losses is a serious option for Microsoft right now.

Microsoft seems right at home supporting pc game developers through Windows. Just think of what they could have done instead of wasting so many billions in the console market getting nowhere if they had spent even part of that money revitalizing pc gaming.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

"At the moment, they have Sony's "hardcore gamers" market by the balls. It would be foolish to give it up now, no matter what happens"

What the hell?

The 360 is selling to the EXACT same people who bought the first Xbox. Virtually no one in Japan. A fairly small number of people in Europe, mostly in the UK. And the rest are US the same Xbox demographic as last gen.

Anyone who uses the terms 'hardcore' and/or 'casual' makes it clear they have nothing of value to add to a console market discussion.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[flitty]

I highly doubt this. Xbox live is to big of a success, and most of xbox's profits come from the games it sells, not the consoles it sells. Hard to believe that this comes from an Anonomous coward...

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[solios]

XBox gaming actually weakens Microsoft's hold on the desktop.

Maybe for casual gamers. Keep in mind, there are a ton of games available for Windows that won't run on the X-Box - World of Warcraft, Neverwinter Nights, older games like Quake and Systemshock 2, Wolfenstein : Enemy Territory, etc.

As a casual gamer, I use my Windows box as a 3d workstation (no games installed), and I'm quite happy with my Nintendo DS. The only games Microsoft has that I might want are Halo 2 and 3, and it's not worth plonking down money for an XB360, two games, and a television just to get an FPS fix.

In my opinion, Microsoft is missing a mark Nintendo has been hitting for a long time now - most gamers just want fun games. Not Team Deathmatch with grotesque system requirments. They're also missing a killer franchise - Halo may be a good series, but it lacks the brand recognition and the slavish "buy-on-sight" fanbase that the Final Fantasy series or the various Nintendo franchises (Zelda, Metroid, Mario, etc) command.

Hell, outside of Halo I can't think of a single X-Box title. Let alone one I'd be interested in.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[WIAKywbfatw]

There are so many inaccuracies in this post that I don't know where to start.

1. The 360 is selling poorly? Look at the user base.

2. Peter Moore was fired? Uh, no, he resigned, and he received a 7-figure golden hello from EA to compensate him for lost earnings at Microsoft. Why would EA give him over $1 million if he was on the street?

3. Execs sell shares all the time. At a company the size of Microsoft, I'd be shocked if you could find a single month in the last 10 years where one exec or another wasn't selling off some of his stock.

4. HD-DVD is dead? Most people don't even know what HD-DVD or Blu-Ray are but you're ready to declare a winner already? What else can you see in your crystal ball?

And those are just the ones that jump out. Almost every statement that you've made is challengable on some level.

I'm sure that most people who know Microsoft will tell you that losing money on Xbox in generations 1 and 2 probably doesn't faze them at all. Screwing it up the first time, making a semi-decent product the second time and then getting it right on the third attempt is practically a tradition at Microsoft.

Right now, this generation of consoles looks like being a big win for Nintendo, with Sony and Microsoft slugging it out for second place. But write off Microsoft at your peril.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[AKAImBatman]

The 360 is selling to the EXACT same people who bought the first Xbox.

Now that is provably false. The XBox sold a mere 24 million units in the 4+ years it was on the market. In comparison, the 360 sold about 10 million units in the first year. Unless sales fall off dramatically, Microsoft is still in a better position than they were with the XBox.

In addition, movements like Wii60 are causing many gamers to see the 360 as a companion to the Wii rather than a competitor. This has driven the consumer thinking of, "I'll use the Wii for 'fun' games, then use the 360 for FPSes, Simulations, and HD Entertainment." I see this thinking on a daily basis, so it would appear to be working.

I'm no fan of Microsoft, but they've done just as much right with the 360 as they have done wrong. I'm actually *happy* that they've screwed up the hardware yields so royally as it's one of the few things keeping them from getting a stronger hold on the market.

Virtually no one in Japan.

This is true. However, Microsoft doesn't actually need Japan to sell well. Japan is the center for quite a bit of gaming, but there's enough game development elsewhere in the world to keep Microsoft's machine running.

A fairly small number of people in Europe, mostly in the UK.

According to VGCharts, Microsoft has managed about 3.18 million in non-Japanese international sales compared to their 6.5 million domestic sales. That's hardly "a fairly small number". In fact, it's about 30% of their market.

The truth is that the 360 has expanded Microsoft's hold considerably. It's costing them a very large fortune to hold it, but it would be foolish to let it slip through their grasp now.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Cutriss]

Plenty here to ridicule, but this stands out the best:

1.1 billion in costs for defective 360 repairs So far no solution has been found to the 360 defect problem, 9-10 million 360s out there that will continue to fail over and over again

So...they don't know what the problem is, but they definitely know it will cost them $1.1B to fix? That makes perfect sense.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[drinkypoo]

Hell, outside of Halo I can't think of a single X-Box title. Let alone one I'd be interested in.

My favorite Xbox title is Grand Theft Auto:San Andreas; IIRC it was on PS2 first, but the control scheme is much, much better on Xbox (changing weapons is a little trickier to hit in a firefight, but the Xbox has real triggers.)

I played Halo on the Xbox very briefly once. My response was "fuck this controller crap". I got it for PC and played through it there; it was a competent (if not amazing) FPS. I'm kind of interested in playing Halo 2 but I'm moving away from Windows (NONE of my machines boot Windows - if it doesn't run on Linux, at least through wine, I'm not interested any more) so unless it runs in Wine I'm not interested. Cedega is NOT acceptable either, I am not giving Transgaming money until they start releasing patches upstream immediately, not after substantial delays, and their product doesn't support games I want to play anyway, nor is their product at all reliable between versions.

My Xbox performs two main functions. It runs XBMC and it runs classic console emulators. Occasionally I play some GTA:SA. I have some other games but they all suck, as do most console games (let alone Xbox games.)

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[drinkypoo]

Peter Moore was fired? Uh, no, he resigned, and he received a 7-figure golden hello from EA to compensate him for lost earnings at Microsoft. Why would EA give him over $1 million if he was on the street?

Uh, this kind of thing happens all the time.

CEOs and the like are often under contract. It's easier to get them to go away voluntarily than to fire them, which you have to explain. And firing your CEO makes you look very bad.

So most of the time, the CEO is just kind of pushed gently out the door. They are treated as if they had done a great job. Nary a word is said about them being ejected.

As a result, they get to go into their next enterprise smelling like a rose. They're greeted with open arms. then they get to damage another company.

I agree with your other assertions, but this one is just plain ignorant. We don't know, and never will know, if he's leaving under good terms or not.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

Microsoft knows what the defect is - something to do with heat and the circuitboard warping and chips coming disconnected.

Microsoft knows how much it costs to replace or temporarily repair 360s they've been doing it for almost two years now.

Microsoft doesn't know how to fix the problem permanently.

The existing 360s will continue to die over and over again until Microsoft does so or replaces the systems with different hardware.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

Success? Microsoft's online service continues to do so poorly that Microsoft refuses to give the actual number of people willing to pay for the service. Instead they play games with trying to make it sound like everyone who connects their machine online is an actual subscriber.

Yeah, 'success'...

Microsoft has never had any profits from the 360 except for one quarter over the past seven years. The word you didn't know how to use is 'revenue'.

Hard to believe someone would post something so dumb with their real account...

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[WIAKywbfatw]

If, as you say, we don't know then how can the AC to whom I replied assert that he was fired?

The facts, as agreed by Microsoft, EA and Peter Moore himself have stated are that he resigned. If nobody directly involved has anything different to say then how can someone claim with any degree of certainty that he was fired?

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

EA has nothing to say or add to the firing of Moore.
Moore himself of course isn't going to admit to being fired.
Microsoft themselves aren't going to admit to the firing as anything but the usual exec getting the axe happy happy joy joy more time with my family BS.

Anyone who reads sites where Microsoft employees talk to each other knows that there have been calls for heads to roll ever since the 1.1 billion dollar 360 defect debacle hit came to light.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Jason Earl]

And Nintendo is proving that wrapping up the "hardcore gamer" market is the classic Pyrrhic victory, especially if you have to subsidize the hardware so that normal folks will even buy it. Microsoft has lost billions of dollars chasing this mythical hardcore gamer, and Nintendo has consistently made profits, even when its console was the least popular console on the market. What's even more ironic is that the technology battle between Microsoft and Sony is likely to knock Sony out of the running for this generation as well. Both Sony and Microsoft are heavily in the red selling their uber-systems at a loss, and Nintendo is still cleaning both of their clocks selling game consoles that casual gamers can afford.

Yes, there are some gamers that will gladly drop ridiculous amounts of money on hardware and then turn around and spend even more money on games. However, there aren't enough of these people to make them a viable product niche. The second you start worrying about the "hardcore gamer" you have basically guaranteed that your console will flop.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[BlueParrot]

So...they don't know what the problem is, but they definitely know it will cost them $1.1B to fix? That makes perfect sense.

Lets say they have sold a million of them. Lets say that out of the first 100.000 X% came back defective. Since they don't know the problem, but strongly suspect it is a design flaw, they can only assume X% of the remaining ones will also come out defective. Multiply by number of units sold and the price by replacing each unit, and I would say that is a fairly good statistical estimate of what it will cost them.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[tepples]

My Xbox performs two main functions. It runs XBMC and it runs classic console emulators. Occasionally I play some GTA:SA. I have some other games but they all suck, as do most console games (let alone Xbox games.) Can't your Linux box run mplayer and classic console emulators? What advantage does the Xbox have in this respect?

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[gad_zuki!]

Err, the xbox division is very very profitable in the long run. Aside from Nintendo, all consoles are money losing ventures. They make up for it by taking a chunk out of the games sold. Microsoft was been surprisingly successful with the xbox/xbox360. I dont think of MS as an exceptional company, but I see them as a decent company. If they can waltz into the gaming market and take all this marketshare, its further proof at how incredibly inept sony, sega, and nintendo have been with their products. nintendo seems to be learning and SOny is delivering the humdum ovepriced crap its always been doing. Hopefully, this shake up will lead to better products through better competition.

Oh right this is slashdot. Replace the above with "fsck M$"

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[DrXym]

HD-DVD is dead

I don't think Microsoft really cares about HD-DVD. Otherwise it would have appeared in the XBox 360 Elite.

Sure they released an HD-DVD add-on but I suspect they did it more to piss on Sony's parade than any particular commitment to the format. I bet Toshiba shouldered most of the cost too. Their VC-1 codec is in both the HD-DVD and Blu Ray specs so what do they care either way, just as long as people choose their codec? It sucks if you bought their add-on though. It wouldn't surprise me if MS ultimately jumped ship and went with Blu-Ray if for no other reason than to close another perceived advantage of the PS3.

I think some of your other points are valid but some are FUD. The 360 has terrible quality problems but Halo 3 is going to sell many, many copies, and many systems. Personally I don't know why people care about the game since first person shooters are coming out of the 360's and the PS3's ears but it's an undeniable fact that Halo will sell.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[drinkypoo]

Can't your Linux box run mplayer and classic console emulators? What advantage does the Xbox have in this respect?

If you're using SD there is no cheaper way to get better TV out.

It doesn't have the horsepower to do HD, but it doesn't do HD anyway.

Basically I just can't seem to get a PC that is in the same form factor or smaller, and as good or better, for less money. And, let me remind you, you can run Linux on the Xbox. But mplayer is super-lame compared to XBMC (at least as an appliance.)

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[mdenham]

I'm sure that most people who know Microsoft will tell you that losing money on Xbox in generations 1 and 2 probably doesn't faze them at all. Screwing it up the first time, making a semi-decent product the second time and then getting it right on the third attempt is practically a tradition at Microsoft.

In that case, the future timeline of the XBox series:

• The XBox 720 is released; (Win3.0)
• A short time later, the XBox 756 is released, which adds a few things and is considered the greatest thing ever, despite the fact that one game can lock it up for hours on end; (Win3.1)
• Two years later, the XBox NT is released... five years later than it should have been; (WinNT 3.5)
• Then, over the next six years, we will get the XBox 15, the XBox 18, and the XBox 18SE; (Win95/98/98SE)
• ...followed, two years later, by the XBox 2020 and the XBox ME (which will be permanently crashed to make things easier for its users). (Win2K/WinME)

About seven years after that, we'll have the XBox Vista, which will refuse to operate with 90% of the games for the previous models, be underpowered despite using the latest processor and copious amounts of memory, and which will come in numerous confusing variations, some of which allow you to host an older version of the XBox (namely, the more expensive versions).

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[shplorb]

Very profitable in the long run? Please, put down the crack pipe son.

The Xbox is BILLIONS in the red. It better start making some spectacular returns pronto to pay back the money that's been poured into it, plus interest otherwise I predict large shareholders are going to start asking questions like "why are you pissing that money away when you could be giving it to us as dividends or investing in something profitable?"... you know, opportunity cost and all that.

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Kalriath]

Like he said. This is Slashdot, replace his entire post with "fuck M$".

Re:Microsoft Easing Out Of Console Hardware?

[Anonymous Coward]

They didn't "fix" anything, obviously people have been sending back their XBox 360s over and over because when they get them back they fail after a certain amount of time. They're not fixing anything, they're kludging it.

1st Domestic Horse post

[Anonymous Coward]

Conservation status: Domesticated

big reason

[Bizzeh]

the big reason behind no X07 is the fact that there is no point paying to set up something like this, when others do it for you. ie E3 just gone, and the TGS (Tokyo Game Show) coming up shortly...

Did not know there was an X06

[WillAffleckUW]

So I'm not surprised there is no X07.

But, given the continuing losses for xBox, isn't another event just more dollars down the drain?

BMX 30?

[tepples]

And yet Dead or Alive Xtreme Volleyball 2 doesn't seem Xtreme enough to me.

Where's my XXXtreme edition? ;-) Might the M-rated sequel to BMX XXIX help?

Re:BMX 30?

[Yvan256]

The quality of the 3D models seems to be far better in the DOA games, especially volleyball.

Devil's advocate to strengthen argument

[tepples]

Can't your Linux box run mplayer and classic console emulators? What advantage does the Xbox have in this respect? If you're using SD there is no cheaper way to get better TV out [than a modded Xbox console].

"Who said anything about TV?" -- Smug PC weenies

I agree with you that a set-top box should be the best solution for some entertainment environments. But unfortunately, all stand-alone set-top boxes that are significantly cheaper than a Mac mini are thoroughly Tivoized. I want to help us come up with some ammunition against smug PC weenies who almost unconditionally prefer the 2-foot experience over the 10-foot experience, so here are four of their objections in increasing order of devil's advocacy:

1. I can't buy a modded Xbox in U.S. retail stores or on eBay; where else should I buy a modded Xbox?
2. If you mean that I should learn to mod one myself, can version 1.6 be modded without soldering? Does your "no cheaper way" estimate include training for somebody who has never soldered before? And I still can't buy modchips in U.S. retail stores or on eBay for the same reason as above.
3. Does your "no cheaper way" estimate include the potential $750 to $30,000 statutory damages (per 17 USC 504 and foreign counterparts) for infringement of the copyright in the Xbox BIOS and/or the XDK libraries against which XBMC and most of these emulators are compiled?
4. Per several comments in other console vs. PC discussions on Slashdot, isn't television output overrated? Isn't it "better" to buy one set of PC, monitor, keyboard, and mouse per person and play multiplayer games over the LAN, because that way each player has a hundred triggers for discrete actions and can't easily cheat off other players' screens?

And, let me remind you, you can run Linux on the Xbox. Yeah, as a server: "A 1.6 Xbox (softmodded) is known to not work with 2.6 kernels, the screen will lock or the tv will lose video sync." But then you lose the TV output advantage of the Xbox chipset, and you might as well use an old paid-for PC.

Re:Devil's advocate to strengthen argument

[drinkypoo]

I can't buy a modded Xbox in U.S. retail stores or on eBay; where else should I buy a modded Xbox?

Cottage industry made america great. There are ads in small papers and on bulletin boards across America advertising modded Xboxes and Xbox modding. Or, you could mod your own, let us continue.

If you mean that I should learn to mod one myself, can version 1.6 be modded without soldering? Does your "no cheaper way" estimate include training for somebody who has never soldered before? And I still can't buy modchips in U.S. retail stores or on eBay for the same reason as above.

No, but modchips can be had easily enough; if you're willing to use ebay then why not another online service? Get a temporary CC number and go to town. You CAN buy them in retail stores in the US, but only small shops that probably won't exist in a year or two, and typically only in cities.

Does your "no cheaper way" estimate include the potential $750 to $30,000 statutory damages (per 17 USC 504 and foreign counterparts) for infringement of the copyright in the Xbox BIOS and/or the XDK libraries against which XBMC and most of these emulators are compiled?

It is possible to come up with a Linux-based solution (using cromwell BIOS) which does not involve the use of a hacked-up Xbox BIOS. So if you are truly worried about this, then you do have the option of a free solution. There are XBMC-like applications which will run on Linux. Though, I do admit, the value of the Xbox is diminished while not running its native OS. It's a little light on RAM.

Per several comments in other console vs. PC discussions on Slashdot, isn't television output overrated? Isn't it "better" to buy one set of PC, monitor, keyboard, and mouse per person and play multiplayer games over the LAN, because that way each player has a hundred triggers for discrete actions and can't easily cheat off other players' screens?

Console gaming does not necessarily replace PC gaming. They are suited to different situations and purposes. Heck, in certain environments there's no room for a large output device and they're practically the only thing available. (Most console games these days are inscrutable on a 13" television. No Atari-sized pixels.)

Also, the purpose of the device is not just to play games, but also to watch movies. I still use my PSTwo for a DVD player sometimes (it boots marginally faster than the Xbox) so it's not just the Xbox to which this argument applies.

"Screen cheating" is simply another game mechanic. Besides, in the really real world you have a level of situational awareness which cannot be provided by a TV screen; peripheral vision, highly directional hearing, etc etc. A little more information on what your opponents doing might be considered to help make up for that lack.

Finally, console gaming does not actually preclude network gaming; while almost no one ever got groups of consoles together to play games until recently, even though a number of older games permitted it (I've done it with Wipeout XL on PS1 for example) the feature is available in some cases.

And, let me remind you, you can run Linux on the Xbox.

Yeah, as a server: "A 1.6 Xbox (softmodded) is known to not work with 2.6 kernels, the screen will lock or the tv will lose video sync." But then you lose the TV output advantage of the Xbox chipset, and you might as well use an old paid-for PC.

Who says you have to use a 2.6 kernel? 2.4 is still quite viable and perhaps bet

Re:Devil's advocate to strengthen argument

[tepples]

Some of these are valid objections. The Xbox is a better device for a nerd than the average individual. Then which set-top device that plays games developed by individuals or smaller studios, such as mods for commercial games, is suitable for the average individual?

Re:Devil's advocate to strengthen argument

[drinkypoo]

Then which set-top device that plays games developed by individuals or smaller studios, such as mods for commercial games, is suitable for the average individual?

I have no idea. I personally only need to worry about devices for the above-average individual :D

Re:Devil's advocate to strengthen argument

[tepples]

I personally only need to worry about devices for the above-average individual :D How did you get lucky enough to get born into a family with only above-average individuals?

a good question

[master_p]

Why did Microsoft enter the console race anyway?

MS moves into do nothing mode

[sysadmintech]

This rings of IE. Microsoft used it's game division to put all small designers out of business, as they planned. So don't expect anything out of XBox for the next 6 years.