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Highway Safety Agency Silences Engineers

nbauman writes "Nichole R. Nason, administrator of the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, put a new rule into effect that NHTSA officials, including scientists and engineers, are no longer allowed to be quoted by reporters, according to the New York Times. If the officials want to say anything it has to be off the record. The only one they can quote is Nason herself. However, she refused to be interviewed about the no-attribution policy."

38 of 284 comments (clear)

  1. Shame... by BWJones · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Any government or office within the government (intelligence and other appropriately sensitive agencies aside) who are proud of their work should be encouraged and willing to discuss openly with the people who give them the authority and resources to do their jobs.

    This whole issue of lack of transparency is becoming a larger and larger problem with the government and again.... if we are not careful will result into a slide into fascism. Transparency of government is one of the bedrocks of a democracy, hell, even a republic. The current Whitehouse administration has dramatically accelerated this move towards fascism and again, I have to quote Milton Mayer's book They Thought They Were Free: The Germans 1939-1945 where an anonymous professor said "What happened was the gradual habituation of the people, little by little, to be governed by surprise, to receiving decisions deliberated in secret; to believe that the situation was so complicated that the government had to act on information which the people could not understand, or so dangerous that, even if people could understand it, it could not be released because of national security. "

    This sort of thing is a classic fascist move where *free* representatives from government are not allowed to speak to a *free* press. Granted, if you are in the uniformed services or currently employed by a federal office engaged in sensitive work (one of the dozen or so intelligence agencies), then this sort of censorship is acceptable. However, this administration has censored publicly funded scientists engaged in research that potentially impacts upon political policy of the current administration and now National Highway and Traffic Safety Administration officials from talking? One has to wonder just what it is that Bush and Co. want to keep from the American people. What is NHTSA hiding from us?

    What moves like this do is open the possibility of lack of oversight when it comes to issues of bribes, coercion and worse. Imagine if a powerful automotive manufacturer were to have a fundamental safety problem with one of their automobiles. Without access by the public and the free press whose job it is to ask the hard questions, we open ourselves up to abuse, manipulation and more unpleasantness than you may imagine.

    People need to become more involved in politics, get rid of your disillusionment of representative government and make a difference. Don't be sheep and become satisfied with the current state if you are not happy with it and help, but don't be stupid about it. Work within the system because with the current administration, they will view any extreme political moves as a justification for expanding their controls even further over the populace. Demand more of our politicians. Expect transparency, honesty and be more willing to support impeachment of those officials who do not represent the will of those who elected them. Look beyond single issues in those candidates whom you vote for. Don't be seduced by claims of piety or religious devotion as one mans beliefs are another's anathema. I am not saying that religion is bad as I possess strong spiritual beliefs, but be wary of those who wear religion on their sleeves. And do not accept as this NHTSA official maintains that the only way to say anything is if it is off the record. Ms. Nason, you are a government employee working for an office whose role is to protect the American citizen, save lives and prevent injury. You are not entitled to any special protection under the Constitution than the rest of us and you ultimately answer to the American people, not a transient senior government official intent on building a political legacy. Shame on you for gagging the scientists under your watch whose duty it is to serve the American people and report to them on issues related to safety and well being on the roads and highways.

    --
    Visit Jonesblog and say hello.
    1. Re:Shame... by kyliaar · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Any government or office within the government (intelligence and other appropriately sensitive agencies aside) who are proud of their work should be encouraged and willing to discuss openly with the people who give them the authority and resources to do their jobs.


      The media however is not the people who give them authority and resources. The media, any media, are far from the un-biased group of people who relay factual and necessary data to a needing public without editing or filtration that they would like to be thought of as.

      The media 'researches' and publishes story that forward agendas and not for the public and its rights to know. There are other channels to get information out that do not involve news reporters, such as the web and print media.

      I, for one, applaud not giving the media more ammo to use to create FUD which seems to have the weight of authority.

    2. Re:Shame... by DoofusOfDeath · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This just means that a random engineer can't claim to represent the whole organization.

      Neither can an official spokesman, unless he surveys every member of the organization and confirms that each agrees with the statement.

      An official spokesperson typically only speaks for the executives. To act otherwise is to give legs to the lie that corporations are persons.

    3. Re:Shame... by Fulcrum+of+Evil · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Neither can an official spokesman, unless he surveys every member of the organization and confirms that each agrees with the statement.

      Come off it - all you really need is the position of the people running things. They decide what the coporation does, after all.

      --
      "We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
    4. Re:Shame... by love-blood-rhetoric · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Whether sadly or not, I can easily see the justification for this gag order. I am an engineer and the insults to design that I see within my field do nothing but reinforce my view that most others in this field are incompetent. Imagine this from a management's point of view:

      1) You, being a state agency, have hired somewhere between the worst and mediocre engineers. (My apologies to the few exceptions to this rule).

      2) They have performed work that you, personally, are not able to check.

      3) These engineers, who unbeknown to you are inept, are now being interviewed by reporters who are just looking for anything to latch on to to prove that "they knew all along!".

      4) Your engineers say something that may not be true or may only be partially true, or even may be fully true, but incomprehensible to the simple reporter no matter how hard he tries to explain. Believe me, I've been interviewed for many newspaper articles and the entire technical content of the interview was lost by taking sentences out of context.

      I'm not saying that there is not a very sincere threat to government transparency with this issue, but one should at least examine legitimate motives for silencing engineers.

    5. Re:Shame... by DoofusOfDeath · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Come off it - all you really need is the position of the people running things. They decide what the corporation does, after all.

      Like the heads of intelligence agencies during the lead up to Iraq? Or Christy Todd Whitman's claims about the safety of the WTC site after 9/11?

      There are some organizations whose only credibility comes from the expertise of the non-executive staff. Execs can make claims about what actions their organization will take, but they're not the only important opinions in matters of truth.

    6. Re:Shame... by realthing02 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Unfortunately, it's not just bombs and guns that we should worry about when it comes to classified information (or even sensitive but unclassified, SBU). What about information that would take away a competitive advantage for the company? Disclosing blueprints of bridges could do this. Materials and weights/densities could also prove to lose both monetary and human assets if it gets into the wrong hands.

      It's important to realize the wrong hands aren't always trying to hurt people. And calling this movie fascists is quite silly. comparing it to Hitler is even worse. I work on sensitive projects at work and there are specific rules set up about talking about nearly every aspect of my job. Is my employer facsist? Or are they just trying to maintain security about the work we do?

    7. Re:Shame... by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The reason for the gag order is that the country is in dire straits. The national infrastructure is falling apart, and there are no resources to fix them.

      The more people in the public realize this, the faster foreign investment will flee the scene, the less likelihood there will be that the resources might materialize in the future.

      Bureaucrats and politicians don't keep secrets when things are going well, they shout from the rooftops.

      They also don't waste time enforcing secrecy when things aren't going badly, because it generates no return.

      They enforce secrecy when things are absolutely fucked, and they wish to prevent a panic.

      At this point, things have become desparate enough, and the US has become unpopular enough, that the only way they can survive is to engage in colonialism and exploit foreigners through force of arms, which is the one area where they are still doing well.

      Sorry to burst anyones bubble.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    8. Re:Shame... by schnell · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This sort of thing is a classic fascist move where *free* representatives from government are not allowed to speak to a *free* press.

      Look, I'm all for open access to the press (speaking as a former reporter). However, I have to confess that in this case it's not fascism, it's just sensible public relations. I don't think it's about muzzling whisteblowers, it's about making sure people talking to the press are trained to pick their words carefully in a situation where public hysteria or calmness is at stake.

      If you allow any random employee from within the organization - who probably hasn't had media training - to be quoted by reporters, then serious bad PR or misinformation can result. I think what's driving this in particular is a desire not to have Joe Engineer who's used to talking with other engineers give raw quotes to a clueless reporter and have his words completely misunderstood and thereby throw the public into a tizzy.

      A fanciful but illustrative example: Joe Engineer from NHTSA may talk to the New York Times and use some intra-agency jargon like "in our latest survey, 99% of the bridges in the country got a designation of 'likely to collapse'." It turns out that 'likely to collapse' is an agency term measuring whether it is more likely to collapse or be struck by a meteor, but the reporter (who doesn't know any better, and wouldn't be expected to know better unless Joe explains it to him - and we've never heard before of a technical person who fails to explain their jargon) puts in the paper verbatim: "NHTSA says 99% of bridges likely to collapse." (Cue mass hysteria.) Executives and other people in the organization who are given media training are at least taught how to choose their words for public consumption carefully (whether they do it properly or not is a different issue).

      So, as much as I enjoy getting into a tizzy about censorship, I gotta say there isn't much here to get worked up about, let alone decry as government "fascism." The TSA and airport security procedures, though ... don't get me started about those guys.

      --
      "95% of all Slashdot .sig quotes are incorrect or completely fabricated." -Benjamin Franklin
    9. Re:Shame... by wolvesofthenight · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Actually, we do have the resources to rebuild them, and we don't need foreign investment to do it. In fact, the more of it we keep in nation the better off we will be. Following the example of Rome is a bad thing. However, those resources are going to other things, like the war in Iraq and the military. After the end of the cold war we needed to scale back our military spending to half or a quarter of what it was. We cut it back a little but not nearly enough, and the war has erased any good those cuts did. If we got out of Iraq and started cutting military spending we could then have the money to fix our roads, even if we stopped deficit spending. This would take several years; you can't just turn off the military spending like a light, and the budget is complex enough that it would take a lot of planning and thought. There is still time to do it. Sadly, it looks like this is not going to happen.

      --
      -WolvesOfTheNight
    10. Re:Shame... by Starcom8826 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Ah, so apparently the US became unpopular and resorted to exploiting foreigners and colonialism. So it was unpopular first for no reason.

    11. Re:Shame... by oojimaflib · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Contrary to popular belief, engineers (by and large) are not idiots. I think it could also be argued that we have a better feel for what bridges are likely (or unlikely) to collapse than the PR dept. One of the key engineering skills is the successful communication of ideas, and I have yet to see an example of a qualified engineer being mis-understood by the press (except where it was willfully done in order to get a story).

      Let me put a fanciful, but illustrative, counterexample: Fred Engineer from NHTSA may want to talk to the New York Times and use some intra-agency jargon like "in our latest survey, 99% of the bridges in the country got a designation of 'likely to collapse'." It turns out that 'likely to collapse' is an agency term measuring whether there is a greater than 50% probability of it collapsing tomorrow. But he can't tell the press because he's not allowed. The next day, a large number of bridges fall over. (Cue mass hysteria). Fred Engineer is fired. Many die.

  2. I completely agree by Paulrothrock · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is to save taxpayer money. After all, if engineers were to let slip how bad our crumbling infrastructure has gotten, we might actually have to fix it, and that's very expensive. And you don't want your taxes raised, do you?

    Of course not.

    </sarcasm>

    --
    I'm in the hole of the broadband donut.
  3. What are they trying to hide? by ks*nut · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Many portions of the U.S. infrastructure are crumbling away in front of our eyes. To silence those who could help the less technically inclined understand some of the details of what is going on reflects the worst kind of censorship. The public deserves to know why we our lives are being placed at risk in spite of being one of the world's "superpowers."

    Full and open disclosure, along with rational discussion about the best way to put our country back on track, is what we need. Unless they are trying to protect some awful secret...

    1. Re:What are they trying to hide? by geekoid · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "I don't recall how it turned out, but it was yet one more reason to distrust California government"

      man, it is amazing how someone can get 1/10th the data, not get the story straight, admit you dont know the conclusion of the situation, YET you find it to be a reason to distrust CA government.

      I which that was a unique way of thinking.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  4. Re:yeah by winkydink · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It is if they ever want to use you as a source again.

    --

    "I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey

  5. Not Sure I Disagree With This Completely by BigAssRat · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We all know how the press can get stories wrong, especially technical ones. I am not 100% sure that this isn't a good idea. The press can misquote or take out of context just about anything, so when an engineer says something techincal but is misquoted about how bad things really are it just causes an uproar. No, I haven't RTFA yet, about to, but wanted to get my knee jerk reaction before I do...will post later if my thoughts change after RTFA.

    1. Re:Not Sure I Disagree With This Completely by Rostin · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Thank you for being the first commenter not to see this as some kind of fascist conspiracy.

      This type of control is the rule rather than the exception in companies. Part of the purpose is to contain trade secrets and to protect the reputation of the company, but it's also to prevent the spread of false information. Engineers and scientists aren't infallible. (What's worse, most of us think we know more than we really do, love it when people ask us our opinions, and aren't slow to speculate.) Even when we're right, we might exaggerate or use technical jargon, as you pointed out. A system has to exist to make sure that technically vetted, relevant information is provided to the public.

      If this is some kind of cover-up, it's a pretty crappy one. As the summary says, engineers are still permitted to speak "off the record," so it's not like the flow the information has been completely stopped. Also, there are whistleblower laws.

    2. Re:Not Sure I Disagree With This Completely by TubeSteak · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This type of control is the rule rather than the exception in companies. Part of the purpose is to contain trade secrets and to protect the reputation of the company, but it's also to prevent the spread of false information. News Flash: The Federal Government and its Agencies are not companies.
      "This type of control" is not the rule for a public agency

      A system has to exist to make sure that technically vetted, relevant information is provided to the public. You mean... like a National Highway Traffic Safety Administration?

      That's pretty much what they do, hire people tto provide "technically vetted, relevant information" and to set policy.
      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
  6. Simple Compromise by Tablizer · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A reasonable compromise should be that personal opinions should be required to be prefaced with, "The following is my personal opinion only and does not necessarily reflect the opinion of my employer". That is quite fair and simple. Maybe require the reporter to sign off on it.

  7. Downside of off-the-record commentary by Experiment+626 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Having attribution for quotes makes them able to be verified. Disclosing journalistic sources doesn't quite enable the same degree of many-eyeballs as disclosing software source does, since every reader can't just call George Bush up and personally ask him if he said such-and-such, but it does at least assure that if a quote becomes a point of contention and controversy, someone will check it out. Also, if a quote is attributed to a specific individual, there's a reasonable chance of determining whether they said that. If it is just attributed to "sources close to so-and-so" there's really no way to know if someone among this unspecified group of individuals may or may not have said it. In all, "sources speaking on the condition of anonymity say..." is just journalist talk for "rumor has it that..."

  8. They're LUCKY by redelm · · Score: 2, Insightful
    ... we (private industry) are not allowed to talk to the press, on or off the record!

  9. January 20, 2009 by 14erCleaner · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The day our government might start becoming transparent again. Cross your fingers...

    --
    Have you read my blog lately?
    1. Re:January 20, 2009 by eln · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The funny thing about power is that once it's gained, it's rarely given up voluntarily. Candidates may shout loudly about how the Executive is getting far too powerful, but once they become the Executive, you can count on them "forgetting" to give that power back.

  10. Tool for Cover-ups? by burning-toast · · Score: 5, Insightful

    FTA:
    ---
    Ms. Nason felt it was necessary for N.H.T.S.A. to have a "central spokesperson" and "we were finding a lot of stuff did not need to be on the record," David Kelly, her chief of staff, told me.
    ---

    This seems to me that this would make it so that the following would be easily plausible:

    1. Reporter gets bad news about something which effects the public from one of their engineers, staff members, or experts but cannot attribute their source.
    2. Reporter has to leave it as a "trusted source" causing many to doubt the validity of the claims. (Or, alternately it is never released simply because the news outlet can not attribute the source).
    3. Since Ms. Nason did not explicitly allow that exchange to take place (or for it to be attributed to the source) the facts can be denied (or at least remain unverifiable) on the grounds that the NHTSA has never "officially" released such information. Or, the Public has never even heard of it depending on how the media outlet handles the previous decision (#2).

    This only seems to me to be a method of covering up something. Is there any legitimate purpose for an organization such as this to withhold information from the public? Especially that which would come (potentially) from Engineers or other "experts" on the matters with which they are being questioned.

    - Toast

  11. Well, yeah by CaffeineAddict2001 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's the same reason companies have their marketing department tell customers about the product rather than engineers. Marketing will tell you why it's great, engineers will tell you how it could be better.

  12. Why? by dazedNconfuzed · · Score: 5, Insightful

    You think _either_ Presidential candidate (whoever viably ends up on the ballot) will have _any_ interest in making government more transparent?

    --
    Can we get a "-1 Wrong" moderation option?
  13. Absolutely by cdrguru · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is going to be the case more and more with government ... and anybody else with any sense.

    "Reporters" (and I use the term loosely) are trained by large newspapers, journalism programs and the like to qualify sources and to confirm things.

    Now we have a bunch of "journalists" that publish whatever comes into their heads, don't bother to confirm anything and will print nonsense. This isn't just bloggers, this is major publications.

    Can you believe that organizations would like to limit the damage that can be caused by some stray remark that is published?

  14. Re:Not surprising by MisterBlue · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Should government run differently than business? That is a fundamental question. The current trend is to hire CEOs into government (current pres and VP as examples) and they expect to run the government like they run businesses -- direction and commands from the top, no two other branches to get in the way and a marketing department to present and manage the information that goes in and out.

    This restriction is just what a department head would do in a business.

    The general discourse should be on how we want our government to be different than just a business. There are different goals, interests and reasons for existence. Structurally and procedurally they should be very different.

  15. not so sinister by not_anne · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This may seem on the surface like a coverup, but truth be told, most large organizations have rules that state that the average employee should not comment to reporters in any official capacity. I happen to work at such a company, and have no problem not talking to reporters.

    --
    My comments here are my own; I do not speak for my employer.
    1. Re:not so sinister by saveth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I work for such a company, too, and that policy is fine by me. "Direct media questions to the CEO... yes, leave New York and go to blazing hot Arizona and talk to him" and so forth.

      I think the reason we're even reading this article, though, is that it's talking about a government agency, not a private corporation. Limiting the amount of access the media has to government operations reduces transparency and, in this case, allows a single person to control what the media officially hears.

      That said, employees can still speak anonymously to the media, and if something goes really wrong inside the agency, that's probably what will happen.

    2. Re:not so sinister by Sloppy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      most large organizations have rules that state that the average employee should not comment to reporters in any official capacity.

      Right, because the people those employees work for, don't want their employees to do that. Who do government employees work for?

      Your large organization has a policy of not letting peons talk to the public, but you can bet your ass that if The Board of Directors wanted to talk to an employee, the board would have that access. The thing is, with government, the public and the board are the same thing.

      Government is a special case.

      --
      As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
  16. Re:I work in government and I don't talk to the pr by sholden · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That's all pretty much irrelevant since we aren't talking about random computer programmers who might have to talk to someone and get their picture taken.

    We're talking about reporters wanting to speak with the experts in the field to go over the details of something. Would you rather talk to an economist or the PR officer for a fund management company about what the Fed might be about to do with interest rates and what the effects might be? Would you rather speak to a NASA scientist or to a PR officer about the findings from the deep impact mission?

    Remember this isn't an orgnisation who just happens to have some engineers, it's an orgnisation that defines the reason for its existance as "Save lives, prevent injuries and reduce economic costs due to road traffic crashes, through education, research, safety standards and enforcement activity." Lot of good the education and research will do when the engineers aren't allowed to discuss their findings "on the record".

  17. I think you are missing something ... by golodh · · Score: 5, Insightful
    @fbartho

    I do think you are missing a point, and an important one.

    There are many shades of "being allowed to speak to the public" when it comes to organisations.

    If the only thing Miss. Nason was interested in was ensuring, in good faith, that individuals don't hijack the authority of the organisation, then it would have been sufficient, even appropriate, to insist that only the PR office could speak "for the organisation", and that everyone one else could only speak "on a personal title".

    Instead she went a step further. She not just centralised the authority to speak for the organisation, but also forbade individuals to speak out on a personal title. They have to be anonymous. The point is that the expertise in the NHTSA about technical matters is with the engineers, not with management. And unless you wanted to know about NHTSA policies, why would you want to speak to anyone but an engineer?

    In fact, the article quotes the former head of the NHTSA:

    "My God," said Joan Claybrook, who was N.H.T.S.A. administrator from 1977 to 1981 and is now president of Public Citizen, a consumer advocacy group. Given that N.H.T.S.A. is the leading source of automotive safety information in the United States, its researchers are public officials and people are entitled to "know what information they have, whether it is on paper or in their heads," Ms. Claybrook said.

    This seems a much more reasonable stance: we, the public, pay for the NHTSA, and so we should have some way of knowing what their findings are. And it should be up to *us* to decide if we want to hear the opinion of NHTSA management or its engineers.

    Unfortunately it seems typical of a certain philosophy on government to restrict access to potentially unfavourable news as in:

    "Ms. Nason felt it was necessary for N.H.T.S.A. to have a "central spokesperson" and "we were finding a lot of stuff did not need to be on the record," David Kelly, her chief of staff, told me.".

    *coughs* "We" were finding a lot of stuff "did not have to be on record". Sorry, but who are you to decide that? It just sounds like a flimsy pretext for spin-doctoring to me, coupled to a corporate philosophy of information-control.

    There are many thing that a corporate mindset is more efficient at than a civil-servant mentality, but honesty and transparency aren't among them.

  18. Re:I work in government and I don't talk to the pr by sholden · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's not as I put it, it's as the agency in question put it.

    But I disagree, when part of you aims is to educate then the experts need to do some communicating with the public. If the agency in question isn't there to educate the public then sure the technical people can hide away in their labs. If a particular engineer doesn't like talking to the press they don't need to, but allowing people to ask technical questions and get answers directly from the technical folk it very useful.

    It'll be great fun when the presenting of "A new approach to the geometric control of ultra-long span cable stay bridges" at http://www.bridgemanagement2007.com/ is done by the PR department and not engineers.

  19. And another freedom bites the dust. by Almost-Retired · · Score: 2, Insightful

    This is bull shit and should be spread on a cornfield someplace. As this is something that the public DOES have a right to know, I smell a lawsuit, maybe even class action, but certainly for damages large enough to send a message to worthless demi-gods such as this if it results in even a single PI accident.

    Maybe its time for another Richard Davis bill? That would send the loudest message I believe. In case there are younger readers here, the Richard Davis bill (it had a number but after 30 some years you expect me to remember that? Dontbesilly dear children) was the congressional response, passed both houses by 98%+ yea vote, removing the 4.7 Million dollars the project was estimated to cost from the BATF budget, enjoining them from moving any other monies they may have laying about into the project, and removing the salary (with similar enjoinders about finding other funds to pay him with) of the little demi-god (Richard Davis) who came up with the project in the first place. Nothing gets you fired quite as positively and finally as an act of Congress.

    His offense? He was gonna register all our guns... He went public with the plan while congress was on the campaign trail, BIG mistake, and when they reassembled, the country was literally on fire over it politically, hell I had two personal meetings with my Senator at the time, Pete Dominici, over it myself. First order of business, took about 10 days to get all the i's dotted & t's crossed.

    Yeah, we need another Richard Davis bill.

    --
    Cheers, Gene
    "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
      soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
    -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
    When in doubt, do it. It's much easier to apologize than to get permission.
                                    -- Grace Murray Hopper

  20. WRONG by bussdriver · · Score: 3, Insightful

    P.R. === Public Relations == Propaganda
    The term was coined by a propagandist because "Propaganda" sounds bad, especially after a world war. Naturally, one would expect a propagandist to leverage their expertise on their own profession and they have.

    Controlling the message from public experts so it can be "fixed" by propagandists may not in and of itself be fascist but its certainly a characteristic of commonly known fascist governments. It is actually an essential part of authoritarian government and not of fascism.

    American media already acts in similar ways to authoritarian systems and no killings or torcher are required. Its not as easy as knowing most official 'news' is lies like Iranian radio, its more a advanced next generation. Social Engineering.

    politicalcompass.org is required reading for anybody who wants to refer fascism

  21. Ron Paul would abolish this nonsense by SonicSpike · · Score: 2, Insightful

    When Ron Paul becomes elected as President of the US, he will abolish the NHTSA because the organization is unconstitutional. The federal government is no authorized anywhere in the Constitution to deal with roads or traffic.

    --
    Libertas in infinitum