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Kilogram Reference Losing Weight

doubleacr writes "Ran across a story on CNN that says the "118-year-old cylinder that is the international prototype for the metric mass, kept tightly under lock and key outside Paris, is mysteriously losing weight — if ever so slightly. Physicist Richard Davis of the International Bureau of Weights and Measures in Sevres, southwest of Paris, says the reference kilo appears to have lost 50 micrograms compared with the average of dozens of copies.""

12 of 546 comments (clear)

  1. Re:The Kilogram is not losing weight by Chris+Burke · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Weight is a property independent of the units you measure it with.

    The object which defines the Kilogram is getting lighter (the fact that it is getting lighter is independent of this object's role in defining the Kilogram), ergo the definition of Kilogram is getting lighter. We all weight the same, we'll just use a slightly bigger number to describe how heavy we are.

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    The enemies of Democracy are
  2. Re:The Kilogram is not losing weight by hjf · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I thought that originally the kilogram was defined in terms of water, the mass of 10 square cm of water.
    I think you meant 1 cubic decimeter.
  3. Re:Mass? by djmurdoch · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I doubt there's any equipment sensitive enough to detect weight difference in an object that was moved several feet but there is a change.

    According to the back of this envelope here, the weight change from raising a kilogram by one metre would be
    about equivalent to reducing its mass by about 3 parts in 10^7, i.e. 300 micrograms. The article says the measured loss was around 50 micrograms. So I guess there is equivalent sensitive enough to measure that.

    Unless I was off by a few orders of magnitude...

  4. Re:Bogus story, I think by ookabooka · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yes, but at what temperature/pressure? Both of these things affect the density of water as well. I'm assuming its STP or 25C and 1atm. Then again, how exactly do you go about measuring that...

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  5. 50 micrograms is just the right weight by Provocateur · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Put a warning label weighing 50 micrograms that says:

    WARNING: Measurements are approximate

    Problem solved.

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  6. They should redefine a kilogram by neomage86 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    in terms of planck mass. The planck constants are (to the best of our current knowledge) invariant since they are all based off universal constants (like the speed of light or the gravitational constant).

    The planck mass is defined as the mass for which the Schwarzschild radius is equal to the Compton wavelength over Pi.

    The Schwarzchild radius is 2Gm/c^2, while the Compton wavelength = h/mc = 2*pi * dirac's constant/(mc). (I'll refer to dirac's constant as d, since I don't know how to type the proper character).

    Setting the two equal yields 2Gm/c^2 = 2d/mc => m= sqrt(dc/G). Then, we could define 1 kg as 45940892.447777 planck masses. The only thing's we're assuming as constant are the speed of light, the universal gravitational constant, and planck's constant.

    1. Re:They should redefine a kilogram by aeve · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I agree, redefine...but it seems easier to redefine it by fixing Avogadro's number and then saying that the mass of one mole of C12 divided by 12 equals one gram.

      Maybe to a physicist/mathematician it seems inelegant to base the definition of mass on an arbitrary number (Avogadro's) rather than on a physical constant. But are we absolutely, positively sure that physical constants are constant throughout the space-time continuum and that we've got them exactly right?

  7. It must not lose mass! by EmbeddedJanitor · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Who cares if it loses weight. It just must not lose mass. kg is a unit of **mass**, not weight.

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  8. Re:hmmmm by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    clearly fabricated. Angels are old school. They all use vi.

  9. Re:Sublimation? by Guppy06 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "Well, why wouldn't the copies' atoms be drifting off as well?"

    They are, but not at identical rates.

  10. Re:The Kilogram is not losing weight by locofungus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    much as a pint of water weighs a pound (the world around, and takes 1 BTU to raise temperature by 1 degree F).

    You've got a strange definition of world there.

    On this side of the pond:
    "A pint of water weighs a pound and a quarter"

    I'm ashamed to have to say that it appears the majority of my countrymen would prefer to use "fundamental" units that have rhyming mnemonics rather than units that make all the calculations simple and consistent across the world.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6637587.stm

    Tim.

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  11. Re:The metre must be shrinking then... by lefticus · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Completely off topic to your post, but answering your sig:

    Who the f*** decided that sentences on the Internet shall no longer be formatted with two spaces after a period?!


    I had this explained to me in the mid '90's by someone who was involved in printing. With variable width fonts, you are no longer supposed to use two spaces, the typeface is supposed to leave an adequate gap. Two spaces is left over from the days of typewriters.