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AT&T Denies Censorship, Won't Change Contract
Vox writes "As we discussed here a few days back, AT&T's Terms of Service has very broad language giving them the right to terminate the account of any AT&T Internet service customer who criticizes the company. Ars Technica notes that such broad language is not unusual in ISPs' terms of service, and that AT&T told them they won't be changing the contract. A company spokesman said it's not a big deal because they have no intent to censor criticism. AT&T claims to respect its subscribers' right to voice their opinions and says that the contract is aimed at stopping the exploitation of children, and other tangible wrongs. As the article notes, taking the company on faith after the spying scandal is asking maybe a little too much."
If all they want to do is assert their right to shut down exploitative sites & users, wouldn't clauses A (violation of Acceptable Use Policy) and B (violation of law/regulation/tariff/etc.) be enough, without clause C (make AT&T look bad)?
A company spokesman said it's not a big deal because they have no intent to censor criticism.
Oh, well okay then, why didn't they say so? Hell, we should give the government the right to censor too, as long as they _say_ they have no intent to do it...I mean, governments and big corporations never lie to the populace, right?
/sarcasm
ZuluPad, the wiki notepad on crack
But you have to be a customer for them to cut you off.
A company spokesman said it's not a big deal because they have no intent to censor criticism. AT&T claims to respect its subscribers' right to voice their opinions
Then it won't be a problem removing it, now will it? Especially since existing tort law covers libel?
Any time someone says "oh, we don't intend to use that clause, ignore it", the correct answer is "I don't intend to take a verbal assurance you won't exercise a contractually granted right."
Any time someone insists on guaranteeing something off the record or verbally instead of in the contract you are negotiating there is a reason, especially when their statements contradict terms in the contract.
Please help metamoderate.
Blanket censorship excuse: "We're uhh... stopping the exploitation of children!"
Blanket surveillance excuse: "We're uhh... stopping the exploitation of children!"
Blanket excuse for a telecommunication company/government entity to do anything and everything it wants: "We're uhh... stopping the exploitation of children!"
Why has this method been so effective for so long? When will the madness end?
I detest the transparent prevarications of companies (and governments and ...) that claim a mile, but say "don't worry, we won't use more than an inch." I can understand that given the fuzziness of legal boundaries a prudent corporation might want to give himself a little extra wiggle-room, but my limited experience is that whatever is claimed will, eventually, be used... all of it.
There's a wonderful scene in a novel by John D. MacDonald's book Condominium in which a an agent pushes a legal paper at a condominium buyer saying it is "just a formality." A week later, the buyer is in the office trying to get action on various construction problems and glitches. The air conditioner won't work, for example. The agent says "You can handle that yourself; contact the manufacturer." After several serious complaints have been brushed aside, the buyer starts mumbling about withholding payments and legal action, and the agent tells him that he's basically signed all his rights away.
"But you said that was just a formality," says the buyer.
"That's right," says the agent, "it is a formal, binding, legal agreement."
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
Sounds like several rental agreements I've had over the years. When moving in I ask the landlord to make note of a dozen or more minor flaws with the apartment. The landlord either outright refuses (saying, we would never ding you for something that small), or says they'll do it but doesn't, then when I am trying to get my damage deposit back years later and am now dealing with a different person I lose most or all of the deposit because there is no documentation that says these little problems pre-date me.
person a "Oh, ok. I won't go there then. There's only 14 million other hosting copmanies and plenty of ISP's"
Yeah, I was thinking of switching back to dialup too. There just isn't that much need for me to have websites display in less than a couple of minutes, and online gaming was kind of overrated.
Of course, my dialup would be going over AT&T's phonelines, so I suppose they could send some guy out with the wirecutters if they don't like what I have to say.
If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
with exceptions for specific laws, eg. hate speech, where they apply
Problem is, one man's freedom of speech is another man's hate speech.
Hate speech laws are just that - they hate your freedom of speech. There are already laws on the books which prevent threatening and defamatory speech; the reason for hate speech laws is to prevent discussion on a particular topic, instead making it illegal to publicly espouse a position contrary to the politically correct one enshrined in law. The goal is to silence dissent and prevent critical thought on the issues of the day. The end result is that a small minority of politically connected people are able to force their particular vision of morality on the rest of the public.
Sure, you might think that someone who doesn't like homosexuality is a bigot; as long as hate speech laws exist, you'll never discover that there are some very good arguments against homosexuality, and that most who object to it do so not out of hatred, but because they've seen the effect it has had on
The society for a thought-free internet welcomes you.