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Undocumented Bypass in PGP Whole Disk Encryption

A non-mouse Coward writes "PGP Corporation's widely adopted Whole Disk Encryption product apparently has an encryption bypass feature that allows an encrypted drive to be accessed without the boot-up passphrase challenge dialog, leaving data in a vulnerable state if the drive is stolen when the bypass feature is enabled. The feature is also apparently not in the documentation that ships with the PGP product, nor the publicly available documentation on their website, but only mentioned briefly in the customer knowledge base. Jon Callas, CTO and CSO of PGP Corp., responded that this feature was required by unnamed customers and that competing products have similar functionality."

57 of 316 comments (clear)

  1. unnamed customers by underwhelm · · Score: 5, Funny

    Maybe they were unnamed because there is No Such Agency?

    --

    I don't need large brains to have a good time.

    1. Re:unnamed customers by moderatorrater · · Score: 4, Insightful

      A backdoor that's documented, although poorly, that you can disable and requires access to the unencrypted disk beforehand? If it were the NSA they wouldn't have allowed it to be documented and you couldn't disable. However, I can think of several large corporations that would require something like this and would have contracts large enough to justify changing the product for. Paranoia doesn't seem to be justified in this case.

    2. Re:unnamed customers by moderatorrater · · Score: 2, Interesting

      But it does mean that this is not that door. As mentioned elsewhere in this article, under no circumstances should you trust information that you want to be secret to a closed program/algorithm.

  2. Huh? by CoffeeIsMyGod · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "encryption bypass" ?

    That basically turns the entire thing into a physiological magic trick.

  3. closed source encryption software??!! by hxnwix · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Come on, why would you even consider using such a thing?

    1. Re:closed source encryption software??!! by moderatorrater · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Whoever modded that post flamebait is completely ignorant of the standards in the security agency, that commonly used security tools be completely open so that people can point out security flaws. With regards to this article, it sounds like the bypass feature was able to be turned on or off, and if they had documented it and let people know, then they could have taken the necessary steps to use it or not, depending on whether you were their unnamed customer.

      In other words, the parent's point is perfectly valid.

    2. Re:closed source encryption software??!! by dgatwood · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This is not uncommon, though the lack of documentation is.... Most such encryption products offer the ability to specify a master encryption key across an organization. The way that works is that your individual crypto key protects a copy of the drive-specific crypto key, which then protects the drive. The company you work for has a master crypto key which is also used to encrypt the drive-specific crypto key. (Usually the latter part is done with PK crypto so the employee can only encrypt contents with what he/she has, not decrypt it.) The purpose for such a "back door" is that if an employee leaves the company, you aren't screwed.

      Is there a reason to worry that there might be a secret NSA/FBI/CIA/KGB/Russian Mafia/Rush Limbaugh/Gary Coleman back door? Depends on whether you trust the security vendor. That said, I don't trust security software unless I can see the source code. If you and others can't inspect the code, then for all you know, the security could be nothing more than a little startup app that asks for a password and checks it against a cleartext string in BIOS before performing ROT13 on any data read from the partition. Security software is one of the few places where closed source software simply can never be trusted, and if you do, you are not paranoid enough.

      --

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    3. Re:closed source encryption software??!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      uhh, if you new anything about PGP you would know that all the source is published. If you have a remote office without local IT staff this feature makes sense. Every month you have to patch your windows servers, most of these patches require a reboot and if this feature didn't exist you would have to send someone out to type in a passphrase making remote administration impossible. Anyways the use case that the original article envisions is ludicrous. If you have rooted the box with a trojan you have access to the data already, there is no need to steal the physical machine.

    4. Re:closed source encryption software??!! by OfficeSupplySamurai · · Score: 5, Informative

      Come on, why would you even consider using such a thing? Because the source is available without cost, you just fill out a form, and then you can download it. It's not free software, but the source is not a secret either.
  4. The only people to enable would know about it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And if anyone else can enable it, then they already have access to your computer anyway.

  5. Did anyone read the response? by duplicate-nickname · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Seriously, customers require this so IT staff can do remote support and reboot the machine remotely. It is only enabled for one reboot, and you must have cryptographic access to enable this feature. The only threat is if someone where to enable this, not reboot, and then have the machine stolen.

    Why does crap like this make it to the front page of Slashdot?

    --

    ÕÕ

    1. Re:Did anyone read the response? by Lothsahn · · Score: 4, Informative

      They do have access to the keys. That's the point.

      They need to do unattended automated reboots of thousands of computers. These are enterprise customers.

      They have the encryption key, and they want to apply security updates and reboot the computers. When the employees come to work in the morning, they expect the computers to be on and operational, as they left it.

      If you don't use the feature, then it poses no risk. If you need to apply unattended updates to computers on a large scale, going to each computer and typing in the passphrase is not practical.

      This is a non-issue, and a FUD article. You need to have UNLOCKED access to the encrypted volume to enable this feature.

      Normal users using PGPDisk and not using this feature are at no greater risk for it existing.

      --
      -=Lothsahn=-
    2. Re:Did anyone read the response? by chill · · Score: 3, Informative

      No, there isn't. There are stories that only make it into category pages, like Games or Apple, but don't make it to the front page that everyone sees.

      --
      Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    3. Re:Did anyone read the response? by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The only threat is if someone where to enable this, not reboot, and then have the machine stolen.

      I see what is possibly another. I may enable a hole of this form:

      If someone gets access to the disk or its contents before the reboot, they can clone the state of the encryption software - which will do one "unlocked" reboot. Later (up to a point where the encryption key is changed) they can shut down the machine, reapply this state, and bring it up without the password, gaining access to data that has been added or updated since the state was cloned.

      I see ways to prevent this sort of attack. But they'd have to be built in with blocking such an attack in mind - which means the feature and defense against its corruption would have to be taken into account in the architecture of the rest of the product. (They'd also greatly increase the risk of corrupting the encryption software in a way that prevents even the authorized user from referencing the disk in case of, for instance, power problems on startup or an ungraceful shutdown.)

      --
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    4. Re:Did anyone read the response? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 2, Funny

      You had better pack a small bag and go. THEY are already on THEIR way to your house as I type this. GO! NOW!

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
  6. to put out some of the flames by trybywrench · · Score: 4, Insightful

    from the response:

    "We call it a passphrase bypass because that is what it is. It is a dangerous, but needed feature. If you run a business where you remotely manage computers, you need to remotely reboot them."

    and

    "You cannot enable the feature without cryptographic access to the volume. If you do not have it enabled, you are not affected, either. I think this is an important thing to remember. Anyone who can enable the feature can mount the volume. It is a feature for manageability, and that's often as important as security, because without manageability, you can't use a security feature."

    makes pretty good sense to me

    --
    I came to the datacenter drunk with a fake ID, don't you want to be just like me?
    1. Re:to put out some of the flames by MalleusEBHC · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Also, from his wording, it sounded like it is not enabled by default. In other words, you can actively choose to sacrifice a bit of security in order to make it work properly in your environment. Sounds like a nice feature to me.

    2. Re:to put out some of the flames by mritunjai · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You're missing the point!

      Yes, it is a nice(TM) feature and might be useful, but that is not the problem.

      The problem is that the feature is fricking undocumented. There is absolutely no way to know it is there and how to look out for it. It also means that you can't just know how many of these backdoors are in there. Is it only the first undocumented backdoor ? How many more of the convenience features are in there by customer demand ? How do they affect me ?

      When it comes to security software or hardware any and all undocumented features are BUGS! It's a principle, not a convenience!

      --
      - mritunjai
    3. Re:to put out some of the flames by Rogerborg · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Calm down, Sparky. It's documented to their customers, i.e. the people who actually need to know about it.

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  7. And People Wonder Why Open Source! by SerpentMage · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When it comes to encryption it is exactly for this reason why I use the "clunky", "hard to configure", "no GUI" Open Source!

    I know what I have, and what I get, and what others cannot get... Not that I have anything to hide. Just that I like my privacy.

    --

    "You can't make a race horse of a pig"
    "No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
    1. Re:And People Wonder Why Open Source! by spottedkangaroo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      For now anyway.

      If people complete various "hard" problems on quantum computers then the non-people at the NSA can probably afford to throw two billion (or whatever) at it to crack ALL MODERN ENCRYPTION that doesn't use quantum devices for keys.

      --
      Imagine if you weren't allowed to use roads because a bus company complained about your driving 3 times. --skunkpussy
    2. Re:And People Wonder Why Open Source! by Cheesey · · Score: 2, Interesting

      When it comes to encryption it is exactly for this reason why I use the "clunky", "hard to configure", "no GUI" Open Source!

      Ah, but that's not necessarily a defence against the NSA! Their backdoors might not be hidden in closed source binaries, or in obfuscated source code, or in your CPU hardware, or even injected covertly by your copy of GCC when it recognises encryption code. They might be mathematical backdoors, hidden inside well-known ciphers that are generally thought to be secure. There's the old story about DES, and how the NSA improved the cipher, but refused to say exactly why the new version was better... Don't trust anyone, especially if their name is a three letter acronym! :)

      --
      >north
      You're an immobile computer, remember?
    3. Re:And People Wonder Why Open Source! by wikinerd · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I like my privacy.

      Will be made illegal very soon :(

    4. Re:And People Wonder Why Open Source! by VENONA · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You sending people off to this reference would seem to indicate that you don't think anyone will read more than the first bits.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Data_Encryption_Standard&oldid=161828931, so the Wiki article is versioned.

      I guess it all depends upon whether you think factoring large numbers is a hard problem, whether special cases might exist, whether huge amounts of investment dollars matter, etc. From there you make your own call about whether or not to go all elliptical (another bag of worms) or not, etc. In the end, you either trust the math, or you don't. Not counting valid points you brought up about whether you can trust your hardware, compiler, or binary blobs.

      One point you didn't bring up is rubber-hose cryptanalysis, which has a proven track record dating back through several centuries. It might be a lot easier for an adversary to ignore your opinions on math, the openness of your compiler, etc. and just beat the living hell out of you. Or just toss you in a cell for contempt of court until you either give up a passphrase, or grow old enough to win a sympathy argument.

      Nothing is certain. First you evaluate the *perceived* value of the secrets you're trying to protect. Until you've done that, you can't estimate the potential intensity of the attacks that might be brought to bear in order to obtain those secrets. And only then can you think in terms of effective countermeasures. Assuming there are any, which may not be the case where, for example, an individual is squaring off against the resources of a governmental organization.

      --
      What you do with a computer does not constitute the whole of computing.
  8. Heh by jayhawk88 · · Score: 2, Funny

    "We are not the only maNufacturer to have Such a feature -- All the major people do, because our customers require it of us.

    1. Re:Heh by ch0ad · · Score: 3, Funny

      "We are not the onlY manufacturer tO have sUch a feature -- All the major people do, because our cusTomers requIre iT of us."

  9. Re:unnamed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny
    > unnamed customers? there's no such agency.

    Once upon a hard drive bare
    I pinged a host that wasn't there
    It wasn't there again today
    The host resolves to NSA.

    - Burma Shave

  10. Re:PGP or not so PGP? by dave420 · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you RTFA you'd see this feature is needed for anyone who remotely-boots their encrypted drive. The feature is not a backdoor - it has to be enabled by someone with cryptographic access to the drive, and it only works once per setting - reboot, and it's disabled. The only way this could be a security issue is if it's enabled, and before the drive boots up again, the drive is stolen. Features like this are needed, as without them, the drive is useless for remote management, and people won't use encryption, which is obviously far more insecure than having this feature and using it correctly.

  11. Re:Fine by me.. by illegalcortex · · Score: 5, Informative

    RTFA or at least TFComments (though that might be difficult in your rush to be first post). As many have pointed out, to turn on the feature, you have to already get past the encryption. It's not a "backdoor" in any sense. Someone who doesn't already know the passphrase can't use it to get access to the drive. Plus, this feature is turned off by default so the user has to actively enable it. You enter the passphrase, reboot the computer and on THAT boot, it doesn't ask you for a passphrase. Next reboot it does.

    This actually DOES sound like a very good feature and I would hope other products have it, too. Wish the editors would RTFA, too...

  12. Never mind; mod me down. by Valdrax · · Score: 2

    Didn't read the article -- didn't see that you can only bypass it by enabling it for the next reboot after which it returns to normal.

    --
    If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
    1. Re:Never mind; mod me down. by CoffeeIsMyGod · · Score: 3, Funny

      What, read the article? I'm confused. Isn't this /. ?

  13. Re:Fine by me.. by idontgno · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They also just lost credibility.

    Oh, I don't know. From the start, all the promised was Pretty Good Privacy. Not like Fort Knox, more like a combination padlock on an open-backed locker.

    I find myself wishing more and more that Phil Zimmerman hadn't sold to NAI.

    Does GPG have a full-disk mode? I think I could trust something with open source and reliable software freedom.

    --
    Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
  14. Many products allow disabling preboot auth by bongk · · Score: 5, Informative

    There is an inherent flaw with many of the commercial laptop full-disk encryption solutions out there. I have the most experience with Utimaco's Safeguard Easy, but I know many of the other big players have the same fault -

    The software has a feature called "Pre-boot Authentication", by which the encryption software is loaded after the bios, but before the (generally Windows) operating system. The user's password is used to generate the decryption key, so theorhetically not even the NSA could decrypt the laptop without the user's password.

    Here's the flaw - the software has a checkbox to disable Pre-boot authentication. What this does is generate a default user with a random password, and then store this random password obfuscated but in clear-text in the same disk area decryption software. When you talk to the sales-people, they sell this as a feature, in fact about half of Utimaco's customers (so I'm told) run it in this mode because the encryption becomes transparent and it is much less intrusive on the user. (Basically the disk is automatically decrypted each time the laptop is booted, but you have to have a valid Windows login to get in.) Buried in the help documentation are warnings "For security reasons, you should Never disable pre-boot authentication". So the engineers and the company know the weakness of disabling pre-boot authentication, but they don't tell their customers when they sell the software.

    Today it seems to break into these laptops with pre-boot authentication disabled you would need somewhat sophisticated tools and techniques, basically the same tools and techniques people commonly use to "crack" commercial software today. But I'm guessing that it won't be very long before someone takes the time to build this crack and releases it, rendering the laptop encryption useless to anyone who can Google for "Utimaco Crack", etc. Basically all the crack would need to do is grab the default user's password off the disk and use or duplicate the decryption algorithms that are also in clear-text on the disk.

    I've talked to a number of IT security folks, and basically it seems like most people trust the sales folks and don't understand that its basically impossible to have strong encryption without having the decryption key stored off the disk (like on a smart card, or in the brain of the user.)

    1. Re:Many products allow disabling preboot auth by foo+fighter · · Score: 3, Informative

      We use Utimaco SafeGuard Easy and we also bypass pre-boot authentication (PBA).

      The problem is a company may have thousands of laptops in the wild and Active Directory passwords that expire every 90 days. Because the PBA credentials aren't integrated with AD that means you have a nightmare password management situation. Utimaco does provide a server to try to alleviate this problem, but it's still a major management pain.

      It's true that by default the PBA bypass key gets stored obfuscated but in plain text on the hard drive if you bypass PBA. But if you have a modern computer with a trusted platform module (TPM) you can configure SafeGuard Easy to store the key there. You can also bind the hard drive to that particular TPM chip so that it is unaccessible if attached to another computer.
      http://americas.utimaco.com/safeguard_easy/manual_v430/1-245.html

      --
      obviously no deficiencies vs. no obvious deficiencies
  15. Re:Why is he modded down? by Racemaniac · · Score: 3, Informative

    well, read the other replies. apparantly it is a feature you have to enable yourself, which is useful in some cases, and is no security danger (unless you do stupid things with it). the entire story seems to be a non-issue... it's no real backdoor, just one you can enable for certain uses.

  16. Re:Fine by me.. by illegalcortex · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Or someone or something on the machine has to convince PGP that the user has actively enabled it.
    And that "someone or something" has to already know the encryption passphrase to do this. Please think these things through.
  17. Lack of security, new product proposal by sktea · · Score: 2, Funny
    I RTFA and the comments, and I realize that this constitutes a glaring security hole: even the owner of the data can gain access to it! For a REALLY secure system, I would expect to be barred access to any actual data I put in.

    With that understanding, I am developing a new data security system using heretofore unrealized technology, and plan to bring it to market in the near future: look for products from BHS in stores during the month of No-never.

    This message brought to you by the unique folks at BHS. Black Hole Systems: we are defined by our singularity!

    --
    Sometimes I have to say to hell with it and just eat my jellybeans.
  18. Re:TrueCrypt and GPG by king-manic · · Score: 2, Insightful

    As others have said, some parts of the U.S. government has become completely lawless. The government is requiring access and requiring that access be kept secret. The Bush administration has become a dictatorship. I think U.S. citizens should demand impeachment and that Cheney and the Decider be tried for treason. Why should the really big criminals be allowed to break the law?

    I keep hearing that the 2nd amendment would help in this situation but I haven't noticed any militias storming the local branch of the federal administration. I think the best way to protect Democracy is probably through self-motivated knowledge seeking and political activism on how things work instead of guns, but who can argue with a MP5.

    --
    "There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
  19. Re:Why is he modded down? by PylonHead · · Score: 4, Informative

    Because he failed to read the article correctly.

    There isn't a backdoor. If you encrypt your hard drive, then lose it, nobody can read it.

    If on the other hand, if you've encrypted your boot disk, and you want to remotely reboot your machine, you're going to need someway to feed the password to it before it can bring up the OS (and the networking layer).

    This feature allows you to store a password for 1 time use. Then you reboot the machine, and when it comes up, it reads the password and erases it.

    It's a useful feature. Doesn't effect you if you don't use it. Even if you do use it, you'd have to set the password then forget to reboot for it to be a problem.

    Basically this whole story is a non-issue. The moderation on the grandparent is a reflection of his failure to reason through this.

    --
    # (/.);;
    - : float -> float -> float =
  20. Which full disk encryption to use? by Aminion · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So which full disk encryption software does Slashdot recommend? Preferably FOSS and available for *Nix and Windows.

  21. Random Example Bank or Retail would want this by billstewart · · Score: 2, Insightful
    It looks very much like the kind of feature that a random bank or retail store would want - if the power goes out at a store, you want the system to be able to come back up and run the cash registers even though there's nobody technical enough to trust to press the "reboot" button much less connect a console and type in passwords.


    If you RTFA, you'll see that it's a feature that you can only turn on if you've already got access to the disk, and PGP did it so it only works once.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  22. "Unnamed Customers" by WED+Fan · · Score: 3, Interesting

    How much do you want to bet that "unnamed customers" are synonymous with "various federal and state police agencies, DOD, and NSA"?

    Takers?

    --
    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong fix.
    1. Re:"Unnamed Customers" by StrongAxe · · Score: 4, Informative

      How much do you want to bet that "unnamed customers" are synonymous with "various federal and state police agencies, DOD, and NSA"?

      From TFA, those "unnamed customers" are companies that have the need to remotely reboot their machines. This feature is NOT a backdoor - it merely allows someone WHO ALREADY HAS WRITE ACCESS TO THE ENCRYPED DRIVE (i.e. someone who has already given the passphrase) to grant a one-time certificate that permits a reboot without asking for the passphrase again. The major risk here is that someone will rob your store during the 60 seconds it takes to reboot over the phone, a possible, but highly unlikely scenario.

  23. Re:Fine by me.. by Dogtanian · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They shall now be treated as DISHONEST. Lets hope their unnamed big customer can afford to keep PGP in business as they lost mine. They can pay for my business PGP lost. Lets hope they are actually big enough. From everything that's been said, it seems that the worst that PGP can be accused of is not making clear the security implications of a feature that should have been better documented. And that's arguably quite bad- the worst case is a clueless user turning it on and feeling more protected than they should.

    However, the feature isn't enabled by default. It requires cryptographic access *and* knowledge of its existence to turn it on. And if you already have cryptographic access, then the whole issue is academic.

    You pompously declaring it "DISHONEST" in capital letters smacks of the typical random-geek's kneejerk first post on a messageboard thread. And FWIW, I don't know how much your oh-so-important business with them is worth anyway; I suspect that the other client probably *was* worth more. (Of course, it's quite plausible that the views of *many* smaller clients who disliked the feature would be a serious counterweight. However, if you're going to act like your *individual* view carries so much weight, expect scepticism).
    --
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  24. There was GPGDisk by Kadin2048 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The GPG program that you download doesn't do full-disk encryption; it's pretty purely a file/stream encryption program. I suppose you could use it for disk encryption, by streaming data through it on its way to and from a device, but that's not how it's normally used.

    There is/was a program around that used GPG to do FDE, called GPGDisk. I'm not sure whether it used your installed copy of GPG to do the heavy lifting, or if it just included the same code, or worked using the same algorithms but had its own totally separate crypto engine. It was reasonably popular for a while, but I think a lot of people who were using it have now switched to TrueCrypt.

    However, GPGDisk did offer some unique features, like the ability to encrypt a disk using a GPG key, and some fairly fine-grained access controls that you could set up for multiple users (IIRC). Every once in a while someone will mention it on the comments on Bruce Schneier's blog, so apparently it's still getting some use. But it doesn't offer some of the neater features that TrueCrypt does, like plausible deniability or containers-in-containers, I don't believe.

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
  25. PGP Does Open Source for Peer Review by A+non-mouse+Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But ... PGP has a peer review, open-source process. They're just a commercial product, too. [In other words, it violates the terms of service for you to compile their source code and use it without licensing it.]

    --
    libertarian: (n) socially liberal, financially conservative; neither left, nor right.
  26. Why is it necessary to have two passwords? by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 2

    I don't understand that argument. Why is it necessary to have two passwords? An organization must have a database of user passwords, correct? A user may call and say he lost his password.

    The only reasons I can imagine for having two passwords are convenience for IT, when they aren't fully automated, and secret government surveillance.

    An organization with 1,000 users must manage 1,000 passwords, anyway.

    What happens in an organization when a member of the IT staff leaves? The IT access special password, if there is one, needs to be changed on 1,000 computers.

    It seems to me that there may be far better ways to manage that situation rather than having a global password.

  27. unnamed customers??? by someone1234 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Hmm, the FBI paid them for having this backdoor?

    1. if i have a real (paying) customer who needs this, i will supply them (and only them) with a customised version.
    2. or i fully document the feature.

    --
    Patents Drive Free Software as Hurricanes Drive Construction Industry
  28. Jon *did* call it "dangerous" by billstewart · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yeah, it's a potentially dangerous feature - but some customers want it anyway, and at least PGP implemented it in a way that's less dangerous than it could have been. I'd have preferred to see some additional hardware involved, e.g. require input from a USB dongle or successful DHCP hit or something in addition to the disk-stored info, but it's hard to get that to work portably and reliably.

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  29. Re:Not turned off by default by illegalcortex · · Score: 2, Informative

    Either you still don't understand the feature, or you are willfully misinterpreting it. Once again, you must know the passphrase in order to unlock the data on the disk. If you know the passphrase, you already have access to the data on the disk, with or without this feature. Hence it is NOT a backdoor. A backdoor would mean you didn't need to know the passphrase. Knowing the passphrase is the FRONT door.

    Sheesh.

  30. Re:Fine by me.. by pilsner.urquell · · Score: 3, Interesting

    What, only one referance to Phil Zimmermann? One of the main reasons Philip Zimmermann created Pretty Good Privacy in 1991 was because of the US government wanting to install backdoors in encryption software.

  31. Re:Fine by me.. by illegalcortex · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I can't believe you made such a long post about a moot point. If you social engineer someone to give you the passphrase, you don't even need to use this feature. The passphrase is the whole thing encrypting the disk. If you have the passphrase, you ALREADY GOT THE ACCESS. You don't need any fancy reboot tricks.

  32. Re:You missed the point. What else are they hiding by Chibi+Merrow · · Score: 2, Insightful

    With propretary software, there's no way to know. It could have any number of malicious or ill-conceived/insecure features. Why risk it?


    Because a backdoor can just as easily be slipped into open source software, if not more easily since everyone's assuming "Oh it's open, someone else is looking for backdoors." On top of that, when things go south there's no one to point the finger at and no one to go to for support.

    Look at all the security flaws that have popped up in Firefox over the past two years that could have led to a complete security breach on a user's machine. Most were probably just innocent mistakes, but what if they were intentional? How would we know? And who could we blame?

    Putting a GPL license on something doesn't automatically make it pure and holy.
    --
    Maxim: People cannot follow directions.
    Increases in truth directly with the length of time spent explaining them
  33. Why they put it in by EnderQON · · Score: 2, Funny

    It's a bypass. You've got to build bypasses! Besides, you should've made your protest months ago. These plans have been on display at the planning office now for a year.

  34. Re:Not turned off by default by A+non-mouse+Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Either you still don't understand the feature, or you are willfully misinterpreting it. Once again, you must know the passphrase in order to unlock the data on the disk. If you know the passphrase, you already have access to the data on the disk, with or without this feature. Hence it is NOT a backdoor. A backdoor would mean you didn't need to know the passphrase. Knowing the passphrase is the FRONT door.

    Sheesh.
    Hey idiot! Go back to watching your "Full House" re-runs ('sheesh').

    I did not say that somebody who DOESN'T have a passphrase could turn the feature on. RTFA and realize that any USER (get it? Not "admin") can use this feature, enabling the bypass. Sure, today, (again, you near-sighted idiot) the only way to use this is through the command line, but this is a crypto operation, not a connection to your mom's website, meaning there is no record of who makes crypto operations. It might be a trojan (which yes, I get it, it's got your passphrase), but imagine this: a worm like the storm worm gets modified to (in addition to the myriad of things it does) capture users' passphrases, add the bypass, and modify the PGP Boot Guard to not remove the bypass ... ever. Then a random theft (get it? by somebody who doesn't know squat about PGP WDE) has access to data whilst admins think all is safe. What users will report that the nagging pre-boot auth dialog stopped working (as if they'd ever even notice)???

    And of course, (again I'll get enjoyment for calling you an idiot) an admin who uses this feature but has an adversary pick up the device PRIOR to the reboot happening and the oh so magical PGP Boot Guard removing the bypass ... well, that suddenly is unauthorized access by somebody who doesn't know the passphrase and didn't social engineer a user into giving it up.

    This guy gets it. Why can't you?

    Now go say hi to Jesse and the twins for me.
    --
    libertarian: (n) socially liberal, financially conservative; neither left, nor right.
  35. Re:Fine by me.. by 1u3hr · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I unplug your network cable and remove your hard drive, Plug your harddrive into my system..Get the data and recheck, the pre-boot authentication. Put the hard drive back into your computer. Turn it on. it continues the reboot process.. Except for the extra delay.....you never know I just got your data.

    You forgot the part where you descend form the ceiling suspended by a wire harness and hang upside down while typing into the console.

    With that degree of access, there are a million things you could do to gain access to sensitive data. (Eg, rummage throught the filing cabinet, paper is still king; install a physical keylogger dongle; etc, etc.) This would just be the icing on the cake; they're fucked already.

  36. This is how it works by illegalcortex · · Score: 2, Informative

    Okay, so let me explain why I'm telling you the software doesn't work like this. Here's the key thing to remember: the pre-boot lockout is not the thing protecting data on the disk.

    Here's a scenario:
    1) Install PGP and encrypt the drive.
    2) Reboot
    3) Turn on the bypass for the next reboot
    4) Shutdown
    5) Remove the drive and stick it (or copy of the drive) in another computer as a secondary drive
    6) Try to access the drive

    From your posts, it appears you think you'll see all the files. The simple fact is that you won't. It will appear as an unrecognized volume. That's because the files are still encrypted. The operating system will not be able to access the files. You're screwed.

    The whole bootloader is just another step of lockout. First there's bootloader, then there's the windows login. Again, the bootloader is not the thing that "turns off" encryption on the drive after you get past it.

    I was already assuming this was how it works because to do it otherwise would be quite foolish. I thought back to the parallels of how Windows works when you turn on encryption for certain files. The delay in most post was because I wanted to check this out with the real product to make sure my assumptions weren't bad. And guess what? I was right. I tried this out in the real world with the real product and the volume was still encrypted even though the bootloader password was bypassed.