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Ticketmaster Claims Hacking Over Ticket Resale Site
FlopEJoe writes "Ticketmaster claims that RMG Technologies is providing software to avoid security measures on their website - even to the point of utilizing bots to get large blocks of tickets. RMG says it just 'provides a specialized browser for ticket brokers.' From the New York Times article: 'The fact that tickets to popular events sell out so quickly -- and that brokers and online resellers obtain them with such velocity -- is clouding the business, many in the music industry say. It is enough, some longtime concertgoers say, to make them long for the days when all they had to do to obtain tickets was camp out overnight.'"
1) Lottery
2) Auction
3) Non-transferable tickets
An auction is the most capitalistic approach. Scalpers won't bid much lower than they think they can resell the tickets for later.
A lottery adds some fairness but only if you can limit the number of tickets per buyer and avoid the straw-buyer problem.
Non-transferable tickets that are refundable for 100% of the purchase price will solve the scalpers-buying-up-all-the-tickets problem but they aren't too useful if your target audience is children and others who don't have ID cards.
For popular shows, I'd go with selling non-transferable tickets, where any adult would need an ID that matched the name on the ticket and children would have to be accompanied by someone sitting nearby. If after a few days the promoters realize a given block of seats is not expected to sell out, I would lift the non-transferable restriction and let people sell their tickets on the open market. Anyone needing to return tickets could get their money back less the usual ticket-service charge.
If you show up with a non-transferable ticket in hand that doesn't have your name on it, you are turned away. You can contact the original purchaser to beg him to get you a refund.
I'm not sure how this would work for shows oriented to the 12-15 crowd, as these people usually come without their parents but without any ID other than a school ID.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Waah. They can spend some of the money they get from ticket buyers to come up with solutions to protect their customers (the promoters that is). It's their problem to solve, and I ain't going to help them. If they can't solve it, promoters might stop using them, and I would consider it progress.
~ a low user id is no indication I have a clue what I'm talking about.
I'm assuming ticketmaster isn't implementing the captcha correctly. There is only 3 ways to exploit the system:
1) enter in the captcha before the tickets go on sale, and purchase when available
2) bypass the captcha because its not a requirement to make a purchase
3) the captcha not complex enough to fool a computer for a few minutes
No software should be getting around it without someone typing in the magic letters after the tickets go on sale.
Led Zepplin held a lottery for tickets to an upcoming concert.
They neglected to tell the winners the tickets were non-transferable.
The promoters are telling ticketholders that if their names don't match the names on the credit cards they won't get in.
BBC News has more.
"What we have here is a failure to communicate."
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
all that is needed to fix this is for tickets to be tied to the credit card
All you need to fix this is for tickets to be sold in an auction format. If the highest bidder is a scalper then they won't be able to sell it at a higher price on the marketplace. Presto, no more scalpers. Now to only make sure the bands get the increases in ticket retail values and not TicketMaster or the record companies.
You do realize that the promoter for the event negotiates the service fee Ticketmaster will be allowed to collect? TM doesn't get to charge just any old fee they want without the promoter's explicit OK. If the promoter had his way, your ticket would have one figure on it, the face value, and all the fees and extras would be hidden in that single figure, and you'd not know there was anything to complain about. But state and local laws require varying degrees of itemization from place to place, and where disclosure requirements are most stringent, fans are most unhappy about ticket prices. Ignorance really is bliss sometimes.
Edith Keeler Must Die
The bottom line is that ticket prices should be dictated by a free market. If the tickets aren't worth whatever additional value the secondary market (including scalpers) places on them, no one will buy them. If a ticket is worth that much to you, it shouldn't matter if you're buying it from a broker (e.g. TicketsNow) or a fan (e.g. StubHub). But I think if the secondary sellers are using technology, buyers should be using technology to keep the sellers in check (e.g. oyaka.com, ninjatickets.com).
You do realize that Ticketmaster sells tickets exclusively (not including box office) for the vast majority of major venues across the US, don't you? You do realize what would happen to any act that challenged those fees, don't you? Watch the number of venues available to your act in vanish. No, TM doesn't get to pick any old fee to charge, but when a 600 pound, angry looking Gorilla says gimme, you gimme. So let us know, is ignorance bliss?
I think this is very interesting. It tells us a few things:
1) It tells me that ticket prices are, basically, under-priced. If scalpers are buying up the tickets and selling them for 10 times the face value, then Tickemaster should be selling those tickets at ten times what they are currently selling them for.
2) It tells me there is a lot of money in live performances. If I were a performer, I would capitalize on this by putting on 15 shows in a city instead of 5 (or however many I could continue to sell out) before moving on to the next city. While digital music is becoming worthless, clearly some live performances are skyrocketing in value.
3) It tells me that Ticketmaster needs to work on developing technology that can limit the number of tickets that can be purchased by any given entity or individual.
A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
Ticket scalpers and the secondary market are a problem that my company has been dealing with for years. Our goal, of course, is to protect ticket buyers from the ill effects caused by the secondary scalping market without requiring them to jump through too many inconvenient hoops. The question then becomes how do you make things difficult for scalpers without also making them difficult for ticket buyers and event producers?
We could require every ticket buyer to show their ID and credit card at the event to gain entry, but what about situations where a legitimate ticket buyer can't attend and wants to give or sell the ticket to someone else? Should a ticket buyer never be allowed to sell his or her ticket? And what about buying tickets as a gift for someone? Even if you ignored the problems this requirement would cause the ticket buyer, checking names on a list at the door can become a nearly impossible task for larger events with multiple points of entry.
We could limit the number of tickets available for a single purchase. The problem here, of course, is that scalpers are always going to find a way to automate the purchase process, so really all you've accomplished is annoying people who want to legitimately buy a large number of tickets for their friends, family, class, etc.
We could try to preempt the secondary market by offering some sort of built-in auction service. But then who gets the money from the increased ticket price? The original ticket buyer? Then all you've done is give scalpers a more convenient way to scalp. Does it go to the event producer? It should, but then why would anyone use our built in service when they could use an outside service and keep the profit for themselves? Should it go to the ticketing agency? Yes! (Kidding. Though in the case of some ticketing agencies, that's exactly what happens.)
We could try to get the laws changed to disallow ticket reselling. But I don't believe that laws limiting peaceful civil interaction are ever in the best interest of the general public. And let's be honest, scalping laws are never going to be brought back anyway. There's way too much money and there are way too many lobbyists involved at this point. Whatever the solution is, it's either technologically or logistically based.
I should probably submit this as an Ask Slashdot, but until that happens, I would be happy to chat with anyone who has suggestions for ways that we can protect ticket buyers from the secondary market without limiting their ability to give or sell tickets to others. You can message me through Slashdot or email me directly at slashdot at BrownPaperTickets dot com.
William Scott Jordan, CTO
Brown Paper Tickets
http://www.brownpapertickets.com/