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Vote To Eliminate Leap Seconds

Mortimer.CA writes "As discussed on Slashdot previously, there is a proposal to remove leap seconds from UTC (nee 'Greenwich' time). It will be put to a vote to ITU member states during 2008, and if 70% agree, the leap second will be eliminated by 2013. There is some debate as to whether this change is a good or bad idea. The proposal calls for a 'leap-hour' in about 600 years, which nobody seems to believe is a good idea. One philosophical point opponents make is that the 'official' time on Earth should match the time of the sun and heavens."

23 of 531 comments (clear)

  1. Wait by Monkeys!!! · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just hang on a sec....

  2. Re:Metric time? by daeley · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The French tried Decimal time (aka French Revolutionary Time) for a while, although of course the Chinese invented it.

    Decimal time always reminds me of the scene in Metropolis with two clocks on the office wall -- a 24-hour clock and a 10-hour clock (the length of the workers' shifts).

    --
    I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
  3. Chrono-noobs! by hedgemage · · Score: 5, Funny

    I've been keeping time with my sundial and temple-top observatory the way Ra intended! Damn you kids and your new-fangled timekeeping.

  4. Why not just make each second a little longer? by drgroove · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I thought of this issue years ago, and had actually sat down and done the math at one point... basically, to solve the time discrepancy, just slightly lengthen the second. Everything lines up. Of course, every book, piece of software, scientific instrument, medical equipment, ... well, basically everything in human civilization ... would need to be re-build, re-calibrated, re-programmed, re-manufactured, etc. If nothing else, we'd stimulate the living hell out of the world's economy.

    1. Re:Why not just make each second a little longer? by mbone · · Score: 5, Informative

      Of course, the real problem is that the rotation of the Earth is not constant (the leap seconds are mostly driven by fluid motions in the core).

      Originally, back in the 1960's, instead of the leap seconds, they (the BIH at the time) adjusted the rate of the UTC seconds with respect to TAI. This was widely viewed as not a good thing once it was tried and was dropped, IIRC in 1972.

  5. Other way by professorfalcon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    How about going the other way... leap microseconds. Many times during the day. Then nobody will hardly notice.

    1. Re:Other way by 4D6963 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      How about going the other way... leap microseconds. Many times during the day. Then nobody will hardly notice.

      Actually it sounds like a good idea. As someone else suggested, the difference due to leap seconds is so small that only atomic clocks are precise enough to need to take them into account. And since we're all synced on atomic clocks anyways we could just make that happen transparently upstream.

      --
      You just got troll'd!
  6. Re:year 2612 bug anyone? by aevan · · Score: 5, Funny

    In other news, people in 2612 voted to put off the issue of 'leap hours' until 16412, where they propose to add a 'leap day', ostensibly in February.

  7. What would be wrong with by maroberts · · Score: 5, Interesting

    A leap minute every 10 years (or so)?

    One event every 10 years does not cause lots of disruption, and being a minute out of sync with solar time is not large enough to be a problem. You'd notice an hour's difference if you're in a northerly latitude and have Daylight Saving Time...

    --

    Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
    Karma: Chameleon

  8. This is why... by MegaMahr · · Score: 5, Funny

    This is why I refuse to set the time on my VCR...

    --
    788652 = 2 x 2 x 3 x 3 x 19 x 1153
  9. A 'leap-hour' in about 600 years by niceone · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yeah, because the best way to to deal with a small problem is to put it off until it becomes a really big problem.

  10. Re:Metric time? by Amiralul · · Score: 5, Funny

    Or better, wake up at 256, eat lunch at 512 andd GOTO sleep at 1024.

  11. Please take some care with editing... by Mantle · · Score: 5, Insightful
    ... which nobody seems to believe is a good idea.



    Um... isn't the whole point of this article that some people think it's a good idea? TFS even says there is debate over whether it is a good or bad idea!

  12. Re:Yup. by arth1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It gets worse than that, even.

    What is a year?

    Is it the time from perihelion to the next perihelion?
    Is it the time from zenith on the shortest day to zenith on the shortest day next year?
    Is it the time for when a star within our galaxy is in the same position again?
    Is it the time for when a star outside our galaxy is in the same position again?

    The earth's orbit rotates, and the solar system rotates, in a galaxy that rotates. And speculation is that the universe rotates too.

  13. What a number of people don't realize... by swamp_ig · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The leap second is required because the earth's spin is slowing down in a complex, non-linear way.

    Changing the length of the second simply won't work, in a couple of hundred years we'll be right back to where we started again. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leap_second for details.

    The leap hour is a daft idea, why change something that isn't broken, if a tad inconvenient.

  14. Re:Yup. by aproposofwhat · · Score: 5, Funny
    Oblig. Python quote:

    Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
    And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour,
    That's orbiting at nineteen miles a second, so it's reckoned,
    A sun that is the source of all our power.
    The sun and you and me and all the stars that we can see
    Are moving at a million miles a day
    In an outer spiral arm, at forty thousand miles an hour,
    Of the galaxy we call the 'Milky Way'.

    Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars.
    It's a hundred thousand light years side to side.
    It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick,
    But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
    We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point.
    We go 'round every two hundred million years,
    And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions
    In this amazing and expanding universe.

    The universe itself keeps on expanding and expanding
    In all of the directions it can whizz
    As fast as it can go, at the speed of light, you know,
    Twelve million miles a minute, and that's the fastest speed there is.
    So remember, when you're feeling very small and insecure,
    How amazingly unlikely is your birth,
    And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
    'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.

    --
    One swallow does not a fellatrix make
  15. Re:They have to add a leap something, sometime by evanbd · · Score: 5, Informative

    Leap years are to deal with correcting the length of the year, which isn't an integral number of days. Leap seconds are to deal with the fact that the length of a day changes slowly and at a variable rate. It's not the same problem at all.

  16. Re:Metric time? by Slashidiot · · Score: 5, Funny

    Yay, imperial time!

    The smallest unit is the "Moment", and then the "While" (or, less used, the "Whilst"). A while is about 14.4 moments. Then you have the "long while", which is 13.8 whiles, then the "time", and "long time"...

    For example, it took me a while and three moments to write this comment. I'm not a quick typer...

    --
    Tis women makes us love, Tis Love that makes us sad, Tis sadness makes us drink, And drinking makes us mad.
  17. Simple and accurate solution by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Run computers on TAI (International Atomic Time). Keep it constantly flowing, and never add or remove seconds, as per the definition. Then simply calculate UTC in software from a published leap offset between the two, which compensates for the leap seconds:

    UTC = TAI - leapseconds

    Then define all the timezones off of UTC as normal. All this basically does, is make the calculations for the timezones into a few hours plus or minus a few seconds. This makes a lot more sense, because then you actually have a fundamental time (TAI) which doesn't have discontinuities, but if you want to consider your astronomical orientation, you look at UTC or your local time. We don't need to redefine these types of time, because these already exist. We just need to use them more intelligently.

  18. Your post - Bollocks by janrinok · · Score: 5, Informative

    We used to have 120 pence to the pound in the UK

    There were 240 pence to the old (pre-decimalisation) pound, comprised of 20 shillings each worth 12 (old) pence. Do you remember guineas, crowns, half-crowns, shillings, tanners (6-penny piece), threepenny bit, pennies, half-pennies, farthings (a quarter penny)? I do. I suspect that I am quite a bit older than you and I cannot ever remember there being 120 pence to the pound. So either please provide a citation or confess that you are mistaken/talking bollocks. :-)

    But the main thrust of your post was correct with regards to dividing sums of money easily. Or at least it was until the education system decided that mathematics and mental arithmetic were not the most important subjects in life. I'm not sure how some of today's young people could cope with such problems.

    --
    Have a look at soylentnews.org for a different view
  19. Re:year 2612 bug anyone? by Warg!+The+Orcs!! · · Score: 5, Funny

    16412 is also a leap year The extra day in February would be the ultra rare 30th of February. It's worth doing even if you have to wait 14405 years for it work.

    --
    Travelling forward in time at a rate of 1 second per second.
  20. Some numbers... by Cadre · · Score: 5, Funny

    Just use your ten fingers to represent a binary number. Make sure you order the bits properly! We'd certainly end up a more dexterous population...

    That would be an interesting transition period as people got used to indicating or recognizing the numbers 4 or 128...

    --
    All editorial writers ever do is come down from the hill after the battle is over and shoot the wounded.
  21. Re:year 2612 bug anyone? by backwardMechanic · · Score: 5, Funny

    That's a long time to wait for a birthday for the poor kid born on Feb 30th!