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"Manhattan Project" For Prosthetic Arms
cortex tips us to a story about a nationwide effort to incorporate advanced technology into the next generation of prosthetic arms. Researchers for the DARPA-funded project are developing feedback techniques that range from sensors on the surface of the user's skin to electrodes implanted on the inside of the user's skull that intercept and interpret signals from the motor cortex. Quoting:
"'Think about taking a sip from a can of soda,' Harshbarger says. The complex neural feedback system connecting a native limb to its user lets that user ignore an entire series of complicated steps. The nervous system makes constant automatic adjustments to ensure, for example, that the tilt of the wrist adjusts to compensate for the changing fluid level inside the can. The action requires little to no attention. Not so for the wearer of current prosthetic arms, for whom the act of taking a sip of soda precludes any other activity. The wearer must first consciously direct the arm to extend it to the correct point in space, then switch modes to rotate the wrist into proper position. Then he must open the hand, close it to grasp the soda can (not so weakly as to drop it but not so hard as to crush it), switch modes to bend the elbow to correctly place the can in front of his mouth, rotate the wrist into position, and then concentrate on drinking from the can of soda without spilling it."
Research into prosthetics always blooms during and after a war.
Of course it's a good thing for civil injuries too, but it's still a sad occasion.
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One recipient of a new prosthetic hand crushed his pewter goblet and proclaimed that the new prosthetic hand was "Groovy!"
Similar to the upcoming US election results
Mobile Infantry made me the man I am today!
So it's an arms race, then?
I disagree. Generally, to use a motorized limb it takes training. The electrode doesn't just read "he wants to take a drink", that's just not possible yet. What is really happening is that the electrode is sensitive to certain frequencies; for example more activity in the xHz-yHz lvl makes the hand open and less activity in the xHhz-yHz lvl makes the hand close. You don't just think about doing it, it requires training to figure out how to move it. I'm reminded of a show I saw about it where a guy described thinking about tense thoughts, like crushing a can or kicking something as opposed to thinking about laying on a bed or floating on a raft to change his "frequencies" to use a function of his limb. Adding more inputs I think would make it even harder until we can figure out how to read thoughts.
I wonder, DARPA is doing a lot of work on doing neural interfaces, as well. It would be interesting if this could be combined to give a person more arms, esp if just temporary (say a 1 year stint). In addition, I would think that all this work on arms for ppl, will apply to pure robotics.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
No, it doesn't work well for the arm, either. The problem is that the electrical signals on the skin are very, very noisy, and filtering it enough to get a readable signal introduces a phase delay of at least 100 msec. There are still no good implantable electrodes to tap the nerves directly, and without that, you may as well control it with physical muscle movements.
Ah, yes, Mantrid arms, weapons of mass destruction.
I am missing my left hand....long story. This is great, now when they are in my price range (if I'm still alive) and I get one, I can crush the skull of anyone who kept the price high in my cyborg hand.
!sig
Yeah, my right hand is pretty much useless due to a birth defect, so I'm always interested in the development of alternatives ;)
But what I'd REALLY like is some mechadendrites, WH40K Mechanicus style!
Praise the omnissiah!
Compulsory Wiki link for the confused: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adeptus_Mechanicus
Machine9dotNet
I'd imagine that soldiers with stronger, faster limbs and such would be an advantage...
But personally, if I were to lose a limb, I'd be much happier with something that both resembled and worked as the old one did.
Since we can now replace things like knee and hip joints, and since the structure (as opposed to the additional functions) of the bone is well understood, I see no reason why artificial "bones" can't be designed to replace the damaged or missing ones. Then, with tissue grafting (fairly well established) and culturing (starting to be used), and therapy, normal function (and generally normal appearance) could be achieved.
I think this would be a better accomplishment overall...
Another interesting thought on this is just how much the "subconscious" processes can still be learned. They are not fixed in stone - even remotely.
Watching my mother attempt to operate a mouse is a painful experience, but how many of us on Slashdot even think twice about the motor movements we make to move the cursor around, click on things and scroll up and down?
My mother has no prosthetic limbs, and has a good 25 years more experience than me in using her arms and hands for normal day to day tasks. On the very rare occasions she may operate a mouse, there's still a huge amount of it that is automatic and reflexive, despite the awkwardness that is visible. Now think how much would go in to a machine to emulate just her ability, let alone yours or mine.
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Is it not true though that our enemies IEDs and such are specificially designed to maim. And do you really think gulf war/gulf war II syndrome isn't real?
Great NEWS!
The "Manhattan Project" for prosthetics is just what we need. We MUST get those prosthetic arms before the Nazis do. Let's send every prosthetic scientist in the country to the middle of nowhere New Mexico. We must have utmost secrecy on this so no one knows what we are doing. Our country's security depends on this. Only when it is perfected can we drop this on an unknowing Baghdad and win the war in one quick stroke, preventing a long, drawn out invasion of Iraq.
(When analogies go bad, next on Fox)
a small child doesn't adjust cup while drinking, they'll spill if they're not using a lidded training cup. The brain has to learn to do those complicated automatic adjustments and it takes a very long time. so that can be true for prosthetic limbs too, if it takes a year to learn how to properly control one to drink from a glass without conscious effort that's still a much shorter time than it took us to learn with natural limbs! putting such automatic features into an artificial limb could very well be a mistake, let the brain learn to handle that.
I don't think it's a troll because the poster totally believes it. And I assume by "FOX" you mean Fox News-- unless you think that somehow the Simpsons have become a right-wing mouthpiece. Hmm... that doesn't seem to fit. Must be because you've bought into the Clintonesque "right-wing conspiracy" meme as well.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
Are they nuclear arms?
Particles, stuff that matters.
Kryten: Right, now this is a copy of the standard model from the 21st century. Er, comfortable, sir?
Lister: It's fine, yeah.
Kryten: Okay, now let's recap: the limb is connected to neurons which run up to the left hemisphere of your brain, which controls the right side of your body. Now, all you have to do is merely command the arm to do something, and it obeys. Now, let's practice. Right, concentrate, sir. I want you to think: "Arm: pick up the ball."
Lister: Okay.
Kryten: Now just think: "I will pick up the ball."
Lister: I will pick up the ball.
Kryten: That's right, good, now, concentrate.
Lister: I will pick up the ball.
Kryten: Okay, now really think: Hand, pick up the ball. That's right, that's right. Hand, pick up the ball. Hand, pick up the ball! That's right, now keep going, sir! Pick up the ball! Now, focus down onto that and keep the thought, sir! Hand, pick up the ball!
[As Kryten offers verbal support in ever increasing volume, Lister strains and grunts, effort twisting his facial features as the hand lies motionless.]
Kryten: That's right, sir, now keep going, now really think, now. Hand, pick up the ball! Now let's really get it going, sir! Pick up the ball! Pick up the ball! Really start to go now, sir! Hand, pick up the ball, now let's keep moving! Keep on, sir, you can do it! HAND, PICK UP THE BALL! YOU'RE GOING TO MOVE THAT HAND, SIR! YOU'RE GOING TO MOVE IT! MOVE THE HAND, SIR!! HAND! PICK UP THE BALL!! PICK UP THE BALL!! YES SIR! YES! WE'RE STARTING TO MOVE, NOW! YES! IT'S DEFINITELY MOVING, SIR! YES!! Oh! Bravo, sir!!
[Kryten tails off as Lister successfully moves the hand from its resting place to grab the ball which has sat motionless, three or four inches away from where he started.]
Lister: Oh! The sweat's dripping off me!
Kryten: Oh, that was fantastic, sir! Absolutely marvelous, it worked like a dream!
Lister: [incredulous] Is that it?
Kryten: Well, er, how do you mean, sir?
Lister: Is that the best it works??
Kryten: In what way?
Lister: If I want to pick up a ball, am I going to have to take the morning off?
Kryten: It was a tad slow, I'm forced to admit.
Lister: A tad? The only thing I've ever seen pick up slower is Rimmer in a disco.
Kryten: Well, maybe if I adjust the impulse valve it might make it a little more sensitive. [makes adjustment] Okay, let's try again: "Hand, pick up the ball."
Lister: Okay... hand, pick up, the ball.
[Lister's arm shoots forward and clangs across Kryten's inattentive jaw]
Kryten: Okay... right... well, er, let's try again.
[Kryten takes a position to the side of the arm.]
Lister: Okay?
Kryten: Now: "Hand, pick up the ball."
Lister: Hand, pick up the ball.
[The arm flings itself out sideways and cracks Kryten again]
Kryten: I think, sir, there's a lot of anger inside you, and that's what's driving the arm.
Lister: I don't feel angry.
Kryten: Well, you've lost your arm, sir; you've every right to feel angry.
Lister: I don't! I promise, I don't!
Kryten: Ah well, you see, it's subconscious. You're thinking, "Hand, pick up the ball," but your subconscious is saying, "Punch Kryten in the head; beat the brains out of the demented droid that cut off my beloved arm." Am I right?
Lister: Kryten, that's rubbish!
[Again the arm shoots Kryten-wards, sending the droid reeling]
Lister: You're right! It's controlled by my subconscious!
Kryten: It's far too dangerous to let you out with that arm, sir. Two minutes with Miss Kochanski and who knows what you'd be swinging around your head!
Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
When will they begin work on whole prosthetic bodies?
Shirow promised us a cyberpunk future, and I want my moon base too!!!
Tsukasa: All I really want, is to be left alone...
The complicated series of maneuvers in the summary is challenging for a 2-year old as well, and takes months or years to perfect. The smoothness of the activity to an adult is based upon years of practice. I mention this because the article doesn't seem to mention that even with a bijillion sensors (even tied directly into the brain stem) and lots of axis/control that the learning curve would be shortened.
A well-trained backhoe operator can do amazing things whereas a newbie would be hard-pressed to deal with one axis at a time.
I think the methods they talk about are great, and there must be a need for better bio-feedback or they wouldn't be doing it, but I would love to see a discussion about how older tech takes X years to master and newer takes Y. I wonder if they'll be different? Not that it matters to a person with this need - they'd want the one that givers them the most sensations.
I'm thinking about it, therefore I might be.
The entire point of my message is he BELIEVES it is true despite the fact that it's completely false. Thusly, I suggested the use of a "+1 Ignorant" rather than "Troll" because it's much closer to reality. I then went on to explain why these types of popular myths come to be, which again, is factually supported (well, at least by both ratings and numerous studies). I then get rated troll and you proceed to imply I'm a nut case or simply been duped. WTF?
According to you, living with reality, dealing with facts, and presenting facts, makes people dupes and idiots. I might suggest you first re-read my post as you start off supporting the entire point of my post. That suggests you either misread, misunderstood, or are just plain out there.
Going to a VA hospital can be hard for some people because it can bring back painful feelings about their military experiences. The staff and volunteers at VA hospitals are careful about creating a safe atmosphere. Last week I was back in the prosthetics department at the Seattle VA hospital to be fitted for a brace. The place is cramped. The narrow hallway makes it tricky to maneuver gurneys in and out of the fitting rooms. The place is in a basement. The patients there have lost more than those that one usually sees in other departments. Not just body parts, but they also seem to be more bereft of social support and spouses than elsewhere. This puts a higher psychological workload on staff. It's hard to put into words the appreciation due to the people who work in the prosthetics field at the VA. But I'll try. Thank you.
Cant they just use a straw and one of those beer-can hats or something?
There's a huge influx of money to treat PTSD. Maybe you haven't noticed that Bush and McCain refuse to support a "GI Bill" for Iraq and Afghanistan vets. I've got news for you, the current administration is doing everything they can to screw veterans.
Did you know that severely wounded vets are coming back and their level of disability is being downgraded by the DOD so they don't have to pay benefits? A guy who's colon got chopped to bits by an IED and his spine partly shattered is being listed as having a "hernia".
You are welcome on my lawn.
Yeah, we set up one of our old computers for my grandmother, strictly for email. The poor dear was simply helpless with the mouse! She couldn't watch the cursor on screen, she had to watch the mouse itself, then look up to check how far the cursor had moved. We hoped some of the games help her get comfortable with the mouse, but she eventually gave up. Old dog, new tricks, etc.
It was eye-opening to realize just how massive a hurdle it was for her, when it is so natural for me.
I...I'm attacking the darkness!
The whole idea about dropping the can isn't very good at all - if the arm can raise the can an inch off the surface, the little finger can be swung under the can to stop it falling out of the grip.
It's just an excuse for the current set of control systems not being able to handle movements for all five digits in real time.