Slashdot Mirror
A Screenshot Review of KDE 4
billybob2 writes "PolishLinux.org has an extensive screenshot review and commentary on the development version of the Free and Open Source KDE desktop. Highlights include the ability to run any desktop applet prepared for Mac OS X inside Plasma, on-the-fly annotation and rating of files from within the Dolphin file manager. It also has an improved GUI for the Amarok music player, flexible 3D eye candy configuration in KWin, and improved support for both accessing digital cameras via the Solid hardware layer and the DigiKam photo manager."
I've recently been able to do some widget development for OS X (nothing complex, just some HTML, JS, and AJAX calls). It's a neat little environment but the error reporting left a lot to be desired.
That said, I really appreciate the ability to open Dashboard widgets in KDE. The interface isn't that magical, and except for the ability to call native code shouldn't pose much of a problem for the developers. I was wondering if they were going to do something like this and I'm glad they have.
The little widget I developed could be used by users of one of our applications. I think a fair number of them would like it. For various reasons, 30% of the users of this application are using Macs, so that doesn't pose a problem. But when I pitched the idea (with a mostly complete widget) to my superiors they weren't that interested. I was basically told "that's quite neat, but it needs to work on Windows."
Ignoring my minor "let Mac users have something first" attitude, there is a very serious problem with providing the Widget on Windows. I can't (reasonably). I researched the options and here is what I found.
That list ignores whatever GNOME uses, and the 5-10 smaller engines that very few people use. Who knows how many people use Google Desktop or Yahoo! Widgets. None of the widgets developed on these systems works with any of the other system. Even if the widget is a simple as a "Hello, world" HTML file and image(s), the markup between Dashboard and Google is quite different. From the quick look I put into it, the same thing is true with Vista and Yahoo!. Google Desktop widgets can be loaded into the Dashboard, if you have Google Desktop installed on your Mac, because it performs some kind of translation.
So I can't develop a widget. The only user base I can promise is Vista. That's a big headache and only 2/3s the side of the Mac users we know of. Asking users to go install Google Desktop or Yahoo! Widgets just to be able to view our little widget is a little tough. Making the application native would take quite a bit of time. Integration for a custom Google homepage is probably the best option for us, but still not worth it due to the inability to predict the number of people who would actually use it.
So the project (which was just a side project of mine) is basically dead. Unless they decide that providing the widget to only Mac users (I find this very unlikely), the time isn't judged to be worth it (and I don't blame them). Until Vista takes over (probably by this time next year due to MS phasing out XP sales to OEMs) there are just too many widget engines. Targeting any decent sized group of users is nearly impossible. It's a quirk of our market that Macs have the market share they do.
This kind of consolidation is a very nice thing. As a KDE user, instantly getting so many widgets available (since outside of native code and possibly running shell commands, there shouldn't be porting) is a very nice thing.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
I tried it and quickly switched back to Gnome. I have a session chock full of eye-candy and effects to show people what Linux can do. But when it comes down I'm a minimalist and tend to turn the fluff off to save my battery life and to get all of the cycles I can when I'm rendering. That said I do like the leaps and bounds that KDE has been taking to modernize itself.
"Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right" - Salvor Hardin
to us OS X users. A free OS with these abilities really begs that Linux be given another look by the general public for a main desktop (and with the announcement of Adobe coming to the Linux arena, this just emboldens it's abilities). Unfortunately, until audio/video and graphics apps become powerhouses on the Linux platform, I'm afraid OS X will remain my main OS of choice.
Never monkey with another monkey's monkey.
Maybe it's just me... but is anyone else really tired of the Fisher-Price trending in desktop operating systems.
It started with Windows XP, but it wasn't *too* bad... but then Gnome showed up with full blown Fisher-Pricey-ness. KDE has always been halfway there, and with KDE 4, it looks like they have completed their journey. OS/X showed up to the party with the Teddy Ruxpin of desktop graphics. A little more sophisticated, but still clearly for kids.
So, we have all the major operating systems/window managers fully in the Fisher-Price camp. Clearly this is what the consumer wants (or is it?) - but what I don't understand is why. Am I the only person who wants my OS Desktop to look "cool" and not "cute" right out of the box? I realize "cool" (and "cute") is subjective, but I think some themes that cater to both camps out of the box would be a welcome addition.
Now, I know Gnome does not have anything of which I speak, and KDE 3 does not. I don't know about OS/X, but I've never seen a "stock" theme for OS/X that looks like something a working person would use, just the Fisher-Price-esque desktop.
I realize there are third party applications and themes to correct this... but I have yet to find something I like; They always look like something a teenager designed or something a kid would use. I have absolutely no doubt something "cool" and "utilitarian" is out there, but I have yet to find it.
The whole point of my post, though, is why the Fisher-Price trend in Desktops? What is so appealing about making the desktop look like a toy?
As a long-time KDE fan, I have been waiting for what seems like forever for KDE 4. I've been using 3.5 every day, along with OS X Tiger/Leopard, for the last couple of years. I love the apps, I love the environment and, in general, KDE's sense of style. The beauty that is Oxygen has had me stoked since the first screenshots came out.
I've been trying to use it as my regular window manager since a repo became available to Kubuntu users. I have been fully prepared to sacrifice some functionality and applications to use the latest and greatest, but yet still can't use it on an everyday basis, by a long shot.
Besides just general bugginess, there are some issues with the user interface that need fixing ASAP. First and foremost is speed. KDE has always been snappy for me, even on PowerPC G3/G4 hardware. On my Dell Inspiron with a 1.83 GHz Core Duo, things take forever to launch. It feels like OS X Public Beta all over again to me, in terms of application launch speed. (KDE 3.5 is super snappy on this same box.)
Next on my hit list are the widgets. We need to be able to hide the widget launcher in the right hand corner of the desktop. I've always been able to keep a super-minimalist desktop with KDE, and this menu is nothing short of distracting. And why is the panel now a widget that can only accept other widgets (of which there are a very small amount)? Where are the great little applets and buttons from KDEs past? Why can't I add an application launcher icon to the panel, like in any other desktop environment out there? For that matter, can I even create a custom application launcher anywhere? Why can't the panel be made to be a custom size?
KDE 4 has the potential to be truly revolutionary, but at this point, it's all good looks and severely lacking in functionality. Here's hoping 4.1 will actually be where 4.0 should have been.
:q!
Minimalist? What do you mean by that?
The KDE 4 design is considerably cleaner than KDE 3. It uses less memory, and runs faster, and when KDE 4.1 hits with QT 4.4, it should improve significantly again. There is a known issue with QT 4.3 that forces some hackery in screen rendering that is resolved in QT 4.4
I'm not sure how Gnome is more minimalist, unless you mean fewer options and features. Then again, I'm not sure why people don't like having choice.
http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
OTOH, Konfabulator and Dashboard are basically the same freakin' thing. They're both a runtime engine for creating/running markup-based (e.g. XML, HTML) mini-programs (widgets) with JavaScript code. The format for creating widgets is open and users can create their own widgets which they can share on Konfabulator/Dashboard widget sites.
Dashboard was so much different (and more significant) than Desk Accessories that Steve Jobs introduced Dashboard at the World Wide Developers Conference. Many developers in attendence were confused because Jobs seemed to be describing Konfabulator, which already existed and Jobs pretended didn't exist.
No, I didn't claim that - I said Konfabulator predates Dashboard.
then it's utterly disingenuous to claim that K-ator is not a "ripoff" of Desk Accessories in exactly the same sense. To anyone with a functioning brain, K-ator is much more similar to Desk Accessories than to Dashboard. If you disagree, I invite you to explain why rather than trotting out troll talking points.
Konfabulator could fetch information from a network & was easy to develop for, but again - I don't claim that anything's ripping off anything.
And Spotlight a ripoff of Beagle? A laughable, intentional lie. Again, if those two are similar enough to call Spotlight a "ripoff", then Beagle is a ripoff of every indexed search project since 1935.
But I do think Beagle has borrowed from every indexed search project since 1935 - I even said (in the post you're replying to): "Sorry fanboy. You're wrong.
There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
On the other hand, I consider myself a former Gnome user.
The last version of Gnome I was happy with was 1.4, though I have continued to use it through 2.18 or even 2.20. Every single revision took some options away — some options I had been using, too. I'd never much liked KDE (admittedly, mainly because I found Gnome to be prettier, i.e. more themeable), but as far as Linux is concerned, I'm switching to KDE. The tipping point for me was when Gnome ruined the dictionary applet, BTW.
KDE 4 seems to have many of the things I like about OS X, which has recently become my primary OS. Not to mention that in the near future I should be able to put KDE on my Windows install, thus making my life with Windows easier. I just wonder whether there is a decent OS X-like dock for KDE now; taskbars annoy me.
My father and several other Linux newbies (and computer newbies, for that matter) just love the new KDE menu, so I switched all their computers to KDE-based distros (still 3.5, though).
And it looks good now.
The only environment whose looks I like better is E17, but I have no time to play with alpha software. It's a pity those guys don't do something more with their project, as it would be just perfect for older systems (their graphic library is amazingly fast IME).
Ignore this signature. By order.
As a Windows gimp, I have been trying to install and use Linux for ten years. I always used KDE and it was always the same two things that killed it as an experience for me:
1. RPM (What is up with that, way to go to differentiate your product for Enterprise, make all software pretty much uninstallable and unmanageable)
2. KDE, I installed it each time, and each time, the desktop was great for a day, then slipped irreversibly into a quagmire of wierd bugs, or horrible configurations I couldn't rescue.
OK, I'm noob. But that's my point. Ever since I first installed Ubuntu a year ago, I have been thrilled by the stability of the Gnome Desktop, and the reliability of apt-get. There is no comparison.
I'm really stoked about what has happened with KDE4, but I'm also depressed, it's just more of the same, it's a UI that is virtually promising that it will be horribly unstable, on account of it's bleeding edge. I wish KDE would just get out of the marketplace altogether, and stop scaring people away from Linux, which is, from my experience, exactly what they have been doing for years now.
You may not agree with what I say, but you should fight to the death to allow me to say it, by modding me up.