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Canadian ISP Ordered to Prove Traffic-Shaping is Needed

Sepiraph writes "In a letter sent to the Canadian Association of Internet Providers and Bell Canada on May 15, the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission (CRTC) have ordered Bell Canada to provide tangible evidence that its broadband networks are congested to justify the company's Internet traffic-shaping policies. This is a response after Bell planned to tackle the issue of traffic shaping, also called throttling, on the company's broadband networks. It would be interesting to see Bell's response, as well as to see some real-world actual numbers and compare them to a previous study."

8 of 177 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Hurray! by compro01 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Bell doesn't have a monopoly on internet access in Canada. Correct, but they own the infrastructure and have been throttling the competition, which is effectively circumventing CRTC regulations requiring them to lease lines to competitors.
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  2. Re:Hurray! by Secret+Rabbit · · Score: 3, Informative

    This isn't the US nor is it the EU, it's Canada. And the CRTC is here to protect consumers, etc. And guess what. They actually do there job some of the time. Welcome to a country where corruption isn't total in government orgs (at least yet).

  3. Re:Wrong evidence to ask by sedmonds · · Score: 4, Informative

    I recall seeing Bell advertisements that DSL from Bell was better than cable, because there are "no slowdowns". I also recall advertisements, but I can't remember if they were specifically Bell advertisements, that your bandwidth was dedicated. I didn't really believe it then, and now it seems that neither does Bell.

  4. Re:Hurray! by Phisbut · · Score: 5, Informative

    What? I hate ISP traffic shaping as much as anybody, but if you agreed to the contract, you agreed that you didn't care if they shaped your bandwidth. If you didn't like the product they were selling, why did you buy it? Nobody likes traffic shaping, and if people would stop being idiots and start refusing to agree to these contracts, one of the big ISPs would start offering non-shaped bandwidth.

    Ok, I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that you have no idea what you are talking about, and no idea what this whole matter is about. Here's what happened:

    People who didn't want Bell's throttling read Bell's contract and decided they didn't want it. Instead, they went and got their internet service from a competitor. Unfortunately, since Bell owns the wires, every competitor in the DSL business has to rent bandwidth wholesale from Bell. At first, Bell didn't throttle the wholesale bandwidth, and the competitors could then offer contracts that had no throttling to their customers. Then, without notice, Bell throttles the wholesalers. So even though people read the contracts and refused to agree with throttling, they still get fucked by Bell even though they get their service from a competitor. Reference here.

    This "I don't like this, but I'll just buy it now and sue later" bullshit is out of control Don't people take any responsibility for their actions any more?

    Repeat after me: People read their contracts, refused the throttling, went with a provider that didn't throttle, and got fucked anyway. Please... stop talking out of your ass now.

    --
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  5. Re:Hurray! by yabos · · Score: 2, Informative

    The throttling occurs to 3rd party ISPs who lease access to the Bell owned last mile. This is governed by the CRTC and Bell has to provide it. They implemented this throttling for traffic going to someone Else's network. That's the main problem is that they are interfering with traffic that is not theirs. It just has to travel over their ATM network but the contract is between the customer and the 3rd party.

    Bell is paid by the 3rd party ISPs to carry this traffic and the amount they get for this is usually around 80% of what the 3rd party ISPs charge for monthly internet access. They say they are doing this because the network is saturated and all these 3rd party ISP customers are causing congestion. From their own numbers this isn't true and their networks is only at around 50% capacity. It's not clear if Bell is legally allowed to throttle or interfere with traffic going to 3rd party ISPs and especially that they did it without telling any of the other ISPs. What has happened with many other ISPs is that they have already bought dedicated bandwidth expecting the amount of traffic before the throttling. Bell implements the throttling and now they have a huge unused portion of bandwidth that they can't use. Also they are paying bell for many Gbps connections that they can't use due to this and Bell won't give them their money back. Instant profit for Bell.

  6. Re:Hurray! by gmack · · Score: 2, Informative

    Because Bell is doing the traffic shaping where they have no business dong it: Between the end users and the isp.

    Bell rents the lines out by tunneling the pppoe connection right to the reseller isp so the isp can traffic shape if they want to. Bell has right to force business decisions on third party isps since they pay for all of the resources they use.

  7. Re:Hurray! by MarkRose · · Score: 3, Informative

    But in Canada, companies cannot make contribution to political parties.

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  8. Re:Hurray! by ArtDent · · Score: 2, Informative

    So Bell does all the heavy lifting and the little guys come in and ride their coat tails. Seems fair enough to me. It's not like it's a free ride. The ISPs are paying Bell a regulated rate for the use of their infrastructure. If their users use more bandwidth, the ISP pays for it. If the price being paid to Bell is not fair, then Bell just needs to demonstrate that to the CRTC.

    In an ideal world, there would be free competition, but that's not the situation we find ourselves in. Why? Because Bell has a huge advantage as a result of the network that it built, over the last century or so, while operating a government-granted long-distance monopoly, and with much direct government assistance.

    I mean, they've been charging the same ludicrously low rate for years all the while increasing the available bandwidth and a small percentage of people abuse it and take more than their fair share. Why is this a problem? If you take too much - you have to pay extra, otherwise expect to be throttled back. If ISPs customers use more bandwidth, the ISPs pay for it. It's up to them, not Bell, to decide how to pass that cost along to their customers.

    Where do you get this ridiculous notion that no one is paying for this bandwidth?