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Successful Cold Fusion Experiment?

An anonymous reader writes "The italian economic journal 'Il sole 24 ore' published an article about a successful cold fusion experiment performed by Yoshiaki Arata in Japan. They seems to have pumped high pressure deutherium gas in a nanometric matrix of palladium and zyrcon oxide. The experiments generates a considerable amount of energy and they found the presence of Helium-4 in the matrix (as sign of the fusion). I was not able to find other articles about this but the journal is very authoritative in Italy. Google translations are also available."

17 of 387 comments (clear)

  1. Two more reports... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    I found this article on the demonstration:

    http://physicsworld.com/blog/2008/05/coldfusion_demonstration_a_suc_1.html

    A little more here:

    http://newenergytimes.com/news/2008/29img/Arata-Demo.htm

    Not a first hand account, but still.

    Wouldn't that be nice? After years of delays for a new experimental fusion reactor (ITER) because they could not agree on where it should be built, a Japanese professor finds a way to get cold fusion to get work and the reactor is obsolete before built! Science can move ahead in strange and unpredictable ways as well...

  2. Re:Elium-4? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    italian words for Hydrogen and Helium are Idrogeno and Elio. These translitteration comes from latin, where they didn't have an H phonema. The symbols H and He start with H because the name of the atoms are derived from greek where they did have H starting words.

    It might come to a surprise to you, but not all words come from english; eventually it's the other way round.

  3. Re:Neutrons anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    It's cold fusion, from H (1P+1N) to He4 (2P+2N).
    Thus no Neutrons. Much safer.

  4. How about neutrons? by coobird · · Score: 5, Informative

    The article seemed to be sparse on the details of what was actually going on, but if indeed the only evidence that they had a fusion reaction happening is the presence of helium-4, then they may have just detected naturally occurring helium that is present in the atmosphere (0.000524%).

    A better test to see whether fusion reactions are taking place is to try to detect the a stream of neutrons which are being produced. The neutrons flux and the energy should be able to be used to differentiate the fusion neutrons from the background neutron sources, such as those caused by spontaneous fission events of heavy elements like uranium. Also, nuclear fusion reactions tend to produce high-energy, or fast neutrons (upwards of 14 MeV with deuterium-deuterium fusion) which isn't too common unless you have some type of nuclear reaction taking place. (Here's a list of important nuclear fusion reactions important fusion reactions for those who are curious.)

    Detecting helium on the other hand, seems not so out of the ordinary since there is helium in the atmosphere.

    1. Re:How about neutrons? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      The simple answer is that 2H + 2H --> 4He doesn't happen.



      As shown in the link I posted to Wikipedia in my original post, you'll see that 2H + 2H --> 4He does not happen with any significance. In other words, that reaction doesn't happen enough to make it a significant source of the reaction. Nuclear physics doesn't exactly work like arithmetic.



      The primary d-d reactions are listed as follows in the important reactions section of the nuclear fusion article at Wikipedia:


      1. 2H + 2H --> 3H + p
      2. 2H + 2H --> 3He + n

  5. More info by darkat · · Score: 4, Informative
  6. Re:Elium-4? by maxwell+demon · · Score: 5, Informative

    Well, actually the Greek doesn't have an H letter (AFAIK there was an H sound, but it didn't have its own character, but an appropriately accented vowel indicated that is was to be spoken with an H before it; I think those accents don't exist any more in modern Greek). OTOH, Latin definitively does have an H letter, although the Romans probably didn't speak it.

    --
    The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
  7. Re:Why not? by Free+the+Cowards · · Score: 4, Informative

    That's a very good point. This is not like a perpetual motion machine, which is completely forbidden by the laws of physics as we know it. Cold fusion is only notorious because the people who originally publicized it were total publicity hounds and sacrificed science to get in the news, resulting in it all blowing up in their faces when it turned out that they didn't have anything. Aside from it being a notorious hoax or mistake, there's nothing that makes cold fusion inherently ridiculous or bad.

    --
    If you mod me Overrated, you are admitting that you have no penis.
  8. There is more than only this experiment by JochenBedersdorfer · · Score: 5, Informative
    If you would follow this field more closely you would find that there is a small but steadily growing number of scientists from around the world working in this field.

    Since cold fusion has such a bad reputation, they are calling it Low -Energy Nuclear Reactions. It's not only a better name, but it describes more accurately what those scientists are seeing: Transmutations and excess energy in low energy conditions.

    The offical LENR webcine New Energy Times has all the info:

    http://www.newenergytimes.com/

  9. the ACTUAL peer reviewed article by glorpy · · Score: 4, Informative

    Is at http://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jhts/33/3/33_142/_article. You will need to be able to read Japanese, but at least it's the actual research.

  10. Re:A world changing experiment... by mbone · · Score: 4, Informative

    Well, when you have these kinds of blatant typos it means the poster might not have any idea what he was talking about. In that case, it cast doubts on whether it's really a "world changing experiment"... Exactly. Let's see, a report full of errors about a Italian economics journal reporting on a Japanese experiment. Doesn't give me confidence.

    Reading the second article does not give me confidence. It is the same old "we did this and that and got out some heat and some Helium." This also does not give confidence.

    The article talks about Deuterium (Hydrogen-2) and Helium-4. Deuterium - Deuterium fusion should give rise to Tritium (Hydrogen-3 - which is radioactive) or Helium-3 plus a neutron (which is a form of radioactivity). Now, either of these products (Tritium or Helium-3) can themselves fuse (with each other or with Deuterium) to produce Helium-4, but these should also produce neutrons. Deuterium - Deuterium fusion to directly to Helium-4 is much harder to do (it has a very small cross-section), and its energy should come out as gamma rays.

    So, they claimed no radioactivity (when there should have been neutrons or gamma rays produced) with an unlikely nuclear reaction (H2 + H2 -> He4) and it produced a moderate amount of heat (1 kilo Joule) without actually stating how much energy it took to run the apparatus.

    It may be real, but the indications in this Italian economics journal are not encouraging.
  11. Re:Neutrons anyone? by ZombieWomble · · Score: 4, Informative
    The 2 Deuterium to 1 Helium-4 reaction is only one of the results which would happen in that situation - the production of Tritium (Possibly leading to Tritium+Deuterium reactions producing He4 and a neutron) or Helium-3 and a spare neutron is also possible, and indeed are significantly more energetically favourable under normal circumstances, and would lead to a neutron flux.

    On the other hand, if it is a purely 2D->He4 reaction, there should be a significant gamma flux with a characteristic (IIRC) energy as the product nucleus relaxed, which should be fairly easy to verify, at least in a ballpark measurement.

  12. FRAUD ALERT -- Slashdot sucked in again! by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 4, Informative

    FRAUD? It has been known for more than 40 years, maybe much more, that putting Hydrogen or Deuterium into Platinum or Palladium causes some interesting effects. The metals absorb a huge amount of Hydrogen.

    Apparently the only purpose for this that has ever been found, however, is confusing Slashdot editors.

    There are a large number of people claiming to be "working" on cold fusion. No one has ever been able to demonstrate anything interesting.

    However, there are also a lot of schemes to steal investor money. In my opinion, this is probably fraud, as others have been.

  13. Unofficial translation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Here is an unofficial translation by an
    Italian reader .. I apologize for my English :)
    Moreover, the article is very focused on
    telling the amazing story and embellishing
    it with Japanese stereotype. The "Sole 24 ore"
    is a well reputed economical journal, but
    it is nothing about technical.
    Indeed, they miss any reference to the original
    news.

    The revenge of the Samurai.

    Yoshiaki Arata, 85 years old is a Japanese Professor Emeritus,
    a leading pioneer of the advanced nuclear program in Japan and one of the fathers of research about hot fusion.
    He is a strong NATIONALIST (he speaks only Japanese in public),
    awarded by the Emperor and has now won his 20 years long battle as a Samurai.
    He never gave up about the topic [cold fusion] since 1989, when Fleishmann and Pons announced a possible "constrained" fusion of deuterium inside a palladium cathode.
    [They use] lightweight molecules, made traveling by a moderate anode-to-cathode electron flux in the fluid towards
    palladium exhagonal structures.
    There, they collide, pushing over themselves and trapping them causing the spontaneous pressure to reach million of atmospheres,
    and then breaking nucleus, producing heat and finally converting into Helium-4.
    A genuine nuclear fusion, obtained without the need of the big, high energy toroids as Iter, just like it happens
    in stars.
    Instead, they needed just a bottle with a little "heavy water" (easy to find in nature), a rare metal and the
    same electric power you need at home.
    Without radiations and with the final production of a inert gas, helium, useful to fill balloons.
    Too beautiful to be true. Fleishmann and Pons shocked the whole community but they never managed to reproduce an experiment that would have changed
    the life of humanity , if not in a few, sporadic cases.
    They were defined cheaters, pretenders, not scientific, together with their entourage, up to being marginalized by the scientific community.

    But samurai Arata went straight along the line. Also because
    since the fifties he was amazed by the deuterium supercompression technique,
    due to anomalies that happened using certain metals. So he decided
    to take another line of research while working on low-energy fusion, the
    one of electro-chemic. By simply pushing the deuterium inside palladium
    nanoparticles with more and more atmospheres, up to creating the
    same "crowded" situation and pressure increase of that experiment.
    Today [5/22/2008] he made a public demonstration of his reactor in
    Osaka, moving a Stirling engine with a few grams of palladium.
    The reactor has been partially realized using ideas of Francesco
    Celani and his group at the National Institute for Nuclear Physics
    (INFN) in Frascati: the second-ranked laboratory actively working on Arata's line.
    In the next few days Arata will try to increase the amount from 7 to 60
    grams of palladium, expecting hundreds of Watts in thermal power, that is,
    enough for your house lights for months.

    But the very outstanding news, given in front of a multitude of scientific
    reporters, someone coming even from the USA, is to have proved the production,
    inside palladium hexagons, of a non-neglegible quantity of Helium-4,
    the sign of deuterium transmutation and nuclear fusion.
    This resulted in the reporters' crowd started talking about the "Arata
    Phenomenon", a term he kindly accepted taking a bow, just like an old Samurai.

  14. Cold Illusion: Old story from February 2008 by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 4, Informative

    This is a much better report of the same story: Arata-Zhang LENR Demonstration.

    It's an old story, from February 2008. Quote: ' "The demonstrated live data looked just like data they reported in their published papers (J. High Temp. Soc. Jpn, Feb. and March issues, 2008)..." '

    Quote: ' "Some people say we have reached the end of science, that there are no more great discoveries that remain. In my view, nature always has more secrets to reveal," Arata wrote.' My translation: "Please believe in this particular fantasy."

    Apparently Slashdot editors don't do any research.

  15. FRAUD ALERT -- Slashdot sucked in again! -- UPDATE by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 4, Informative

    Apparently the blog story was stolen from New Energy Times: Arata-Zhang LENR Demonstration, May 22, 2008

    Yoshiaki Arata works for the Welding Research Institute of Osaka University. He is not a physicist, apparently.

    Old story: He's been reporting this kind of thing since before October 13, 2006: A New Energy caused by "Spillover-Deuterium". Quote: "Intermittent operation over a period of two years using this structure proved the complete reproducibility of these results."

    I hope no Slashdot reader invests in this. Would it be too much to ask Slashdot editor Scuttle Monkey to do a little research before he posts stories?

    This is not the first complaint about Scuttle Monkey: Who is Scuttle Monkey?

  16. Re:Why not? by mcelrath · · Score: 5, Informative

    Cold fusion isn't ruled out by any known laws of physics

    No, cold fusion is ruled out by basic Quantum Mechanics.

    The electrons are irrelevant since their density is so low, and nuclei must be within 10^-15 m to fuse. This only occurs at temperatures of hundreds of millions Celsius. If these experiments were generating temperatures this high, one could easily tell because they would also emit X- and gamma-rays.

    Explanation of "cold fusion" phenomena (if these experiments are real and reproducible) would require a significant modification of Quantum Mechanics. This is exactly why physicists are so quick to dismiss the experiments. Few papers have been published "ruling it out" because it's so simple. However here is one: http://link.aps.org/abstract/PRL/v63/p191. The theoretical literature claiming to come up with exotic ways to allow the phenomena to happen are quite extreme, in my opinion.

    --
    1^2=1; (-1)^2=1; 1^2=(-1)^2; 1=-1; 1=0.