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UK Academics Arrested For Researching al-Qaida

Posted by kdawson on from the terrism-is-the-root-password-to-the-academy dept.

D Afifi writes "Two political researchers at the University of Nottingham, in the UK, have been arrested under the Terrorism Act for downloading Al-Qaida material from a US government website. The material was to be used for research in terrorist tactics. There has been a huge public outcry, with university staff planning a march to demonstrate against the attack on academic freedom. Yet, one of the students, an Algerian, is still held in custody under immigration charges and is being fast-tracked for deportation."

59 of 681 comments (clear)

  1. No surprise... by amrik98 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The UK is the country furthest along the road to 1984.

    1. Re:No surprise... by Laukei · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Every day I read comments online about the UK going to hell via 1984... and every day I find new evidence to back up these claims.

      It's an awful state of affairs when academics are being prosecuted under terror legislation.

      I've lost all faith in the the UK and US governments since 9/11.

      ~Rob

    2. Re:No surprise... by Dunbal · · Score: 4, Funny

      Surely you mean Airstrip One.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    3. Re:No surprise... by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 5, Insightful
      From TFA:

      "...Yezza, who is Algerian, was immediately rearrested on unrelated immigration charges and now faces deportation..."
      Just wanted to clarify why he's being deported. The brits' reaction to the downloading of the document was a bit extreme, but if ya want to live in a country then ya gotta play by their(sometimes idiotic) rules.
    4. Re:No surprise... by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If you want to be idiotic and live in a country whose citizens are idiotic and keep voting idiots into their congress, then ya gotta play by their rules. As for those of us who were born in the US(or UK), there are other places to move. I'm thinking Canada or the Netherlands if the US dosen't get its shit together in the next few years.

    5. Re:No surprise... by FudRucker · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Now you know why public schools in the USA fill the children's heads with all that patriotic bulloni about how benevolent the government is and make the founding fathers look like saints, so the kids don't realize what dirty rotten scoundrels the government is until they are 40 years old.

      --
      Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
    6. Re:No surprise... by Jim+in+Buffalo · · Score: 4, Funny

      Oh, absolutely. I just realized last year on my 40th birthday what dirty rotten scoundrels the governments are. Totally ruined my party.

      --
      This sig, aah-ah, is comin' like a ghost-sig...
    7. Re:No surprise... by palegray.net · · Score: 5, Informative
      Kansas or not, I'm pretty certain you didn't bother to read the article. From the material presented, this is a pretty obvious case of abuse of power. I'm posting from the States, but I'm certainly not ill-informed on these matters.

      From the second paragraph of TFA:

      Despite his Nottingham University supervisors insisting the materials were directly relevant to his research, Rizwaan Sabir, 22, was held for nearly a week under the Terrorism Act, accused of downloading the materials for illegal use. The student had obtained a copy of the al-Qaida training manual from a US government website for his research into terrorist tactics. Please read the source material and comment afterward. If your opinion differs, please provide relevant citations supporting your position.
      --
      512 MB RAM, 20 GB disk, 200 GB transfer, five datacenters. $19.95/month.
    8. Re:No surprise... by Hal_Porter · · Score: 5, Informative

      "Cultural enemies"? What kind of BS is that?

      Maybe in the central US we get a different class of immigrants than those Britain deals with -- but the folks I meet here are smart, hard-working, well-educated, practical people more interested in good lives for themselves and their families than ideology from back home. That's because US immigration policy is more rational. You can get into the US if you have a job offer. UK immigration is a mess. It's very hard to get in legally if you have a job offer. If you enter illegally you're unlikely to get caught. If do get caught you can 'claim asylum'. But asylum seekers can't legally work. So you end up with lots of illegals and lots of unemployed asylum seekers living on benefits. Sweden is even worse - asylum seekers can easily spend their whole lives on benefits and benefits are much more generous.

      So the net result is that in the UK and Sweden you have lots of people who are essentially disconnected from society. In that sort of environment it's not surprising that some of them fall for the lie that Britain would be better under Shariah law.

      Some UK muslims were actually captured in Afghanistan fighting for the Taliban and they told the British soldiers who caught them that they would go back to the UK and claim benefits.

      But people that are willing to use violence to replace liberal democracy with a far harsher system are 'cultural enemies'. Back in World War II British citizens who even made propaganda broadcasts for the Nazis were executed for treason. Certainly I think people who are willing to use or even threaten to use force to overthrow democracy are traitors.

      But I'd change the immigration system too to try to attract more pro Western immigrants.
      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    9. Re:No surprise... by Tuoqui · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Wont care anymore?

      Hell I dont care anymore now... The only real thing you can do to stop the terrorists is to stop being afraid. 9/11 happened *1* time and in *1* place... The odds of you dying in a terrorist attack are infinitesimally small... You'd have a better shot at winning the lottery.

      The only thing you can do is be smart and sensible about security.

      --
      09F911029D74E35BD84156C5635688C0
      +2 Troll is Slashdot's way of saying groupthink is confused
    10. Re:No surprise... by fugue · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Ok, what if I don't want to live in a country? What choice do I have? Who has the right to tell me I must live in some country, or choose where they're going to send me when I don't live in it? I pretty much have to live in Antarctica.

      That is simply not reasonable. When countries form a cover of all the reasonably habitable land, then people who seek personal freedom have nowhere to go. There is no more freedom. This has led to my own working definition of overpopulation.

      --
      "The biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place."
    11. Re:No surprise... by twostix · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This is *exactly* what happened last year here in Australia.

      Mohammed Haneef, an Indian doctor in Queensland was arrested by the federal government over the most idiotically flimsy link to the airport attacks in the UK one could imagine.

      Well, it quickly became was pretty clear they had nothing on him. In fact the government had so little on him that they purposefully and carefully fabricated, spun and lied to the press about what they did have on him. It all began to unravel and the truth came out thanks to his lawyer and a healthy grain of salt taken with the obvious rubbish the government was dishing out, so what do they do? Try cancel his visa on "Character Grounds" so that they can deport him before it gets to the courts and people find out how ruthless, and quite frankly evil that that particular government was being. Fortunately the courts saw through their bullshit and gave him back his Visa.

      The government eventually dropped all charges, being that it had all been shown to be an obvious and complete farce.

      The immigration line is bullshit, ALL immigrants in western countries can be deported for any reason what-so-ever if the respective Depts of Immi get told to get rid of them.

      Mark my words this bloke's being deported because it's going to be an embarrassment to the government. It's the easiest way for them to get rid of him.

      The worst thing is so many fools buy it hook, line and sinker. just like they did here with Haneef, there was plenty of people left looking like idiots when it came out what the government really was up to. Four months later that government (that had been in power for 12 years) was swept out of power in the biggest loss of power by a government in this countries history. It was that sort of dishonest, ruthless behaviour that caused it.

      Hopefully the UK will be next.

    12. Re:No surprise... by linhares · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's because US immigration policy is more rational. You can get into the US if you have a job offer. I love your deep sense of sarcasm! US immigration is pathetic at best; people getting visas through a lottery for god's sake. And employers are not even bothering to get the best people anymore, because on April fool's day, when applications for work visas start; the full year's quota is filled. As Lexington puts it: Congress is doing its best to lose the global talent war.
    13. Re:No surprise... by Bogtha · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's an awful state of affairs when academics are being prosecuted under terror legislation.

      Please RTFA. They were arrested under terror legislation, then the charges were dropped. They aren't being prosecuted under terror legislation.

      However, it looks like during the investigation, the police discovered that one of them was an illegal immigrant. He is being deported for this.

      Now he may or may not be here illegally, and he should definitely get the chance to defend himself before being deported, but please get your facts straight. Nobody is being prosecuted under terror legislation.

      --
      Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
    14. Re:No surprise... by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No they weren't, people survived in the towers.

      Since when did invading countries and wasting money = making you any safer?

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
    15. Re:No surprise... by digitrev · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If the alternative is to live in a society where personal freedoms are trampled, the power of the ruling class runs unchecked, and fear is cultivated to keep the masses down, then yeah, I'd rather sit back and wait. Fortunately, it's not binary, but a continuum. Let's move a bit more toward the more reasonable response of gathering intelligence and preparing a world class emergency response team, as well as diplomacy and tact.

      But since you're just beating the straw out of that poor man, I suppose you don't really care what I have to say.

      --
      Cynical Idealist
    16. Re:No surprise... by Hal_Porter · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Actually Sweden might grant you asylum without you asking for it

      http://www.thelocal.se/7726/20070627/

      The episode started when she applied for an emergency loan via the US Embassy. When informed that it might take some time for a loan to be arranged, she says she was referred to Swedish social services. There, she was informed she was not entitled to Swedish state assistance.

      Dharmarajah says she was collected from the social services office by police officers.

      "The police took me to the police station, allowed me to call some of my friends in the US, and then took me to a refugee camp in Märsta," she tells The Local.

      The police officers then took Dharmarajah's passport.

      "They explained to me that I was an asylum case, and that asylum cases can't keep their passports."

      "It's crazy," she says. "I never wanted asylum in this country. I don't want to live here; I don't want to work here." Or look at this. An American Marxist granted asylum in Sweden who predictably now hates the place

      http://lists.econ.utah.edu/pipermail/marxism-thaxis/1999-February/014125.html

      Today in Sweden we are talking about 15% of the population that do
      not have a job. Over 500,000 people are directly unemployed or are
      in some sort of job education program. However that figure does not
      give a true picture of reality. In fact in many of the larger cities
      80% (!) of the non-Swede population do not have jobs. In fact
      non-Swedes, procentually, are the overwhelming majority of unemployed,
      those on welfare, or in job training.

      When I came here in 1972 Sweden was at the peak of its development.
      I received a humanitarian asylum in Sweden because of my opposition
      to the war in Vietnam. On the upside this guy seems more likely to whine on the Marxism listserv lists than mug anyone but what about these guys

      http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4620167c-c3c9-11dc-b083-0000779fd2ac.html

      In Herrgarden, kids from diverse backgrounds do mix. But at schools composed almost wholly of migrants, they find it hard to feel an attachment with wider society. "My passport says I'm Svensk, but in the apartment, no," says Lulli's Turkish pal Nihad. "In Herrgarden, if someone has a problem, we help him. The Swedes, they are very cold. They shake hands. We kiss. Not like gays, like brothers." Anyone that says this is clearly an arsehole.

      Fuelled by resentment against native Swedes, some go into town on a Friday or Saturday night to indulge in a little light mugging of what they call "the Svens". The police think only about 150 youths are involved. At least these youngsters speak Swedish. I'd advise you to fly there and make up some story about the CIA/DHS/FBI torturing you because you oppose the Iraq war and criticised Bush. You'll get an apartment in Herrgarden, benefits and free Swedish classes in no time. Complain that you're being discriminated against in Herrgarden because you are the only white/non Muslim there and they'll move you somewhere better, surrounded by civilised but painfully naive blond people.

      In your extensive free time, head out to bars and tell the women you're a refugee from the US. Read up on how the Swedish media portrays the US and just feed the same stories back to them. They all speak perfect English. You'll get a Swedish girlfriend too! Of course, you're leaching off fundamentally decent and generous people, but don't let that put you off.
      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    17. Re:No surprise... by zetarcos · · Score: 4, Interesting

      "Since when did invading countries and wasting money = making you any safer?" For me it was 6 June 1944.

    18. Re:No surprise... by damburger · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Oh please, the idea that the UK is a hairs breadth from going Sharia is utter bullshit put out by the right-wing media to scare people.

      The actual threat in this country comes from the far right whose rhetoric you are mouthing. The BNP, with financial support from certain people in America, managed to basically double their share of the vote each time over the past few elections. The Daily Wail and other such trash papers have got about 60% percentage of the British public believing in key BNP policy points.

      Our main threat is not from angry young Muslims who wouldn't know an explosive device from a gas canister. The threat is from white youths who attack racial minorities converting that undirected anger into support of a fascist regime.

      --
      If we can put a man on the moon, why can't we shoot people for Apollo-related non-sequiturs?
    19. Re:No surprise... by Omestes · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I live in Phoenix, which is a major illegal immigration hub.

      I'm pretty neutral on the issue (which is REALLY rare here), though.

      Yeah, but I suspect most Mexicans who enter the US illegally will assimilate quite fast.

      There are parts of my town that look exactly like Mexico, whole stretches with nary a sign in English, with mariachi and polka music blaring, and not a single business does business in English. This doesn't seem like assimilation to me. In the colleges here we have a sanctioned club (MeCHA) based on retaking the original Mexican territories back, based on the claim of "La Raza" ("The Race"). 1 in 10 cars here have Aztec imagery on them. None of these point towards a desire to assimilation.

      Unlike previous waves of American immigrants, they don't want to be American, they just want a living wage, while keeping their culture. Its more Balkanization than assimilation. During the last Mexican elections, illegal immigrants in the U.S. were allowed to vote in their homelands elections, and voted for a candidate whose platform was based on building a highway that dead-ended at the American border.

      A minority of them are willing to learn English to the point of actually doing so.

      Even if we offered the path to citizenship, they still wouldn't want to be culturally American. Sure, they would finally have to pay for services such as education and healthcare (and other tax-based services), but they still would want to be Mexican first, and American in income.

      The problem with border security has nothing to do with Mexicans though. Its more along the lines of; "if a poor latino can walk across the border with his family undetected, what keeps a a clever terrorist from doing so with 100 pounds of explosives?"

      To avoid the flamebate mod, I have nothing much against illegal immigrants, as long as they are forced to pay taxes, and live by the greater societies standards. I feel damn sorry for them, actually, since I know I'd rather not be in Mexico. My border policy would be turning them back, and handing them a book on Che Guevara (and the history of the American revolution), and a M16 with a box of ammo.

      --
      A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
    20. Re:No surprise... by osu-neko · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Sounds exactly like assimilation to me. After all, you're saying they're behaving exactly the same as the Italians, the Polish, the Irish, and every other previous group of immigrants who came to America behaved when they arrived. They all wanted to keep their culture, too. And they all did, in fact. "Assimilation" into to America has never meant not keeping your culture, it's always been making your culture a part of America. It's also always been the case that the first generation never really fully plugs into things like language -- wasn't too long ago where you had to speak to your friend Tony's dad through him unless you knew Italian. And so on. I don't doubt all the things you said are true, the only false statement is the part where you say "Unlike previous waves of American immigrants" rather than "Exactly like all the previous waves of American immigrants".

      As for your border policy, I think that kinda sucks. Border policy should be pretty simple: is this guy a known criminal? If so, deny entry or arrest and extradite him. If not, let him go to whichever side of the fence he wants, because the government has no right to restrict the liberty of any person barring criminal behavior. What bizarre value system gives government to right to dictate the movements of supposedly free people? Doesn't make any sense to me.

      --
      "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
    21. Re:No surprise... by zmooc · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Do not go to the Netherlands! We have the highest number of wiretaps per capita of all countries worldwide, cartoonists get arrested over their cartoons, last year thousands of innocent people - including minors - were arrested for not carrying ID, possession of potato-knives (is that an english word?) and chocolate cigarettes are prohibited, using open wifi connections is prohibited, multiple journalists were taken hostage by the government recently in an attempt to get them to disclose their sources, we have a huge history of putting innocent people in jail and have about the lowest percentage of solved crimes in the EU, some neighboorhoods even have a curfew, privacy is now something purely conceptual and political parties structurally break their election-promises. Oh and our army has transformed from doing our defense to being mercenaries for GW Bush' personal oil-goals.

      The Netherlands used to be pretty much on the top of the freedom-list, but we've left that list long ago... I don't have that many facts about Canada at hand, but I believe it's not much better over there. And about the UK - I take a trip there (ok, ok, Scotland it is:-)) every now and then; I sense a lot more freedom over there, a lot less tensions between ethnical groups, police that don't act like they're Cartman "respect my authority" and so on.

      So, in short, the UK may appear to be idiotic, but in essence they're a lot less idiotic than for example the Dutch are.

      Greetings from the Netherlands.

      --
      0x or or snor perron?!
    22. Re:No surprise... by XchristX · · Score: 4, Interesting

      There are parts of my town that look exactly like Mexico, whole stretches with nary a sign in English, with mariachi and polka music blaring, and not a single business does business in English. In the latter half of the 19th century, the Irish started fleeing the potato famine and settling in New York. Parts of the city became like Dublin ghettoes .Whole stretches with "nary a sign" (AN IRISH PHRASE, oh the irony!) in English, with lewd drunkards step-dancing to raucous violins (and "confessing" their sins away in Church the next day). How is that any different from this? We're looking at a common thing among first-generation immigrants, eventually, they all assimilate, as have the Irish,

      In the colleges here we have a sanctioned club (MeCHA) based on retaking the original Mexican territories back, based on the claim of "La Raza" ("The Race"). 1 in 10 cars here have Aztec imagery on them. None of these point towards a desire to assimilation. Anyone who believes that a few chicano ethno-extremists (like the ones you mention above) point to some systematic resistance to assimilation has had a paleoconservative blowjob affecting their brain functions. Too many stupid leftists are buying into the racist fascist crap of Pat Buchanan and his Paleoconservative Neo-Nazi propaganda.

      Unlike previous waves of American immigrants, they don't want to be American, they just want a living wage, while keeping their culture. Its more Balkanization than assimilation. This is complete nonsense. The culture of Hispanic immigrants is already a unique thing, incorporating BOTH Hispanic and conventional American norms to a syncretic mix that is radically different from Mexico. It's not Balkanization at all. I've BEEN to the Balkans, and people are blowing each other up there. No Hispanics are blowing anything or anyone up here, nor will they.

      A minority of them are willing to learn English to the point of actually doing so. In the past, there were neighborhoods in Brooklyn, New York, that were Yiddish only, German only, Hebrew only, Italian only, Russian only. When Maronite Christians from Lebanon started fleeing the Islamofascists and settling in the US, many of them were Arabic speakers only at first (most spoke French too, though). Eventually, all of those linguistic enclaves syncretized with the broader American culture, each contributing to the other. The same thing will happen here. The same thing is ALREADY happening here. How many Spanishisms do we use in American English already, mi amigo? American English is peppered with Irish, German, and Yiddish words already. Adding a few Spanishisms won't kill us unless you believe in some fascist ideas of "linguistic purity", in which case I suggest a trip to the library to study the history of the English language (Or even the Spanish language for that matter, which was liberally "Arabized" during the Andalusian period in Spain).

      would be turning them back, and handing them a book on Che Guevara (and the history of the American revolution), and a M16 with a box of ammo. Are you crazy, or a leftist (same thing)? A large bulk of Hispanics came to the US to FLEE that sort of horror, and you want to send them back into it? This is not the 18th century you know!

      There is no culture war with Hispanics in the US except in the collective imagination of the far-left/old-right alliance. Most of the issues (crime, poverty, welfare etc) are class-conflict issues that have nothing to do with culture. This is in sharp contrast to Moslem immigrants in Europe, where a clear Kulturkampf exists. last time I checked, Mexican immigrants don't engage in forced female circumcisions. honor killings, imam-sanctioned gang-rapes, mass-riots and supremacist terrorism. There was a 1 million strong Hispanic pro-immigration rally in the US just a few years ago, and not one drop of blood was spilled. Compare that with throngs of fanatic Moslems burning down France in the wake of the Mohamed cartoons...
      --
      l'Homme n'est Rien l'Oeuvre Tout: Gustave Flaubert to George Sand
    23. Re:No surprise... by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 4, Informative

      Here it is in 3 common english translations :

      http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/008.qmt.html#008.055

      Here are the (primary) rules specified for interpreting said statement. They are quite clear :

      http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/003.qmt.html#003.007

      Needless to say the 8:55 statement is not allegorical (check for yourself and compare, for example, with the later chapters). So the verse is "of fundamental meaning" "clear" and "decisive". In any interpretation it is forbidden to go seek "hidden meanings", nor is any indirection allowed.

      Here is one of the official "guides" for interpreting said statement. It, again, does not lack in clarity :

      http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=8&tid=20426

      "Allah states here that the worst moving creatures on the face of the earth are those who disbelieve, who do not embrace the faith, and break promises whenever they make a covenant, even when they vow to keep them," ...

      (this is later further elaborated to mean that peace treaties between muslims and non-muslims have exactly 1 purpose : deception of the non-muslims, allowing the muslims to become militarily stronger, with the further stipulation that regardless of any treaty, every 10 years there must be at least 1 attack, no matter what it may cost the muslims. There can never be peace. Only temporary (max 10 years) cessation of hostilities)

      ("islam" means "opression" in the military sense, meaning it is enforced, not voluntary, so that it has stuff like this is hardly surprising, generally "submission" is taken as a translation, but it does not refer to the speaker (that would be istaslam if it is militarily enforced, or astaslam if it is done freely), but to a third party, nor does it mean peace (which is salaam). It means actively making others submit (by the practice of "hisbah" for example), not submitting yourself, like in Christianity)

    24. Re:No surprise... by mrchaotica · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Who wouldn't be when much of the population consists of vitriolic nativists who call you a "cultural enemy" and consider you dangerous simply because of where you're from...

      But immigrants are demonstratively dangerous to British culture, by the fact that they're resisting assimilation. That's the point: the immigrants have no right to be angry because they should have realized they'd be expected to assimilate, rather than import their old culture. If they wanted to remain in a traditional Muslim community, they should have stayed home!

      And that goes for all immigrants, everywhere: Muslims in Britain should become [culturally] British, Mexicans in the U.S. should become American (or more precisely "USian," but that's not really a word), Americans in China should become Chinese (disregarding the fact that relatively few Americans immigrate), etc. Expecting the incumbent culture to accommodate you, as a newcomer, is disgustingly arrogant!

      --

      "[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz

    25. Re:No surprise... by Beetle+B. · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Moral of the story, interest in researching a subject does not conclusively indicate that a student is uninvolved in the subject being researched. Nor does it imply the other way.

      Here in the US, some years ago, a Middle Eastern student was arrested and charged with supporting terrorism primarily because he had a lot of material (none of which was illegal) that worried some folks. During the trial, a number of experts testified for the prosecution regarding how the materials are often used in preparing for terrorism. On cross examination, the attorney for the defense asked, "How much of the claimed material do you yourself possess?". Answer? Pretty much all of it - and posted on the researcher's Web site - obvious, as he was researching it! Followup question: "So why are you not on trial?".

      The case fell apart and the defendant was acquitted. They didn't have any evidence he was planning anything or in touch with any terrorists. Just the material he possessed.
      --
      Beetle B.
  2. More types of "Illegal Data" by corsec67 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Sweet, now there are even more kinds of "illegal data" out there.

    Under-age porn, "terrorist" material, DRM removing software, MAFIAA products, etc...

    --
    If I have nothing to hide, don't search me
  3. they need to spread fear... by crazybit · · Score: 5, Insightful

    in order to control the masses.

    Fear is a common tactic used since the begging of civilization to manipulate people.

    - Zeus will destroy you all!
    - The devil will come for you and burn you for all eternity!
    - Terrorists! omg! seek shelter at once!

    --
    - Human knowledge belongs to the world
    1. Re:they need to spread fear... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      And also proof that you're more likely to be struck by lightning then die in a terrorist attack. And do you remember who it is who throws lightning bolts?

      That's right, Zeus.

  4. Spread it around? by FooAtWFU · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Anyone have a link to the material in question? (Is it in English?)

    --
    The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
    1. Re:Spread it around? by MisterBlueSky · · Score: 5, Informative

      http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/terrorism/alqaida_manual/

    2. Re:Spread it around? by syousef · · Score: 4, Funny

      Short version:

      1. To go to heaven you must be martyr
      2. To be martyr you must blow yourself up
      Handy hint for 2: Make sure to kill many infadel when blowing yourself up.
      General hint: If you have attempted 2 and are reading this, you failed. Do not go to heaven. Do not collect 200 denar.

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    3. Re:Spread it around? by gnuman99 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Then don't travel to US or through US via plane or you'll end up in Gitmo or worse. And RCMP may "find" some extra info on you to make sure that happens.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maher_Arar

      True story.

    4. Re:Spread it around? by RiotingPacifist · · Score: 4, Funny

      I just read that does that mean the po...

      --
      IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
  5. There is NOTHING wrong with this by zappepcs · · Score: 4, Interesting

    All this means is ...... WTF????

    Information hosted on a US government website? That is forbidden material? Entrapment anyone? How about err... uhhh... holy fuck!

    So the UK government noticed this material being downloaded and never looked at where it came from? WTF? Is the US Government now hosting terrorism inciting materials for the internets?

    This, I truly hope, leaves buckets full of egg and chicken shit on the faces of some government employee types.

    --
    Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
    1. Re:There is NOTHING wrong with this by zappepcs · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Exactly. I understand that there were some monks in not too distant history that have given you a golden example of how to go first; quiet, flame-boyant, interesting. Let me just get my camera first....

      I'm guessing that Mr AC doesn't remember that other 'terrorist' attack in the US. Down in Oklahoma? Memory getting better? There is very little reason to think that a Muslim is more likely than a white to create an act of great violence inside the US borders... school shootings anyone? Kent state? There are lots of examples. My how the black man cheered when the DC snipers turned out to be black... their first notable serial mass murderer. Up till then, all mass murderers were expected to be white.

      How many Muslims are in the world?

      The Muslim population in 2006 is 1610.42 million. from http://www.islamicpopulation.com/world_general.html That's 1.6 BILLION or so Muslims.

      Of that, 25 or so have attacked US citizens. Lets be generous and say 50 have attacked western countries. That amounts to... uhmmmm about 3.1047801194719389972802126153426e-6 percent of the Muslim population seems to be hell bent on knocking down buildings. The rest are trying to survive where they are. That, by the way, is a huge bunch of non-violent Muslims. Racial profiling does seem to make sense on face value, but dig a bit deeper and you find that the risk of violence from not invading privacy and personal rights is smaller than ... say... getting hit by a fucking bus.

      I don't care if you are afraid of shadows, diminishing MY rights because of your irrational fears is still wrong, will always be wrong, and always has been WRONG.

      Thanks for playing
      --
      Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
    2. Re:There is NOTHING wrong with this by Sir_Lewk · · Score: 4, Funny
      "3.1047801194719389972802126153426e-6 percent"

      Holy crap, have you never heard of significant digits?!?

      --
      "linux is just DOS with a UNIX like syntax" -- Galactic Dominator (944134)
    3. Re:There is NOTHING wrong with this by baeksu · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Strangely enough... we don't see similar numbers of attacks from Catholics, Buddhists, Mormons, Quakers, Amish, Jews, Zoroastrians or even Atheists.

      No, those groups seem to prefer acts of genocide accomplished with organized armies. Much more civil, clearly. And much more peaceful, too. Oh, how much those savage Muslims have yet to learn.

      If you'd really like to count... I'd take a look at http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/ a site that actually has a running count of the number of terror attacks world wide since 9/11... as of the writing of this post we are at 11,140.

      And how do we define a terror attack? Is it when you cluster bomb urban areas? Is it dropping nuclear bombs? Supporting brutal paramilitaries? Blockading food and medicine transports?

      In fact, why only count terror attacks? Surely all violent attacks should be tallied to see which religion produces most violence in this world.

      What do you reckon the results would look like then?

      --
      Gnome: A never ending quest to make unix friendly to people who don't want unix and excruciating for those that do.
    4. Re:There is NOTHING wrong with this by YttriumOxide · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As an atheist, I am a little disturbed how you said:

      or even Atheists.

      Is this supposed to imply you'd EXPECT such behaviour from those of us with no belief in a higher power?! Or even consider it to be more likely?

      Atheists are, in general, far LESS likely to tend towards extreme terrorist acts than religious people, for the simple fact that we are pretty well convinced that when we die it's GAME OVER - no afterlife - NOTHING is worth dying for. Plus of course, we are in general a more intelligent bunch (on the average... there are smart religious people, and dumb atheists, but averaged out, we're smarter) and fully realise that any kind of behaviour like this is pretty likely to get us killed, even if it's not a suicide attack specifically.

      Oh that that's right... those damn Catholics... no wait...

      You weren't in Northern Ireland a decade or two back were you?

      only the members of Islam can do that for them by changing the way they preach and practice their faith as a group.

      I consider most religions to be very dangerous things that can lead people to doing horrible things, but I don't consider Islam to be any more dangerous than Christianity. The religious texts are very similar (in fact, a lot of the religious texts are the same) and the standard teachings of peace and love are also identical. If you go to an average Islamic religious service, you'll hear exactly the same things being preached to the people there as if you went to an average Christian one. You could cherry pick and find an extremist Islamic teacher, and the same could be done for Christianity.

      --
      My book about LSD and Self-Discovery
      Also on facebook as: DroppingAcidDaleBewan
  6. Guns don't kill people; people kill people.. by brxndxn · · Score: 4, Funny

    I mean.. Information doesn't kill people; people kill people!!! It's what you do with the information that counts!

    I got curious once and looked up how to make a hydrogen bomb. Does that make me a terrorist? NO. Because I only use my hydrogen bomb for personal self-defense!

    --
    --- We need more Ron Paul!
    1. Re:Guns don't kill people; people kill people.. by bsDaemon · · Score: 4, Interesting

      My mother was Princeton class of 1977. Back in those days it wasn't exactly 'common knowledge' with 'easy access' how to make nuclear weapons.

      One of her good friends who was, I believe, reading for Physics, did his senior thesis on how to make a nuclear weapon. I also believe, though I'm not clear as its been a while since she told me this story, that the fellow in question was not exactly American.

      His thesis brought him to the interest of some of the old-line type of "terrorist" organizations like the PFLP. *THAT* brought him to the attention of the FBI and he was arrested and interrogated.

      The more things change, the more they stay the same.

  7. Immigrant. by hlt32 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    There are 2 issues here that I can tell.

    #1 Arrest under Terrorism act for having al-Qaida-related material.

    #2 Immigration charges and subsequent deportation.

    The two are related insofar as discovering 1 resulted in 2.

    #2, the illegal immigration, *should* result in deportation - he is perfectly able to make a claim on humanitarian grounds or claim asylum. The fact remains that illegal immigrants should be deported.

    #1 should be approached as:

    a) person found with dodgy material
    b) person was investigated
    c) things happen

    Now, the main objection is vs c). he was engaging in legitimate academic research (you COULD argue he is a terrorist and this is a clever coverup, but I wont go there ;) ) therefore should not be treated as a terrorist.

    The fact that "An illegal immigrate faces deportation" is no surprise and should not impact your judgement here.

    This probably comes acros as a bit confused - its been a long day. :p

    --
    à_à
    1. Re:Immigrant. by tftp · · Score: 5, Insightful
      The fact that "An illegal immigrate faces deportation" is no surprise and should not impact your judgement here

      The problem is that the guy is "Facing Imminent Deportation Without Hearing" and that's the real issue here. Looks like the police just wants him swept under the rug. As reported, he has a visa, but there are questions: due to confusion over his visa documentation, charged with offences relating to his immigration status. He sought legal advice and representation regarding these matters whilst in custody. On Friday 23rd May, the Home Office informed his solicitor that he was being removed on Sunday 1st June and Hicham was moved to an immigration detention centre. Now, is it reasonable to deport someone (who lived in the country for 13 years) within only 7 days, without proper court hearings, presentation of witnesses, debates about the applicable law? The Home Office just wants him out, and with him being out there will be no hearings, and no inconvenient truth will come out. But until his status is investigated, and his lawyers can speak for him and argue his status, we can not say that he is legal or illegal immigrant. That is to be determined, and the fight is for his right to be heard in court, and his status determined by the judge - not by a bureaucrat.

    2. Re:Immigrant. by PCM2 · · Score: 5, Informative

      We have visas, and green cards for a reason.

      And what is that reason? Seriously, have you ever had to carry a Green Card? Because I have. For years I was told that anytime I left the country I could be denied entry for just about any reason, owing to the fact that I was really only allowed to stay here at the pleasure of Uncle Sam. Then I had to spend thousands of dollars and be fingerprinted, photographed, investigated, and grilled by examiners before I could become a U.S. citizen. What did you ever have to do to earn the right to come and go as you please, or to vote? What makes you better than me?

      The whole business is nonsense. And when you hear firsthand stories of people whose families were broken up by ridiculous immigration policies enforced by xenophobic zealots in the name of "patriotism," or "protecting our jobs," or "failure to learn our language," or whatever the excuse is this week, the situation starts to look considerably less cut-and-dried than you make it out to be.

      True, there are "perfectly legal" ways to get into a country, just like there are "perfectly legal" was to buy a Ferrari, or run for President. That doesn't mean those options are open to everybody. Plus, the mere fact that this guy is pursuing an advanced degree at university should be proof enough that the "stealing our jobs" excuse doesn't apply in this case. Your kneejerk obeisance to immigration policy on the mere basis that "it's policy, ergo we follow it" is just another way of distracting attention from your own need to protect your position of privilege.

      --
      Breakfast served all day!
  8. s/freedom/security/g by Gothmolly · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You shall lose both, and deserve neither.

    --
    I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
  9. Terror by conureman · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As I RTFA I realized that this looks like standard jobsworth cops at large and could happen any day here in the U.S. Too much responsibility too little brains.

    --
    The cost of that cleanup, of course, will be borne by taxpayers, not industry.
  10. Re:Here is proof they are not terrorists: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They were reading material from a US government website.

    Well, we (the U.S.) did invade a foreign country, kill their leader and throw it into violent chaos. Sounds like terrorism to me. Maybe those UK folks are onto something.

  11. More like "Brazil" by ArchieBunker · · Score: 4, Insightful

    1984 assumes the government is competent and really out to get everyone. In reality its more like the movie Brazil. Everyone mindlessly doing their job without any critical thought. Watching Brazil and comparing it to current events is truly horrifying.

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    1. Re:More like "Brazil" by kalirion · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Everyone mindlessly doing their job without any critical thought.

      "There are hardly any excesses of the most crazed psychopath that cannot easily be duplicated by a normal kindly family man who just comes in to work every day and has a job to do."

      --Terry Pratchett, Small Gods

  12. Re:Another line a long line of insults by jfruhlinger · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Oh yes, a war for oil. And how great has that worked out? Considering that oil is at record highs, I don't think that it was a "war for oil" because had it been a "war for oil" we would have more oil.

    Hey, they didn't say it was a competently planned war for oil.

  13. University admin by tzhuge · · Score: 5, Insightful

    No one else seems to have covered this angle, so I'll bring it up. WTF is wrong with the University of Nottingham? I cannot believe a supposed institution of higher learning would sell its scholars down the river like that. This whole thing flies in the face of what a University is suppose to stand for. Perhaps I'm just naive.

  14. Re:Another line a long line of insults by postbigbang · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's just as baseless as global warming. If Bush's pipe dreams (there not being any other intelligence supporting his actions, and he had hardly any plans at all, let alone support from the international community or the UN), it had to be for oil. Bush is an oil man. His father was an oil man. His brother was in real estate (remember the S&L crises in TX in the '80s??).

    It was about oil. No tin foil hat. Oil. It wasn't about Saddam. He had a fat mouth that got him lynched. Yes, he was a murderous SOB but then there are loads of them around and we don't do even a fraction of them justice.

    And the plan backfired. A commodities market has grasped the weakness of the currency and the high demand, and they now are poised to raise oil until it's at the blood-letting levels, where they'll back off and ride the profits until 'something happens' to deflate the market. In the interim, the economies of the middle east, Venezuela, and Mexico (although Mexico can't capitalize assets to reduce their bleeding) are pretty much glowing with petro-currencies, largely worthless dollars.

    If we were going to halt terrorism, we should have targeted the perps in the 9/11 fiasco, and dealt with them. We have not, only serving as poster boy enemies for recruiters of psycho-jihadis. And the rest of Islam looks at us, like the rest of the world, like we must be insane. Indeed our gutless leadership is just that. It takes guts to admit you're wrong, and they'll never do it. This while deficit spending is far out of control, the Fed inflates the currency instead of forcing banks/derivative holders to take a bath, and the average Joe and his grandchildren go broke.

    Oddly, we don't have cameras watching our every move, and have at least a modicum of academic freedom, contrasting with the poor researchers in TFA in the UK.

    --
    ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
  15. BBC by pablomme · · Score: 5, Informative
    Some may prefer reading the BBC article, which for one doesn't misspell 'al-Qaeda'.

    Two details should be considered before judging the situation and blaming random people:
    • The document was found in a computer by university staff, it was not intercepted by the police
    • It was the University that requested police action

    This is a gross mistake anyway, but it's a quite a bit less 1984-ish than one might think from the summary.
    --
    The state you are in while your HEAD is detached... - wait, what?
  16. Similar incident on tv show numb3rs. by nonsensical · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This sounds very similar to a recent episode of numb3rs (not the greatest show in the world, but better than average). Charlie's colleague was arrested for working on genetically modified foods and sending the results to Pakistan where it could save people from famine. The government considered it bio-terrorism research material.

    I have little doubt that this episode was inspired by the whole national security climate which silences research all the time.

  17. Re:Another line a long line of insults by Jewfro_Macabbi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The plan is going absolutely wonderful - if you are a shareholder in an oil company...

  18. Re:Another line a long line of insults by bledri · · Score: 5, Informative

    There is no evidence it was a "war for oil".

    OK, I'll bite. Here is the 1998 letter sent to President Clinton urging the removal of Saddam Hussein. Check out the second paragraph:

    Such uncertainty will, by itself, have a seriously destabilizing effect on the entire Middle East. It hardly needs to be added that if Saddam does acquire the capability to deliver weapons of mass destruction, as he is almost certain to do if we continue along the present course, the safety of American troops in the region, of our friends and allies like Israel and the moderate Arab states, and a significant portion of the world's supply of oil will all be put at hazard. As you have rightly declared, Mr. President, the security of the world in the first part of the 21st century will be determined largely by how we handle this threat.

    Three years before 9/11 occurred Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and others were pushing to topple Saddam Hussein to protect the oil supply. WMDs are mentioned, but the primary context is stability in the Middle East and access to oil.

    So yes, bad intelligence played a part. If there wasn't oil involved, I doubt the US would have used 9/11 as an excuse to invade Iraq. Do you really think these guys care about "our moderate Arab allies" and Israel?

    --
    Some privacy policy Slashdot.
  19. Mr. Atta by CustomDesigned · · Score: 4, Insightful

    was studying passenger jets, not Al Qaida literature. The real terrorists plotting a crime have already been recruited, and don't need to read any more Al Qaida stuff. Arresting someone for reading Al Qaida stuff is at best a "pre-crime": they might be converted and decide to commit crimes in the future so we have to stop them now. More likely, this is another case of panicked stupidity causing the innocent to suffer.

  20. Sounds like Baldrick has a cunning plan... by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So, let me get this straight. In order to uphold peace, freedom, civilization and whatnot, we clamp down hard on the academics. So far, so familiar. Now, just for the masterstroke, We focus out little witch hunt on pro-UK moderates, from middle eastern cultural and ethnic backgrounds, with an academic interest in terrorism. Y'know, because it isn't like those sorts of people might prove useful or anything? WTF. Cracking down on academic researchers under some sort of all-encompassing "state's power to do whatever, to whomever" act is bad enough; but not even doing it pragmatically? If 10 Downing Street were to enter the twilight zone, would anybody notice?

  21. Re:except there is still a problem by osu-neko · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Until you know EXACTLY what he was downloading I don't think you are in a position to say that.

    Actually, he is, and he's right, and you're wrong. It's truly frighting how many people think government investigation of "thought crimes" is a good idea.

    There IS something fundamentally wrong with a government if how it treats you is AT ALL based on what you're reading. The fact that the government even knows what you're reading is fundamentally wrong. And I don't have to know a flying frak about what you're reading to be in a position to say that.

    --
    "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."