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Retroactive Telco Immunity Opponents Buying TV Ad

I Don't Believe in Imaginary Property writes "Whether they're mad at the Republicans for creating the mess, the Democrats for caving in, or both, many are still pissed off over the grant of retroactive immunity for spying on American citizens for no reason. And now some of them are trying to do something about it — they're buying an advertisement on cable TV. While it's not entirely clear what good, if any, this will do given that it's too late, at least it's cheap to participate — they're looking for $6 donations. The ideas is that, if more grass-roots groups do this kind of thing, their 'representatives' won't be able to afford to blow them off as easily."

10 of 291 comments (clear)

  1. Direct link, because editors are lazy by Ender_Stonebender · · Score: 4, Informative

    The link is to a Wired blog. The direct link is http://getfisaright.net/promote. And they're not asking for donations of $6, they're asking people to pay to run the ad - which might be $6, or could be a lot more, depending on the market and time of day. I think it would be a lot more efficient if they set up a fund to accept donations and ran the campaign from there.

    Apparently they know how to get FISA right, but not how to get their advertising campaign right.

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    Loose things are easy to lose. You're getting your hair cut. They're going there to see their aunt.
  2. Re:I wouldn't mind doing this by rpillala · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've been donating regularly to this cause (ActBlue) and have not had this experience, at least with this PAC. I think it would be a supreme irony for a pro-privacy group to abuse their members in such a manner. Not that it wouldn't happen these days, I'm just saying it hasn't been my experience.

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    When the axe came to the forest, the trees said, "Look out - the handle was once one of us."
  3. Congress Writes the Laws... by stewbacca · · Score: 4, Informative

    "Whether they're mad at the Republicans for creating the mess, the Democrats for caving in...

    The 110th Congress Composition: 282 Democrats - 274 Republicans - 2 Independents. So please tell me how Republicans created this mess?

    1. Re:Congress Writes the Laws... by CauseWithoutARebel · · Score: 4, Informative

      Aside from the fact that it was a republican administration that initiated the illegal program, four senior republican lawmakers who attempted to expand it with the "Terrorist Surveillance Act (2006)" and a senior republican (Specter R-PA) who introduced immunity, I can completely see how it wasn't the republicans who created the wiretapping and immunity mess...

    2. Re:Congress Writes the Laws... by CauseWithoutARebel · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not to mention the fact that the program was divulged in 2005, and was active well before that, and that the current congress wasn't seated until January, 2007...

    3. Re:Congress Writes the Laws... by stewbacca · · Score: 3, Informative

      It doesn't matter. It still required Democrats to vote for it to pass, which is exactly what happened. Thus, it isn't a problem created by Republicans, but by Congress, which consists of Republicans, Democrats, and Independents.

  4. Re:Democrat Senators who voted for FISA by LMacG · · Score: 5, Informative

    I'm not sure where you got your list from, but I noticed it leaves off Webb (D-VA), and further searching reveals it doesn't seem to match up with the Senate's own records at all.

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    Slightly disreputable, albeit gregarious
  5. Re:I wouldn't mind doing this by The+Dancing+Panda · · Score: 4, Informative

    God I hate these arguements about the definition of ironic... Irony is defined by a situation in which the intention (or the expected results) of an action and the action's result are different. So, as applied to the above statement:

    Situation: Pro-privacy group receives thousands of e-mails.

    The intention: Pro-privacy group works for the privacy of the users of these e-mail addresses

    Apparent result: E-mails are sold to a commercial entity, having the pro-privacy group give up the privacy of its members.

    This is the definition of irony. In fact, most hypocritical actions are, in fact, ironic.

  6. 4th Amendment? 1st Amendment! by Bob9113 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Much ado is made about the violation of the 4th amendment embodied in the passage of the FISA bill. While I find that to be more than sufficient to find the passage of that bill to be a violation of the oath to defend The Constitution, I believe the violation of the 1st is more troubling.

    The 1st Amendment documents fact that our right to petition the government for redress of grievances cannot be infringed. Bringing a civil suit is exactly what it is talking about. The judicial is the branch of government that has the authority to grant redress. It is the sole prerogative of the judicial to decide whether a law has been infringed. Congress can change the laws going forward, but once a petition for redress reaches the court, it is out of the hands of the legislative.

    While I completely agree that the infringement of the 4th in the name of the war on terror is wrong, it is not a clear attempt to usurp the sovereign power of the American people to control the powers of government. The violation of the 1st amendment's right to petition for redress is the most egregious portion of the FISA bill.

    As an aside; one can also see the attempted shift in the balance of power with the newly merged PRO-IP/PIRATE acts. The way it has worked (in all cases, as far as I know), is that government cases against the people were criminal, and required proof beyond a reasonable doubt. People's cases against the government or agents of government are civil, requiring preponderance of evidence. Some are holding hope for the possibility of criminal action, but even so, with the FISA bill, we lost the right to preponderance of evidence. With PRO-IP/PIRATE, the government is taking preponderance in place of beyond reasonable doubt. It is extremely telling and disturbing to me that the government is simultaneously saying that the people cannot be trusted with preponderance, and that the government need not be limited to beyond reasonable doubt.

  7. Good Charities and Bad Charities by DesScorp · · Score: 4, Informative

    "I no longer give to charity for an extension of those same reasons. Charities are now run like businesses, with salaried fund raisers, and wage slaver collectors on the streets. They pay to make money, and they make more money this way. Since making money is their primary cause, they see it as a good thing."

    I understand where you're coming from, since I give a good bit to charities myself... however, don't write all charities off because of the smarmy, professional fund raisers that some employ. A good way to gauge good charities is with Charity Navigator, which rates charities on a variety of topics, including fundraising and expenses. If a charity is spending too much on fundraising and administration, it's all laid out for you to see. Most also have their mailing list and privacy policies available there. Before I give to any cause now, I check Charity Navigator first.

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    Life is hard, and the world is cruel