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Navajo Nation Losing Internet Access

An anonymous reader writes "Due to contracts that are allegedly FUBAR, and associated wrangling, the Navajo Nation is being cut off by its satellite ISP. This is the final stage of the process, which already deprived chapter houses of access last April. While the business mechanisms play themselves into the expected ludicrous snarl, the real question may be: Is there a place for an inexpensive ham/technogeek/FOSS solution that could bypass the antics of the for-pay providers?"

14 of 360 comments (clear)

  1. Nations vs. Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    At some point, we are going to realize that a world divided into nations cannot coexist with a world united on one internet.

    It's already strange enough having nations like the Navajo trying to exist inside other nations.

    What use are nations these days? Don't they just divide us?

    1. Re:Nations vs. Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      How likely are you to be successful in attempts to uplift the condition of all men in all nations? Not very likely.

      Me? Not very likely. But the point is not that one person can make the change, but that everyone can do it collectively. When we are divided into nations, we are most focused around our national interests, not the interests of humanity.

      People ask things like: "Isn't it horrible that Americans are no longer the best science students in the world?" Where is the human benefit there? Imagine if instead we had the framework whereby we could ask, "Isn't it great that students overall are learning more and more about science?"

      Nations made a lot of sense in the past, before we had an internet. Now they are simply obsolete, and do not serve the advancement of humanity.

  2. Getting weaned off welfare is hard by viking80 · · Score: 1, Interesting

    They complain they have to drive up to 60 miles to Page, AZ to get internet access.

    It should be trivial to set up a 60 mile WiFi link for pennies compared to satellite internet.
    Also, laying down fiber is cheap. A lot of long valleys with a few hundred residents have fiber laid. A little innovation and community effort here can solve this for the better.

    Maybe getting weened of the satellite access paid for by your internet tax may actually do them some good.

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    don't cut it off www.mgmbill.org
  3. Oh the government works... by copponex · · Score: 1, Interesting

    ...especially if you're wealthy, WASPy, and in the hole for billions of dollars due to your idiotic business leadership.

    How many more years are we going to rob Native Americans of livelihood? Sad fact is, most of the populace will be celebrating Columbus day, not even aware that Native Americans are still the poorest in the nation.

    Here's an idea: estimate the value of all real estate in the US and start paying some reparations to the surviving family members. Or at least give them some decent infrastructure since we destroyed their civilization. And if you meet them, they aren't even angry about it... they're probably some of the most patriotic people I've ever met.

    Fuck writing your congressman. If you live near a reservation, call them and ask how you can help.

    1. Re:Oh the government works... by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Screw that. Europeans came to America, kicked some butt, and won it. That's what happens all over the world. I bet the Navaho conquered some neighboring territory at one point or another. Think they sat around crying and feeling guilty for it? Of course not. Get over that stupid idea of reparations - for anything. Should some guy who came from India last week be on the hook for something that happened a few hundred years ago? Just white people? Just people from families here more than 150 years old?

      Want to really treat Native Americans right? Dump this broken, unworkable, and racist notion of sovereign territories inside our country and immediately repatriate all of them. Navaho no more - they're now Americans. That means they'd get the same protection as everyone else which is a far cry better than what they have now, and be done with this destructive separatist attitude once and for all.

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
    2. Re:Oh the government works... by mpoulton · · Score: 3, Interesting

      How many more years are we going to rob Native Americans of livelihood?

      Are they prevented from participating in our society? Native Americans are less subject to racism than many other minorities in the US. Anyone can move off the Res and join US society -- at the great expense of losing some of their cultural identity.

      Here's an idea: estimate the value of all real estate in the US and start paying some reparations to the surviving family members.

      The inheritance tax is specifically intended to prevent the perpetual heredity of vast wealth. At every passing, the majority of a rich family's wealth is transferred to the federal government to be distributed amongst society. Why should they benefit to much from what their distant ancestors once owned? Arguments abound on both sides here.

      Or at least give them some decent infrastructure since we destroyed their civilization.

      We replaced their civilization with a much more technologically advanced one, against their will. Why should we then provide their remaining lands with the technology that our civilization forced upon them? It's yet another outside force imposing change and diluting their culture. Keep in mind that any native American who wants to partake in modern technology is free to do so of their own accord, without it being thrown upon them.

      And if you meet them, they aren't even angry about it

      The hell they aren't. The traditional native American societies generally treat visitors quite well. However, the deep resentment for past actions is ingrained in the culture and passed through generations. Rightfully so, perhaps -- but whites are not trusted and never truly a part of the community.

      Fuck writing your congressman. If you live near a reservation, call them and ask how you can help.

      I doubt they want your help. Their civilizations have existed here with success (by some definitions) and sustainability (by any definition) for so much longer than ours, we have little to offer other than assimilation, which they are fighting hard to avoid. The reservations are supposed to be self-governing, independent nations with full power and authority to do as they please within their borders. Autonomy is the small reward the Nations were given for the great price of being herded into small enclaves. Those who stay on the Res do so by choice -- the choice to place their cultural identity and heritage above the conveniences of non-native life, and the choice to deal with tough conditions (socially, financially, and environmentally) rather than be assimilated. They choose to fight assimilation and cultural dilution rather than accept it. This is a difficult but respectable decision. The internet, and computing technology in general, is a direct pipe for cultural dilution. Most of the world sees this as a great benefit -- we mix and share different customs, memes, and thought processes and in doing so we become more homogeneous. For a small civilization working hard to maintain its differentiation from the vast masses surrounding it, this is a detriment to that goal. The decision, and the means to achieve the desired result, should be up to the tribes themselves -- not well-meaning white folks who want to "help" by making their world more like the surrounding world.

      --
      I am a geek attorney, but not your geek attorney unless you've already retained me. This is not legal advice.
  4. Piece Of Cake by Foofoobar · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Yes... you just need one location to get a T1 line in (or some other major pipe). The grab a bunch of wireless trasmitter boxes from someplace like these guys (http://www.ubnt.com/). They all run Linux and you can connect to them wirelessly. Plus they have 3-5 mile trasmissions on some of the high end models. Do it right and you have a Navajo nation connected wirelessly on one T1 line. :)

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    This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
  5. Re:Government as usual by 12357bd · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Examples, please.

    Iberians for example.

    Current Catalonia, ancient people, ancient culture, first european parlament, never imperialistic.

    --
    What's in a sig?
  6. Please stop saying "liberal" by leereyno · · Score: 5, Interesting

    While the theft of the term "liberal" by leftist anti-liberals did take place many decades ago, it is still a term that does not apply to them and should not be used to describe them.

    A liberal is someone who believes in liberty and who pursues policies that create, expand, and protect liberty. A leftist is someone who believes in tyranny, and who pursues policies that create, expand and entrench tyranny.

    When you allow the left to choose the terminology by which they will be described, you are hand them a victory. You don't call a child molester a "boy lover." You don't call a rapist a "persistent suitor." You don't call a terrorist a "freedom fighter." And you sure as hell don't call a leftist a "liberal." To do so tarnishes the good name of the men and women who have fought and died to bring the light of freedom into the world.

    --
    Muslim community leaders warn of backlash from tomorrow morning's terrorist attack.
  7. Re:Government as usual by HungryHobo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The irish state was formed after a violent civil war and more rebellions/uprisings than I can count on both hands yet our police don't carry guns on the streets and the joke about our army is "Join the Irish army, see interesting places, get to know the other 2 guys."

    A state formed through violence can be quite peaceful.

    Australia was formed peacefully yet they get a fair whack of the FUD that americans get about terrorism.
    Looking for nations that formed peacefully seems to be a problem since so few are formed that way and it's always debatable since often they came to be as a result of a larger conflict or the violence was limited to a handful of top politicians being bumped off.

    Some of the countries which came into being when the soviet union fell apart were formed peacefully but are far from perfect when it comes to oppression/violence.

  8. Re:Internet Access Singularity by plasmacutter · · Score: 2, Interesting

    what is religious about dinosaur skeletons.

    One particular instance I remember was in the mid 90's.

    They found one of the most in tact t-rex skeletons on indian land, worked out a deal with the tribe for millions, paid them, and extracted the skeleton.

    after they go through the expense and time of, you know.. extracting, cleaning, cataloguing, and assembling the skeleton, here comes the tribe again wielding some assanine one-sided law. They tie the thing up in litigation, and "legally rob" the institution in question of the find in the end, selling it yet again.

    How long before they try to play repo man again.

    --
    VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
  9. Re:Please stop saying "Native American" by rpillala · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I use the term because I'm from India. People not from India aren't Indians. Call me old fashioned.

    --
    When the axe came to the forest, the trees said, "Look out - the handle was once one of us."
  10. Wouldn't You Need To Run a L-O-T of Cable? by reallocate · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The Navajo Nation is larger than a considerable number of states. It is sparsely populated. Many (most?) residences do not have landline telephone service, i.e., there is no landline for them to access. Wouldn't it be necessary to run cable to each of these homes and businesses and schools?

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    -- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
  11. Re:Government as usual by iminplaya · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...we didn't NEED alternatives most of that time.

    Yes we did, right from the very first time the pushers pulled this stunt. Maybe you didn't see the need, but I sure did and have worked around it since 1982, while you simply closed your eyes. I prepared in foresight, and I cannot care less about the price of gas. I was laughing in '73, and I'm laughing now. Congress has been doing this since I can remember. It is a regularly scheduled recess. And you all are just demanding for them to come back and secure you another fix. Quitcherbellyachin!!! And make tell your damn congress to do nothing more than make sure the alternatives have equal access to the market. Oh, and by the way, the same goes for internet access, create some alternative forms of access, and you'll be dictating the terms of service to the ISPs, instead of the other way around. And do it NOW before you start crying "woe with me" when you "need" to. The problem is as trivial as you make it.

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    What?