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Your Medical Treatment History Is For Sale

PizzaFace writes "The Washington Post reports on the booming business of selling your medical treatment records. Today these are mainly records of your prescriptions, but the data warehouses will soon have records of your lab tests, too. The companies selling these records make it easy for insurance companies to avoid risk by assigning each person a health score, similar to a credit score, or by flagging items in each person's history that suggest chronic or potentially expensive health problems. It's not just for insurers, either; employers who check applicants' credit scores will surely be interested in their health scores as well."

25 of 607 comments (clear)

  1. Health care, what health care? by clang_jangle · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Looks to me like this is an excellent time to read up on alternative treatment methods, as the barabaric, for-profit US "healthcare system" appears hell-bent on becoming less and less available to those of us with imperfect health and fewer than several gazillions of dollars.

    Here you can RTFA all on one page.

    --
    Caveat Utilitor
    1. Re:Health care, what health care? by jejones · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ...something other than anecdotal?

      I seriously hope that you don't come down with argyria.

    2. Re:Health care, what health care? by TheRealMindChild · · Score: 5, Insightful

      To play devil's advocate, why should those of us with good health have to pay extra for your problems?

      Because on a long enough timeline, the chance that you won't get sick approaches 0.

      --

      "When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
    3. Re:Health care, what health care? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Arygyria is used for FUD a lot. It mainly happens when people use ionic silver, not colloidal, especially when they make it at home incorrectly and up with a contaminated product. Unfortunately, due to the fact that Big Pharma needs everyone to believe in the fiction that only synthetic patent meds can help you be well, colloidal silver (like many more natural methods) has been discredited through a combination of FUD and fscked up FDA "legal definitions", such as allowing ionic silver to be labeled as colloidal silver. It takes conscientious research to deduce the truth, and to find honest products. And obviously it's far easier to believe the FUD, until it's your life hanging in the balance.

    4. Re:Health care, what health care? by Amouth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      well look at it this way - for more than 10 years i have had to pay my own health insurance .. 120$ a month.. not to bad but i paied it - i didn't go to the doctor i didn't go to the ER.. just spent 120$ a month for a warm fuzzy feeling.. well abouth a year ago i got sick.. i am currently on meds that cost me (after insurance) about 8$ a day - ontop of the 120$ a month i pay for insurance.. if i switch or have any laps they can say pre existing condition.. and who knows what i would be paying a month if i could even get insurance..

      for the first 9 years i had the same feeling as you - it is only after you have to switch boats you realize why you do it. If i didn't have insurance when i got sick i would not be able to afford the medication. without meds i can't move in the mornings due to the pain - with them i can be productive and work with minor pain.

      pray you don't have to - but if you ever switch boats - you will understand

      --
      '...if only "Jumping to a Conclusion" was an event in the Olympics.'
    5. Re:Health care, what health care? by Hairy+Heron · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And your evidence is...?

      Our evidence comes from double-blind scientific studies not anecdotes.

    6. Re:Health care, what health care? by Cadallin · · Score: 4, Insightful
      I'm glad you found something that worked for you.

      Business and medicine are a terrible combination. Many herbal and traditional treatments do work. Many don't. How can we possibly figure out which is which?

      Through the honest and open application of the Scientific Method! Big Business became clearly deleterious to health care when it became evident (many years ago) that they actively discouraged the investigation of treatments that were not convenient for their profits.

    7. Re:Health care, what health care? by DeepHurtn! · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What good does evidence based medicine to do people who have no or inadequate access to it?

    8. Re:Health care, what health care? by xaxa · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The reason why health care providers ask for medical records is so they can rate your risk, it's the same reason car insurance companies look at your driving record.

      Except, it's easy to alter the cost of your car insurance (don't drive, or buy a smaller car, or go on an advanced driving course).

      But you can't avoid being ill, or cure an uncureable illness.

      (And because that's not fair, in my country the entire country takes on the 'risk' of anyone getting ill.)

    9. Re:Health care, what health care? by amabbi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      We also need to remove the requirements for surgeons to have to go through extensive training to be doctors.

      This, quite possibly, is the stupidest thing I've ever read on Slashdot. And that's saying quite a lot.

    10. Re:Health care, what health care? by postbigbang · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Right. Empathy==not using my funds.

      You are alive because others had empathy for you and were willing to share your costs and help build you to whom you are today. Your obligation is to other humanity. Common insurance and civic maintenance isn't your obligation, of course.

      Therefore, stop paying the insurance as in your perfected state, you won't need it. Beelzebub.

      --
      ---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
  2. A Non-Issue. by Puls4r · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is a difficult discussion to have:

    Car insurance knows how many accidents you've had. Home insurance knows what claims you've made. All the insurance companies know your criminal record.

    Health records may be private - you don't particularly want your neighbors to know about it. But the company that is insuring you certainly has a right to know what type of risk they're insuring - and just like auto insurance your cost should reflect it.

    At the same time, health care is something that is a necessity. So if they price it out of range, how do you protect yourself? Removing preventive care due to cost and substituting emergency care in it's place is a horrible solution, but if it's priced out of range, that is what may happen.

    This is why the government is going to have to step into health care in some way. It's in the Health Insurance company's best interests to not insurance people that are high risk. In a free market, those people will end up being uninsured.

    I hate government intervention in any market, but I don't see any way around it. You can walk to the store and work. You can't perform an appendectomy on yourself.

    1. Re:A Non-Issue. by Sockatume · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I've always found the whole US healthcare system bizarre in the context of the Emergency Services. If your house catches fire or you're mugged, then a team of government-funded professionals come to your aid, but if you get hit by a car, you've got to cut a deal with a medic on your own?

      --
      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    2. Re:A Non-Issue. by sm62704 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      At the same time, health care is something that is a necessity. So if they price it out of range, how do you protect yourself?

      That's why the civilized world has universal health care.

      I hate government intervention in any market

      The health care "market" is not a free market, as I found out in April after my vitrectomy (link may not be sfw). The prescription eye drops I had to take after the surgery varied widely in price from pharmacy to pharmacy, but my co-pay was the same no matter where I boiught it. In the end I got it at the closest drug store, which turned out to be the second most expensive.

      I can only get insurance my employer provides. When the market isn't free, government SHOULD intervene.

      My best friend died from lack of insurance. RIP Jim Dawson, 1952-1992.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    3. Re:A Non-Issue. by Jewfro_Macabbi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      There are many problems with a free market health care system. It's a supply and demand type system - which should never be used for non-optional/substitutable goods and services. Can you lower your demand for health care? Consumers have no recourse. It's not like you can say, "Well that's a little high for heart surgery, I think I'll shop around first". or "I suppose I don't really need those antibiotics this week".

      I'm one of the uninsured, and preexisting conditions ensure I'm insurable. It's not possible to pay for your health care (unless you're a multi-millionaire). Here's what that means literally: I've been left for dead. I'm not alone either. There are millions of Americans suffering illness who cannot pay for care, and cannot get insurance. They are left in limbo until they either die, or become sick enough to qualify for disability benefits (in the governments eyes - they've denied people I know in quarantine... )

      At that point all you dear readers get to pay my medical bills anyway. Only now they are my inflated medical bills. Prevention is far cheaper than disease management. If you need an example - Had I received something like treatment over the last ten years I may not have neuropathy on top of my primary diagnosis. Now I do. Now the cost of treatment rises exponentially.

      They do not care how much costs rise. We are the ones paying.

    4. Re:A Non-Issue. by sm62704 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Sorry, but I don't follow your logic at all. Income tax has absolutely nothing whatever to do with health insurance in the US. I'm locked into my employer's insurance plan because he has a shitload of employees and can therefore get a good rate; a rate I can't get on my own, or a small business can get either.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
  3. oh gee what a surprise by Quadraginta · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I don't know why anyone would be surprised that an organization the goal of which is to maximize profits would do its best to cut costs (paying for your medical care) and maximize income (acquiring the money of you, your employer and the government i.e. other taxpayers as health-care premiums). You'd have to fail Logic 101 to think things would be otherwise.

    On the other hand, what the Washington Post will suggest is the "solution" to this nonsense is even more illogical: you should give all your health-care money to another organization, Congress, which is also most interested in something other than your health -- namely, keeping political power. What do you suppose will influence Congressmen when they decide what to do with your health-care money, and how to provide you with health-care? Altruism? Your actual happiness? Using your money most efficiently? Hmmm. Is that how it works now, when Congress debates how copyright should work in the Digital Age, or whether it makes sense to subsidize turning corn into ethanol (instead of food)?

    Once again, we're confronted with the nasty little fact o' life that the only agent that will ever have only your interests at heart is you. Given that, which of these three options makes sense?

    (A) Give your money to a big insurance company, run by strangers with Harvard MBAs seeking to maximize profits for shareholders, then ask for some of it back when you want some health care.

    (B) Give your money to Congress, run by smooth-talking lawyers seeking to maximize their terms in office through maintaining access to the massive amounts of cash necessary for perennial re-election, then ask for some of it back when you want some health care.

    (C) Keep your money, and spend it on health care when and where you choose.

    Strangely enough, people keep choosing (A) and (B), under the amazing delusion that somehow if you make all the transactions really complicated -- shuffle the dollar bills around fast enough -- we can receive more value in health care than we pay out in actual money. Proof that the bitter lesson of TANSTAAFL has not been learned by most adults.

    1. Re:oh gee what a surprise by Abcd1234 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      (C) Keep your money, and spend it on health care when and where you choose.

      (D) Build a quality, government-run universal health care system, like those found in virtually the entire western world, and watch quality of life rise while health care costs plummet.

      But I can see why you wouldn't want that...

  4. Us health insurance companies - perfect argument by unity100 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    for a national health care. they are SO predatory, SO villainous, SO phony that they make worst nationalized health care system look like out of heaven.

  5. Well sounds great except by philspear · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The system can save money for insurers... For instance, if MedPoint produces a report that an individual has been on the highest dose of the cholesterol-reducing drug Zocor for 18 monts, the insurer "would be able to know that you have a very high, near-intractable cholesterol problem," Dick said, and could avoid a costly blood test.

    Sounds reasonable at first, but think for a minute: why would your doctor order a blood test to see if you have cholesterol problems if he or she had already put you on cholesterol medication because he or she knew you had cholesterol problems? Even if you switched doctors, your new doctor should know the results of that test, and at the very least you need to tell him you're on the medication. In other words: your doctor is going to know already.

    At best this is a flimsy excuse to invade your privacy and raise your insurance premiums: "By reducing wasteful testing your doctor orders because he/she is an idiot, we save you money, so don't worry about invasions of privacy or your rates going up

    But there's another issue that this seems to raise: accountants at your HMO second guessing your doctors. Lets say in the example above your doctor wants to test your cholesterol to see how effective it is or if you actually should still be taking it. Your HMO says "Hey, no, we're not paying for that, we know he has high cholesterol because he's on cholesterol medication, we don't need a test!"

    It seems like this could be sorted out with common sense, and like the insurance agencies would have some idea of what's reasonable and what's wasteful, but they don't always. The article mentions that often medications that can be perscribed for two or more different purposes, and the insurance agencies often have a hard time understanding something that simple, denying the woman life insurance because they were convinced she was depressed, when she was actually taking prozac for hot flashes.

    If they don't belive the doctor that she was postmenopausal instead of depressed, can we really expect them to use information NOT coming from the doctor correctly, in our best interests?

  6. Re:Alarmism by eihab · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Alarmism

    Far from it, look at the credit score mess and where it has gotten us.

    What's a credit score? It's a score about how much you love being in debt, you get in debt and pay to get more debt and pay on time to get even more debt, etc. How is that relevant to you being able to get a job? It's beyond me.

    What makes you think this system won't be abused exactly like the FICO score if not even worse?

    Can you imagine identity theft in this scenario? Oh boy oh boy, someone steals your identity and all of the sudden you lose your life insurance, the doctor _won't_ see you now because you lost your health insurance, and all of that is because someone bought a heart medication with your info and your insurers dropped you immediately.

    Isn't that similar to how credit scores work? Someone steals your identity messing up your score and all of the sudden _you_ are the criminal, universal default on all of your accounts, collector calls who won't believe you, etc.

    The whole "insurance" thing is a form of measured "gambling"/risk industry, that is: "I bet you won't die in 30 years", "I bet you won't get sick so much this year" or "I bet you won't get in a car accident".

    Things like this health score significantly reduces that gambling element and turns it almost into "I'll insure you if and only if you don't need the insurance", which just smells bad.

    Finally, on a privacy stand point, the idea of even more of my information being thrown about out there doesn't sound that appealing to me.

    What's the solution? I don't know. Maybe one day the system will collapse on its own weight or someone will come up with a better idea, but until that day comes, we'll be in this weird relationship with these middle-men characters.

    --
    If you can't mod them join them.
  7. Re:HIPPA by StatureOfLiberty · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You can't get out of the doctor's office without signing a HIPAA waiver so the doctor can share your health information with their partners.

    I guess assuming that this partner would be the radiologist, neurologist ... involved in my case was foolish. Plus, they obviously have to disclose to the insurance company to get paid. And the insurance company runs the database from which they sell your information. Great!

    This statement scares me even more: It's not just for insurers, either; employers who check applicants' credit scores will surely be interested in their health scores as well.

    I don't really see how this is legal. I'm sure most companies would love to be able to cherry pick employees based on health risk. But, whatever happened to the risk sharing aspect of insurance?

    If insurance companies will only insure people who don't need it, they have no reason to exist. Oh, excuse me, I totally forgot about those poor stock holders :->

    It sounds like the people who will get hurt the most by this are once again the individuals buying their own health insurance and also small businesses.

    There has to be a better way.

  8. Re:Alarmism by SpiderClan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    But if you're so good with money that you never use credit cards or take loans, then you have no credit score at all, and this is considered 'bad' credit.

  9. Why socialized health care should be implemented by vorpal22 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As someone with a very painful, debilitating chronic health condition (very active Crohn's Disease), you should assist in paying for my health care because you're part of a society that has made euthanasia illegal and severely demonized suicide (indeed, were I to attempt it, I would likely be institutionalized). Hence, as society has taken away my only alternatives, it has an obligation to provide me with access to the requisite medical procedures and drugs.

  10. What Natural Selection Selects by NetSettler · · Score: 5, Insightful

    However, catering to the sickly weakens our gene pool.

    If our society were based on blugeoning each other with clubs, this would be a relevant argument. We'd need the specific quality of physical strength and resilience to survive. But the fact is that people who are "sickly" (to use your word) can make important contributions to society exactly because the aspects of the person that is required to make those contributions is often unrelated to the health issue they may confront. Look at Stephen Hawking for example. Nothing wrong with his brain, so as long as the essential aspects of his body are functionally maintained, he can continue to make his contribution. And even when reasoning in some sort of cold/mercenary way, the cost of maintaining such a person may be much less than the cost of losing such a person's potential contribution.

    Besides, natural selection is intensely focused on the high order bit--whether people survive to breeding age at all. It's not very concerned with selecting for good writers, philosphers, mathematicians, teachers, etc. Nor does it appear to care a whole lot about diseases that come up after breeding age. So the argument about the gene pool being affected by caring for the so-called "sickly" seems bogus given that a lot of people who we care for are older than breeding age and do not, at that point, contribute to the gene pool.

    Natural selection isn't creating some noble super-race. It favors the strong, but also the violent and the crafty. It looks only at outcome; it doesn't moralize about tactics. And its measure of outcome seems, by modern theory, limited narrowly to "has offspring ready to play the game anew". That's a possible theory of "good", but not the only possible theory. It seems just a little limiting, in fact. Which is why society tries to circumvent it through conscious thought and group policy, for better or worse.

    --

    Kent M Pitman
    Philosopher, Technologist, Writer