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Twilight of the GPU — an Interview With Tim Sweeney
cecom writes to share that Tim Sweeney, co-founder of Epic Games and the main brain behind the Unreal engine, recently sat down at NVIDIA's NVISION con to share his thoughts on the rise and (what he says is) the impending fall of the GPU: "...a fall that he maintains will also sound the death knell for graphics APIs like Microsoft's DirectX and the venerable, SGI-authored OpenGL. Game engine writers will, Sweeney explains, be faced with a C compiler, a blank text editor, and a stifling array of possibilities for bending a new generation of general-purpose, data-parallel hardware toward the task of putting pixels on a screen."
I just browsed the article and it looks like what he's saying is that as GPU's become more like highly parallel cpu's we will begin to see API's go away in favor of writing compiled code for the GPU itself. For example, if I want to generate an explosion, I could write some native GPU code for the explosion, and let the GPU execute this program directly... rather than being limited to the API's capabilities.
So essentially, we will go back to game developers needing to make hardware specific hacks for their games... some games having better support for some cards, etc.
API's are there for a reason... lets keep em and just make them better.
Sometimes the best solution is to stop wasting time looking for an easy solution.
If we are going back to the "old" days...
Why can't we skip all this OS nonsense, and just boot the game directly?
After all that will make sure that you get the MOST out of your computer.
See Ivan Sutherland's Wheel of Reincarnation. The idea is that CPUs get faster and graphics move there; then busses get faster and graphics moves to dedicated hardware; rinse and repeat. http://www.anvari.org/fortune/Miscellaneous_Collections/56341_cycle-of-reincarnation-coined-by-ivan-sutherland-ca.html
--- Often in error; never in doubt!
Except that you like everyone else reads "CPU" in the article to mean the Intel/AMD CPU and not think of it as current gen GPUs that are almost capable of massive parallel execution of general purpose code. With the advent of Shaders, more processing was able to be offloaded to GPUs and over the next couple of GPU generations. So his idea is that we'll see less of the OpenGL/DirectX specific API calls and everything being done in CUDA/Shaders. That way the folks who write graphics engines aren't limited to the current SGI implementation (here's a set of vectors describing my object -- draw it) and we'll see different rendering engines based on Ray Tracing for example (or whatever other methods the engine writers want to do it).
This isn't anything new here -- he's basically saying what Intel has already said... You'll see less OpenGL/DirectX and more CUDA/Shader based implementations for rendering engines.
So wait, your integrated graphics is *slower* than a low end discrete graphics card that's now 6 generations (or ~6 years) behind... and you find that acceptable?
At the current pace, it'll take them a decade to match a high end card from today with an integrated card, and video cards aren't standing still in the mean time.
You can point at the current integrated market for video cards, but that's not terribly interesting due to the fact that a) current integrated video cards barely do more than send signals to monitor(s), and (as a corollary to a) b) current integrated video cards aren't very fast.
Wake me up when integrated video cards are faster than discrete video cards.
Game! - Where the stick is mightier than the sword!
"Take a 1999 interview with Gamespy, for instance, in which he lays out the future timeline for the development of 3D game rendering that has turned out to be remarkably prescient in hindsight:
2006-7: CPU's become so fast and powerful that 3D hardware will be only marginally beneficial for rendering, relative to the limits of the human visual system, therefore 3D chips will likely be deemed a waste of silicon (and more expensive bus plumbing), so the world will transition back to software-driven rendering."
Nuff said.
"Ok so you state that memory bandwidth requirements for GPUs are off the charts. Where do you propose to get more memory bandwidth than on the CPU itself? Seems to me if you want memory bandwidth there is no better place to be than on the cpu die..."
Again you're missing the point, "the jack of all trades, master of none" problem, not to mention the space requirements. GPU's complexity is nothing like the old style co-processor units that were integrated into the core. They require ridiculous amounts of cutting edge ram to get that kind of performance, and they need a lot of ram to output the results of those calculations.
I don't see CPU's integrating 512MB to 2GB of ram in the near term future given heat and die size considerations, and we haven't even touched the extremely low bandwidth between modern cpu's and main memory in PC's (which is much much less then a modern GPU).
The GPU will play it's part for as long as is necessary. I don't rule out that perhaps one day it will be technically feasable but it is nowhere near that day, it's at least a decade or more away.
We've seen this time and time again, processors go through evolutions of integrating and seperating. We went from mainframes to PC's and with the net 'back to mainframes' but notice how each device play's their role, each one didn't totally obsolete the other, they just have become more specialized at their tasks.
Not if AMD can help it. Obviously this is not their path or they would not have purchased ATI. They sell two products, one of them is enormously expensive, the other is reasonable. I cant see why any graphics card manufacturer would give up all that profit!?
Also consider that GPU upgrades are much more frequent that CPU upgrades. I don't think the dollars favor integration of the two. I don't think there is enough competition for force it either.
The only company that may achieve this is VIA. For completely different reasons.