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Report is Critical of US For Dumping E-Waste Overseas
coondoggie writes "In what may be the least astonishing news of the day, some major US companies who say they are environmentally recycling electronic waste — aren't. Rather more startling — they are dumping everything from cell phones and old computers to televisions in countries such as China and India where disposal practices are unsafe to people and dangerous to the environment. Controlling the exportation of all of the e-waste plops on the doorstep of the US Environmental Protection Agency which is doing a woeful job, according to a scathing 67-page report issued by the Government Accountability Office today."
I can't speak for other countries, or even other provinces, but Alberta, Canada, adds a tax on to all major electronic devices (Laptops, desktops), which covers their recycling at the end of the product's life.
I am not testifying as to how good these programs work though, as I've never seen them in action.
That sounds great. Last I heard the US was not Utopia though. US (and other countries companies) will continue to attempt extracting water from stone and pushing the limits of what they can get away with. As my boss said to me once: "Don't worry what's 'right', this is the way it's done.
Despite this I agree with you; I am becoming a cynic as I age. Although, depsite being a cynic, I can still *personally* choose to choose right from wrong.
Suggested Ammendment:
"Made in China for the US, dumped in China for the US."
I don't know. What is the big deal?
hmmm...Maybe...the 202 billion of electronic exports from china? Sounds like a pretty big deal to me.
Source: http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008-07/02/content_8478003.htm
NB: This figure includes information exports, which I assume are a small portion of the total.
Does that mean those of us in States like California who have payed e-waste fees are owed refunds if they were collected by said companies?
Every time we purchase an "electronic display", or device containing one, we pay a $6-10 fee. Not much per person, but I'm sure it adds up on the companies responsible for this.
I don't think morals are that black and white. While on one hand it would be nice if we in the west disposed of our own garbage, I don't think it's our duty to keep anyone else from shooting themselves in the foot. Unless you want to go back to the old (and even worse) "mission to civilize" and "white man's burden" doctrines.
If China wants to import garbage for some quick cash, it's China's problem alone. They should fix their own laws, if they don't want it to happen.
There _are_ situations where the west did actual harm, including
- bribes (we practically created the 3'rd world kleptocracies, by making it so that taking a bribe from the western corporations is the most profitable thing one could do, better than any industry or commerce)
- military/CIA interventions
- economic pressures to make some countries destroy their own industry and agriculture (including occasionally to take the same good ol' right-wing measures in a crisis that that would turn a crisis into an all out depression, according to the economics we apply in the west)
Etc.
And for that we are rightfully hated.
But things that they do to themselves for a buck? Why would it be our business to stop them from doing that?
E.g., the west didn't hold anyone hostage to make them take our garbage. It's stuff that someone there figured out would be a good way to make some bucks. And is probably acclaimed as the great entrepreneur and one of the guys doing something for their economy there.
E.g., I don't think many western companies take _slaves_ in China, much less India. While I do find that running some of those sweatshops says something about the greedy fucks who moved there just for that, ultimately it's India's and China's job to decide whether that's ok with them or not. They _can_ give minimum wage and maximum hours per week laws if they want to, you know? If they'd rather get dollars than that, why should the west be the one to blame?
And again in most cases it's not the west who even runs those "slave labour" camps, but some local company who subcontracts for a western company. In most cases the western company can't even control what membranes go into their batteries (see incendiary batteries made in China that have a cheap non-working replacement for the membrane that was supposed to collapse and open the circuit when overheated), or what paint is used on their toys (lead-painted toys made in China ftw), or what glue goes into their beads that are supposed to be wet and stuck to a board and most kids will lick to get wet (replaced by some enterprising Chinese with a toxic and psychoactive glue.) What makes you think that the western company gets much more to say about how a Chinese boss treats Chinese employees at that company?
Or, as I was saying, are we back to the "mission to civilize" (China, India and everyone else) doctrine from the 19'th century?
Plus, even if the western corporations didn't directly subcontract to those, they'd still find ways to exploit each other just the same. Whether it's cheap pens or counterfeit watches or farming gold in WoW, they'll _still_ take advantage of the missing legislation to make each other work 90+ hour weeks for a pittance. E.g., I remember an article from some months ago about WoW gold farmers, and those guys were working 12 hour days in essentially a high-tech sweatshops. I don't think any western corporation made them do that. (Blizzard probably would rather they crawl somewhere and die, for example.)
Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to play the bullshit card that we're some kind of great benefactors for giving them those crap jobs. I'm not _that_ deluded. But I _am_ saying that ultimately they do most of that exploitation to themselves, and they must find their own way and equilibrium point there. It's their own f-ing country, and it's mostly their own sociopaths not ours doing that to their workers or environment. It's not _our_ job to clean up _their_ act.
Blaming the west for that, and doubly so trying to
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
"This is yet another example of green washing and corporates (in this case US ones) flushing our environment down the toilet for their own short term gain."
Yes. The west has cleaned up it's act over the last few decades but the illusion breaks down when you realise much of that has been achived by throwing it over an international fence. In general the EU/AU/NZ have slightly better laws to deal with this kind of thing. What I find strange about the US is there seems to be a much larger proportion of the general population who are outright hostile to environmentalists. These people (and we have them here in Oz aswell - so untwist those patriotic nickers), also seem to rant about "UN totalitairianisim", "intellectual elitisim" and "freedom".
Personally I want to restict the the "freedom" to pillage and plunder, not because I grew up in the 60-70's (when totalitarians really were a big problem), but because I grew up surrounded by farms and can appreciate where our food comes from. The farms and surrounding bush have all but dissapeared under the sprawling suburbs of a city famous the world over for looking green from the window of a passanger jet.
I selfishly want enough arable land with a stable enough climate to feed myself, my kids, and from March next year my grandkid(s). I want my offspring to experience and appreciate both the benifits of the industrial revolution AND the awesome natural wonders in this country and elsewhere. Pretending we are green by denying we are both culpable in, and affected by, (say) West Papua or the Amazon is the height of "elitisim" that will come back to bite EVERYONE on the arse and hard!
I understand the world is a messy place and there is always a trade-off, but I think the "freedom" to blatantly pillage and plunder are "rights" that should be denied to all players in a globalised economy, those "rights" are as distastefull to me as the "freedom" to trade slaves.
So come on and hit me without hiding behind an anonymous troll, who thinks enviromentalists are the scum of the earth and why?
And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.
You may also realise that WE may not be around to enjoy it in a few centuries.
I am 100% sure the planet/universe will be around for a long time to come.
I'm not going to disagree. But I'll add that it's ironic that the west decries and bemoans the lack of human rights in these "slave" countries, but then actively participates in the denial of those rights.
It is a human right to have clean water and not be poisoned by toxic chemicals, especially by those that are specifically manufactured for human use. It's just two faced to complain about Chinas human rights record and then deliberately use them to a) produce shit cheaply (keeping the labourers poor) and b) export the waste back to them to suffer the consequences of that cheapness.
And because they are poor they have no option other than "thank you sir, may I have another". Colour me disgusted.
There is such a thing as moral leadership.
Thankfully, this situation cannot continue for much longer, as we are running out of places to relocate our dirty habits to. As the third world gets more of our business, they also get more of our money, and then they start demanding their rights. So we move to less demanding countries. That list of alternatives is dwindling, so IMHO, we ought to be biting the bullet now, and cleaning up our act before we are forced to.
IIRC, this is how the Office Depot tech. recycling thing works. They crush the stuff with large "wheels" with metal "teeth" and then shake and sift out the gold plated stuff (probably heat it to get the gold by itself), glass, PCB, etc. I have no idea how I know this, but I'm fairly sure I read it in their pamphlet (I got a tech-recycling thing going on at work... a day where everyone brings in their old electronics - it's more economical to buy their big box than their small one... I took the pamphlet to work to show my boss, as we've had hard drives that need to be destroyed for some time now) or just made it up in my mind after reading their pamphlet. I'm sure its on their website if anyone needs the karma and could hunt down the link.
If I mod you up, it doesn't necessarily mean I agree with what you've said, sorry.
Perhaps China is seeing this as a new, and novel way to help control their (over)population?
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Most of the large and even not so large "recycling" companies in the US are now owned by the Chinese. In addition to shipping e-waste back to China for processing, they are also behind the large stolen copper wire/plumbing industry that's sprung up in the past 3 years.
"The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old......They literally know nothing." - Ben Rhodes
So does that mean the old report on "greenness" of various tech companies is wrong? I remember when this came out, and greenpeace merely looked at the companies policies, not what they actually did. Now it looks like the companies were lying. Biiig surprise. Glad I didn't follow that advice.
Yeah, but I'm a shareholder of companies too, and I don't like companies that think short term.
Not all shareholders think short term.
A company's management can choose to attract different shareholders to hold their stock - and even say so publicly.
If you keep focusing on rewarding short term shareholders, naturally you will end up having a lot of short termers holding your stock.
Nice try, you just left out the word "Nigger." We all know you wanted to put it in, I'm curious why you didn't.
Africa isn't all poor some of the most resource rich areas in the world are located in Africa. If they could elect a reasonable government, one which wasn't corrupt they'd have few problems.