NSA Whistleblowers Reveal Extent of Eavesdropping

ma11achy was one of several readers to write about claims made by two former military intercept operators who worked for the NSA that "Despite pledges by President George W. Bush and American intelligence officials to the contrary, hundreds of US citizens overseas have been eavesdropped on as they called friends and family back home." Ars Technica has a brief report as well, and reader net_shaman adds a link to Glenn Greenwald's opinion piece on the eavesdropping at Salon.

Comments

Well...

[djcinsb]

I'd comment, but the NSA is listening...

Re:Terrible reporting. A little perspective...

[mpapet]

I think most would agree that surveillance probably began under the conditions you describe.

1. The crux of the problem is the relentless acquisition of power and influence that creeps into what could, in principal, be a good program. Maybe the power-mongering doesn't happen at first, but history has repeatedly shown stuff like this is turned against citizens. There is no reason to believe there would be an exception here.

2. The Office of the President currently operates under the notion that their powers shall be unconstrained by any other branch of government, tradition and legal history be damned.

Mix #1 and #2 together and publish it on Slashdot and the conspiracy minded come flying out to condemn it all.

The rest of the political/legal world generally agree that the Cheney administration views executive powers as unlimited. Therefore, they would probably agree that it's likely the office of the President would willfully sodomize any survielance(sp?)law with signing statements and executive orders.

Finally, I think it's the case that most Americans know there is "something wrong" with the way the Executive branch has been operating. Media coverage like this is a kind of indirect measurement.

Re:Terrible reporting. A little perspective...

[Anonymous Coward]

Two things:

1)When I was doing this 20 years ago, it was drilled and drilled and drilled that we were NOT to intercept Americans.

2)There was (and I'm sure there still is) a thing called "tip off"; if you came across a conversation not targeted you were supposed to "tip off" to the appropriate group/individual and roll on, staying on your assigned target. You never knew when the trick chief was listening and we did not get caught staying on something we weren't assigned.

Is this generation not so strenuously warned against intercepting Americans?

What happened to targeted topics for intercept and 'tip off'? Is it anything and everything now?

I'm thinking things have changed and not for the better.

Thanks for the insight. It's terrifying.

[OneIfByLan]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the insight.

"And surprise, surprise: individuals with the power to listen to things sometimes listen to things they're not supposed to, ... there really isn't any easy way to prevent it. ... But I guess sometimes immaturity and a cheap laugh at someone else's expense trumps common sense and the doing the right thing."

My response and my honest question would be, what the hell ever happened to discipline and accountability? When I got an order, it was the Voice of God and woe be unto the man who dreamed of disobeying his CO.

There isn't an easy way to prevent people screwing around? Is that a joke? All I ever got was a growl that said "Don't screw around!" and we didn't dare, not if we valued our sorry asses.

You're literally arguing that there's no such thing as a chain of command any more, that the commanders have lost control of their men. In my day, admitting you couldn't keep your men under control was a wonderful way to lose your rank.

Re:Thanks for the insight. It's terrifying.

[Anonymous Coward]

When I got an order, it was the Voice of God and woe be unto the man who dreamed of disobeying his CO.

Note that Faulk specifically said that the abuses were brought to the attention of NSA supervisors - the ones whom the Bush administration has repeatedly claimed were adequate substitutes for FISA judges in deciding who should be surveilled - and those supervisors said that they were ordered to transcribe the calls in question.

Dave can go on and on (and on and on, geeze dude) about how some dweeb with a tap was doing naughty things, but he can't change the allegations. If the allegations are true, these were by no means "cheap laughs" by bottom-rung "individuals".

Re:foreign military operations theater

[PopeRatzo]

I call bullshit, unless you provide a damn good reason why clandestine electronic eavesdropping on DWB prevents them from doing their work.

Are you serious? That's the new threshold for civil liberties? "Whether you can provide a damn good reason why eavesdropping prevents you from doing your work"??

Has the whole country gone fucking nuts?

Re:Terrible reporting. A little perspective...

[PopeRatzo]

I'd also imagine an Obama administration would be more friendly to these whistle blowers but even McCain could use it show he's cleaning things up if so inclined.

Actually, Senator Obama co-sponsored legislation to strengthen whistleblower protection. McCain? Wasn't there for the vote.