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10 Years Later, Misunderstood DMCA Is the Law That "Saved the Web"

mattOzan writes "On the tenth anniversary of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act [PDF], Wired Magazine posits that the DMCA should be praised for catalyzing the interactive '2.0' Web that we enjoy today. While acknowledging the troublesome 'anti-circumvention' provision of the act, they claim that any harm caused by that is far outweighed by the act's "notice-and-takedown" provision and the safe harbor that this provides to intermediary ISPs. Fritz Attaway, policy adviser for the MPAA weighed in saying 'It's not perfect. But it's better than nothing.'"

37 of 205 comments (clear)

  1. Safe Harbor made innovation work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's true, the notice-and-takedown is a bitch for the user but without the safe harbor that it provides, the service providers would do a lot more validation and the web 2.0 would not be so user oriented.
    Now the DMCA applied to hardware makes me scream so it's not perfect but the safe harbor is one thing that they got right.

    1. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Now the DMCA applied to hardware makes me scream so it's not perfect but the safe harbor is one thing that they got right.

      It would be righter if there were actual penalties for falsely sending a takedown when you don't have the authority to do so (you don't actually own the copyright to the material).

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    2. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by timmarhy · · Score: 1, Insightful

      nonsense. there is no safe harbor when a mere letter takes you offline with no burden of proof on the accuser. not only that but the dmca has been misused in courts to stifle competition. this should a dark day for us all.

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    3. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by DrEldarion · · Score: 3, Insightful

      There is - perjury. The problem is that nobody pursues it.

    4. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by Tubal-Cain · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If there was no DMCA, we wouldn't need the safe harbor.

    5. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by DinkyDogg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The DMCA allows anyone to issue a takedown notice of anything, without any proof that it's infringing, and requires the person who uploaded the content (or the accused, in cases of filesharing) to reveal his identity in order to contest the claim. Scientology has used this to censor criticism from those who want to remain anonymous. The RIAA uses it to bully college students who are better off taking the blame for copyright infringement even if they are innocent rather than revealing their identities so they can be sued without a subpoena. ISPs should not be liable for what their customers do with that connection at all. Why is the DMCA, which makes ISP liability contingent on responses such as "terminating repeat offenders" and taking down content without any proof of copyright infringement a good thing?

    6. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by DinkyDogg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Since it's mostly massive corporations issuing the takedown notices against individuals, being able to pursue perjury charges in court is rarely feasible.

    7. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by jelton · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If there was no DMCA, we wouldn't need the safe harbor.

      Except for that pesky Copyright Act of 1976.

      --
      I am not a lawyer. This post does not constitute any form of legal advice.
    8. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by MadnessASAP · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well the alternative before the DMCA safe harbour is that sites like Youtube would be held accountable for every single copyright violation on them. Think about that for a moment before you go calling someone a moron. The DMCA is far from perfect but, as was previously stated, is better then nothing for certain cases.

      --
      I may agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to face the consequences of saying it.
    9. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by timmarhy · · Score: 2, Insightful
      as long as someone thinks the DMCA actually improves things i'll call them a moron. Lets get one thing straight, websites like youtube weren't ever responsible for content posted on them (nor should that have been) and you don't NEED the DMCA to make that happen. you certainly don't need the DMCA for that just as we don't need it being used by printer manufactures to shut down generic ink cart makers because they are circumventing some crappy content protection scheme.

      it's a terrible shitty law so please stop this insane attempt at putting a positive spin on it.

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      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    10. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by CorporateSuit · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What do you have against people being able to publicly confront their accusers and be confronted in turn?

      Not everyone has the courage to stand by what they say. That doesn't mean they don't have a right to say it, and it doesn't mean what they want to say is unimportant. Sure, anonymity brings out the worst of the population, but if we allow it to continue, perhaps we will also see it coax out the best.

      This can also be turned around to say: If something is incorrectly stated, why do you need to confront the person when you can confront the falsehood instead? Isn't it more important to discern what's right rather than who's right?

      --
      I am the richest astronaut ever to win the superbowl.
    11. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by electrictroy · · Score: 1, Insightful

      >>>It allowed JP Morgan to buy Bear Stearns and Bank of America to buy Merrill Lynch, instead of allowing those two investment banks to crash.

      If the original 1933 Law was still in effect, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch would still be standing, because they would have been forbidden from investing in housing stocks/securities. They would be stable.

      --
      The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
    12. Re:Safe Harbor made innovation work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Ah, now that you've explained it, it's clear that the Republican majority in Congress had nothing to do with step 1 (the bill passing in the first place).

      We can't let Bill off the hook for signing bad legislation, but we need to give credit where it's due.

  2. Not perfect, but not all bad. by phanboy_iv · · Score: 1, Insightful

    The anicircumvention things should go, certainly, and the illegal search-and-seziure stuff should be purged, but the article makes a good point. Without the explicit "fair use" bits, the Web wouldn't look like it does today.

    1. Re:Not perfect, but not all bad. by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Without the explicit "fair use" bits, the Web wouldn't look like it does today.

      Fair Use existed as US common law over a hundred years ago.

      Without the DMCA, those (media) companies would have had to file lawsuits that would have quickly and explicitly carved out the limits of fair use, which would be good for us and not for them.

      The DMCA did not give us, the end users, any benefit that I can see.
      Even if you want to argue benefits, I don't think it will take much to show the negatives have far outweighed any positives.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    2. Re:Not perfect, but not all bad. by leomekenkamp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Hmmm, I somehow have this feeling that stating the whole of the web would look significantly different because of a single law in only one of the countries that are on that web, is a bit presumptious.

      --
      Wenn ist das Nunstueck git und Slotermeyer? Ja! Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput.
    3. Re:Not perfect, but not all bad. by rakslice · · Score: 3, Insightful

      >Without the DMCA, those (media) companies would have had to file lawsuits that would have quickly and explicitly carved out the limits of fair use, which would be good for us and not for them.

      I'm not sure I would trust the courts to make the right decisions about fair use when it comes to the Internet.

      From the bits and pieces of US court rulings I've heard since the Internet gained popularity (~1993 to present), I've noticed a trend: When US courts are faced with cases involving technology they don't understand the details of, they sometimes ignore the existing well-established law that anyone familiar with the technology could see was obviously relevant and instead toss a coin and follow one party or another's 'creative' (i.e. off-the-wall) theories without anyone providing substantial arguments in support of any of the theories.

      I can't remember every unquestioningly-accepted theory that has led me to this conclusion, but off the top of my head, the highlights are:
      - Treating domain names as property
      - Applying trademark restrictions to queries (e.g. DNS lookups and web searches)
      - Deeming linking to a document to be the same as copying or distributing it
      - More generally, assigning responsibility for actions automatically carried out by a computer to [any of: the computer's owner, operator, designer, manufacturer, programmer] without suggesting negligence or giving any other reason for this at all

      In any case, all of this means that I'm a little uncertain where (or in what ballpark) a US court would put the boundaries for fair use on the Internet. =)

      I'm not saying that the DMCA is the answer (it's about 180 degrees from it), but I think another law clarifying things for the courts was (and still is?) what is needed.

    4. Re:Not perfect, but not all bad. by rakslice · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Er... I meant to say that another law clarifying things for the courts is needed _in_the_US_. If you happen to live in a country where courts seem to be able to understand the details of new technology and figure out how existing law applies to it (*cough* http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/10/27/2134214 *cough*) then no special laws plz.

  3. -1, Troll by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This article is complete and utter bullshit.

    How about we celebrate rape and murder too, while we're at it? After all, if it weren't for rape and murder, we wouldn't be living in this violence-free Utopia.

  4. Re:Because our ISPs totally need the protection by Anpheus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They have no financial incentive to defend you, and all past activities suggest they'd kick you to the curb and say "Use someone else for your ISP" regardless of whether or not that's possible.

    I mean, do you really want Comcast fighting for your rights?

  5. Re:Yes! It saved the web! by BlackSabbath · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How a 'bout a whac-a-mole(TM) analogy?

    As a result of whacking the mole on the head with a mallet when it tries to pop up out of four of the five holes, the DMCA is responsible for the mole's successful appearance out of the last hole.

  6. Draconian Media Copyright Act by SickFreak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I've always felt like the DMCA is like an authority figure that tries to sound lenient by saying, "You know, we could have made it a lot worse..." or "Aren't you thankful you can still have your toys/music?"

    Not one user ever says, Gee, I wish that today I could do *less* with my music today than I could yesterday.

    The DMCA is a corporation-driven, draconian rule that is abused on both sides, by the enforcers and the afflicted. Increased government regulation is rarely the answer to any of our societal/economic ills, much less so in the case of digital media.

  7. "Better than nothing"? by fan+of+lem · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nothing is better.

  8. Impossible to gauge? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Despite the problems and abuses, it's impossible to gauge what the internet landscape would look like today had it not been for the DMCA

    Er, you could look at the Internet landscape found in other countries that didn't have a DMCA-style law in 1998.

  9. Responsible for Web 2.0? by syousef · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So if not for a draconian law that takes away fair use rights and introduces excessive and harsh penalties for minor infringements, we wouldn't have a buzzword laden technique for dynamically changing the content on a web page withuot a full refresh.

    I don't think I've heard anything this absurd, even on slashdot, in quite some time.

    (And yes I know I've over-simplified, but come on people!)

    --
    These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    1. Re:Responsible for Web 2.0? by Btarlinian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      User-generated content would not have had a place to flourish if it were not for the safe harbor provisions of the DMCA. You'd have a hard time arguing with that. Any person who is not a member of of the **AA agrees that many of the copyright infringement rules included in it are crap. But it is certainly plausible to argue that benefit of user-generated content outweighed the impacts of draconian rules on DeCSS, etc.

    2. Re:Responsible for Web 2.0? by syousef · · Score: 2, Insightful

      User-generated content would not have had a place to flourish if it were not for the safe harbor provisions of the DMCA.

      Funny, I remember plenty of content before the DMCA came into force.

      There, that wasn't hard to argue at all now was it?

      --
      These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
    3. Re:Responsible for Web 2.0? by Btarlinian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Really, so YouTube wouldn't have been sued into oblivion without the DMCA safe harbor? Without the DMCA, any website that could have possibly allowed for copyright infringement would never have existed in the United States. Slashdot comments that were copies of the article would likely have resulted in Slashdot being sued by the original content producer. Now at worst, they can get a takedown notice.

      I will admit that it is rather ironic that the DMCA allows companies to be unwittingly used as copyright infringement tools, but that any software which might be used in a similar manner is illegal.

  10. I don't know about you... by apodyopsis · · Score: 2, Insightful


    I don't know about you, but for me it says a lot that the mere fact that any law is being backed by a MPAA policy advisor makes me distrust it more.

  11. Perjury by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Perjury by the legal establishment and it's practitioners is given a nod and a wink. It is only perjury if you or I do it.

  12. Re:Praising the DMCA is going a bit far by apathy+maybe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And they are then free to resell, or even to give away your work. All that hard work and the bastards are just giving it away for free!

    Wait, maybe the GPL is about being free. (Free speech, and free beer. CentOS is the perfect example of the GPL in action. Even if RedHat already give away the source to everyone.)

    --
    I wank in the shower.
  13. illogical. by wickerprints · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The article contains a serious flaw in logic. Given the legal environment of the DMCA, if the internet we have now is a Good Thing, then how does that imply that the DMCA is the cause, without considering how much potentially better things could have been instead?

    This kind of false rationalization is neither legitimate news reporting, nor is it respectful of those who have fought against the abuses of a poorly conceived and implemented law.

    After all, it's a bit like saying that because my car got towed yesterday, I wasn't able to get into a car accident. That I had no car to wreck does not mean I am better off for having it towed--in fact, it is very probable the time and money I spent to retrieve it could have gone to something much more rewarding and useful.

  14. Sweet Irony by CuteSteveJobs · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sounds like the typical "I've done nothing wrong" diatribe of a man who refuses to admit a mistake despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary: http://www.google.com.au/search?q=bogus+dmca

    I'm not impressed, and since I'm outside of the US, I've a good mind to make a bogus DMCA complaint to Wired's Teleco and get the apologist's blog taken down.

  15. Re:"Journalism" Wired Style by Zencyde · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yes there is. It's called Sweden.

    --
    What day is it? Could you please tell me?
  16. Where Was the Democratic Process by florescent_beige · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The MPAA's Attaway, who calls himself the lobbying group's "old man" for his 33 years of service, recalls that the DMCA was a compromise from the start. "The ISPs wanted safe harbor provisions in return for their support for the anti-circumvention provisions, which was one of the major and most important compromises in this legislation," he says. "It's not perfect. But it's better than nothing."

    This MPAA lawyer speaks of a compromise between themselves and ISPs. As if they are the only parties involved.

    What about the 300 million actual human bodies that the politicians are supposed to represent? Attaway knows what the MPAA and the ISPs wanted. Does he have a clue what the actual human beings wanted? Did congress?

    Evidently the MPAA has successfully convinced Washington that those humans should be considered as "customers" and not "voters".

    --
    Equine Mammals Are Considerably Smaller
  17. Two laws. by h4rm0ny · · Score: 4, Insightful


    Trouble is, the DMCA is two laws rolled into one. On the one hand you have the way hosting sites such as Youtube are not held responsible for copyright violations of user-uploaded content so long as they immediately withdraw material on allegation of infringement. This is what the article is saying is responsible for current sites such as Youtube, MySpace and others. This is a supportable argument (i.e. you may or may not agree with it, but there is certainly a case to be argued). On the other hand, you have the restrictions on circumvention technology. An entirely distinct law that most people here would probably agree is far less supportable from the viewpoint of social good. Yet these two very different things have been rolled into one, probably to increase the chances of getting the latter part passed. This has the effect of making it much harder to evaluate or debate the DMCA law in the USA.

    --

    Aide-toi, le Ciel t'aidera - Jeanne D'Arc.
  18. Re:Praising the DMCA is going a bit far by NormalVisual · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I personally think we'd be best off just going back to the original terms that we had back in 1790. It provides copyright protection for a full third of an average artist's life, for crying out loud, and I believe it was a fair balance keeping 100% in spirit of what the Copyright Clause was trying to achieve. Why is it not enough to exclusively profit from a work for that long, and why is the artist's individual right to profit for the rest of his fricking life considered more beneficial than the right of society to benefit from that artist's work after he's had a reaonable chance to do so?

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