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Ubuntu Ports To ARM
nerdyH writes "Canonical will port Ubuntu Desktop Linux to the ARMv7 architecture. The announcement sets the stage for Intel to lose the traditional 'software advantage' that has enabled x86 to shrug off attacks from other architectures for the last 30 years. How long can it be before Microsoft responds with a Windows 7 port? I mean, x86 just can't do 'idle power' like ARM ... Nokia's N810 tablets can standby for several weeks, just like a cell phone, keeping you 'present' on IM, behind IPv4 NAT the whole time. The first Atom MIDs are standing by for 6-7 hours."
Uhm... so Ubuntu is a derivative of Debian, and Debian has supported ARM for like... forever. Ubuntu just hasn't followed suit until now.
Not to say this isn't significant. Just give Debian some credit.
http://mediagoblin.org/
Windows NT ran on Alpha Processors so yes versions of windows have been ported to other architectures. DEC_Alpha
I smoked pot once. But I DID NOT inhale. Will you hire me?
Windows NT has had versions on "IA-32, AMD64, MIPS R4000, Alpha, PowerPC, and Itanium", but mostly the earlier versions, like 3.1 and 3.51, with XP on Itanium.
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Not anymore. Intel sold the XScale division to Marvell in 2006. Since then, Intel has been without a good low-power processor. None of their x86 designs has come close to what a fully static ARM core can achieve in terms of battery life.
Who the heck wants to run Windows?
People who have clients or suppliers that use (the advanced features of) Microsoft Office. People who play indie video games or game mods (because consoles don't have mods). People who live in areas where the only banks use ActiveX for individual accounts (I've heard this is the case in parts of the Republic of Korea).
Correction: Intel didn't sell all of their ARM business, just the product lines relevant to PDAs, netbooks, etc. (And Intel is still doing the manufaturing on behalf of Marvell, so they will make some money.)
AMD had the Geode out first, which prompted Intel to counter with Atom and VIA to follow suit.
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
Nokia's N810, which is an ARM device, comes with Flash 9. Not some stripped down mobile version either, but the full thing.
You might have problems running x86 software on x86-64 operating systems on x86-64 CPUs. But many issues are specific to certain operating systems. Missing 64-bit browser plug-ins can be solved by running a 32-bit browser and 32-bit plugins. It's also possible to support 64-bit software on a 32-bit kernel (which could have prevented driver availability issues for those who insist on using 64-bit software when they don't need to use more than ~3 GB of RAM), but only OS X Leopard takes this approach.
Some operating systems don't have x86-64 implementations that make this easy. I like the approach used in Solaris and OS X; there are no separate x86-64 and x86 versions of either operating system. Solaris includes the x86 and x86-64 kernels and OS X Leopard uses a 32-bit kernel which can run 64-bit processes. They ship with 32- and 64-bit libraries, but most of the userland executables are 32-bit.
I own an N810 and this is such an exaggeration as to be patently false. Not even Nokia claims you can get that kind of battery life out of these.
An N810 can only go about 48 hours between each charge. And that's if the bluetooth and wifi radios are turned off and all programs are exited. If the battery is new, you might get up to three days.
If you have the wifi radio on and are idling on IM, I'd expect that you could maybe get 12 hours of infrequent use and even that might be pushing it.
When actively using the device (browsing the web, listening to a stream, etc), the CPU kicks in and you'll get between 4 and 6 hours of use depending on what you're doing.
No, what NatSemi had bought was the craptacular MediaGX line from Cyrix, which was subsequently bought by AMD. "Geode" with AMD means the GX1 (Which is the NatSemi version...), the GX2 (now branded "LX"...), and the NX (which is a rebadged Athlon XP+ at extreme low power...).
The NX is AMD's answer to Intel's Pre-Atom embedded stuff (and was a good one...)- but AMD doesn't seem to have an Atom answer...yet.
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Yeah, most current ARM cpus aren't much good for general computers (your run of the mill desktop or laptop). But don't forget that ARM was originally designed for use in Desktops, and derivatives of that design were for sale until a few months ago.
An ARM CPU could be great for a netbook or low power desktop -- the machines that currently use Intel's Atom. Multi-core ARM CPUs running >1GHz are on the way (or maybe they're already here, I haven't been keeping track), and they might easily have enough power (and power efficiency) for that task. Perhaps they'll be better suited than Atom.
The thing stopping non x86 platforms has always been software. FOSS avoids that problem -- if you have the source code then the program is only a compile away. Of course, Linux has long run on ARM CPUs, but open source programs weren't good enough substitues for what people wanted, so it didn't matter. Now, we may finally be approaching the point where people are willing to ditch their Windows, at least for simple tasks like the ones you'd do on netbook. Such an influential Linux distribution supporting ARM CPUs might finially make the platform viable.
Hell, perhaps a company planning an ARM based netbook asked Canonical to do this, and they saw the opportunity. This could be interesting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture#History
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iyonix_PC
Lots of people are getting mixed up, and/or saying "big deal Debian already supports it". ARM has a slightly confusing numbering scheme: ARM7, ARM9, ARM11, Cortex-A8 are processor models, whereas ARMv4, ARMv5, ARMv6, ARMv7 are their respective architecture versions.
Pretty much all current ARM devices are ARM9 or ARM11 based (smartphones, Nokia's internet tablets, etc). This means they are too old to run this :)
The Pandora, and other upcoming devices, are based on the Cortex-A8, an ARMv7 architecture processor and the most recent ARM currently generally available: this is what Ubuntu are targeting here.
Debian's ARM port is for any ARMv4t or higher currently, which includes ARM11, ARM9 and even ARM7TDMI. This is rather suboptimal for chips like the Cortex-A8 which have many, many more instructions available, so Ubuntu are indeed doing something different here.
ARM7 != ARMv7.
ARM7 is a family of cores. ARMv7 on the other hand is the latest ARM architecture version. The Cortex A8 and A9 are ARMv7 cores.
For example the Nokia N810 has a core from the ARM11 family, specifically ARM1136J. It is based on the ARMv6 architecture. The next Nokia device has been announced to be based on Texas Instrument's OMAP3 platform, which includes the new Cortex A8 (same as Pandora and Beagleboard).
After a release, Debian does not alter packages with the exception of security updates. It's an intended policy. If you want something fresher, go elsewhere or use Sid. Note however, that Debian Stable is likely to be very secure, comparatively.
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
I've been using Debian Sid as my home operating system for years. I'm well aware that they offer source packages; I've used them myself. Naturally, if you want to install a source package you need to compile it on your own computer. However, this is true of any distribution, regardless of its style of package management. The statement I was responding to was "the CPU will never, ever go idle, it will always be compiling!", which applies (with a bit of hyperbole) to source-based distributions like Gentoo, but not to primarily binary ones like Debian, the presence of source packages notwithstanding.
"The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
Does anyone have any idea what reference platform they are using to develop this and if there is a way for me to obtain it relatively cheaply?
My bets are on the beagle board as it is super cheap (and they have a posting on their front page about Canonical porting to arm7).
The beagle board is an awesome bang for the buck. I'm thinking of asking my work to grab one for me with the next digikey shipment (free shipping, woohoo).
"If you are going through hell, keep going." - Winston Churchill
But the Athlon uses twice the power as an Atom 230 and is far from twice as fast. It is true that an AMD "system" can compete with the current Atom but this is only because of the horrible chipset used with the Atom. Package an Atom in a better "system" (like the Asus EEE Box) and you can drop the max system power usage to 20w.
Comparing the performance of the Athlon to an Atom 330 is a better comparison as both CPUs use 8w. In this situation, the Atom overpowers the Athlon in almost every benchmark.
Currently, the saving grace of the Athlon is that there are plenty of different options available to diy builders. The Atom is only available with a motherboard - and it's soldered on. Want firewire?, more then 2Gigs RAM?, better video?, - you're out of luck. The Atom is an amazing CPU but the Atom offerings are severely limited.
You are confusing ARMv7 (which is the ISA of the current generation cortex CPUs (M3, R4, A8, A9) and the ARM7 (Which uses ARMv3).
Uhhhhhhhh, Gnash has been in the last three Ubuntu distros, and http://mojo.handhelds.org/ has compilations of Gnash, so you can indeed run Flash on ARM.
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3) if you want to stay connected with the net (IM presence, mail moniroring), battery life is 6-7 hours max. Just looking at it eats battery.
One of your apps is badly behaved then. I get days with email and VoIP (SIP) running on the N800. And the N810 is supposed to be better. Do you use the bundled mail and IM clients?