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Mars Phoenix Lander's Ovens Were Destined To Fail

RobertB-DC writes "The Phoenix mission to Mars' frigid polar regions was going to be tricky from the start, with only a few weeks to perform as much science as possible. Success depended on everything working right. But one of the mission's most frustrating glitches — the stuck doors on the TEGA ovens — could have been prevented with basic quality control on Earth. Nature is reporting that bad brackets were replaced by the manufacturer ... with identically bad brackets. The Planetary Society blog sums it up succinctly: 'Ouch. Ouch ouch ouch.'"

26 of 77 comments (clear)

  1. Design by commitee by linzeal · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This is what happens when too many people have their hands up the engineers and by extension the technicians' asses.

    1. Re:Design by commitee by causality · · Score: 3, Funny

      This is what happens when too many people have their hands up the engineers and by extension the technicians' asses.

      Sounds like a bunch of smelly hands.

      --
      It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education. - Einstein
    2. Re:Design by commitee by lysergic.acid · · Score: 2

      i'm pretty sure all NASA and DoD contractors are paid via cost-plus-award-fee contracts.

      so the problem isn't that they're being paid too little. if anything, they're being paid too much for too little work (and too little quality). if NASA contracts are handed out the same way that military contracts get handed out, then it is probably done through a corruption-filled old boy network negotiated by kickbacks and bribery. that kind of cronyism breeds incompetence as it destroys any hint of meritocracy or accountability.

  2. So ? by Fred_A · · Score: 5, Funny

    Aren't they covered by warranty ? Get them to replace them.

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    1. Re:So ? by TheLink · · Score: 5, Funny

      I think the main problem is when you ask for on site support.

      They'll look at you as if you came from another planet or something.

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    2. Re:So ? by confused+one · · Score: 3, Funny

      But they want you to pay the return shipping.

    3. Re:So ? by Sockatume · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Seriously, they should do this. Hold them to the same standards as a washing machine company. If a contractor screws up, they're going to pay for sending an engineer out there to fix the product. (And if they want him back, they can pay or that too.) If they don't want to do that, well, they can pay for a whole new mission. Then they're less likely to do things like skip diagnostics and fuck up multi-million dollar missions.

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      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    4. Re:So ? by Enter+the+Shoggoth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This reminds me of the the Apple iBook I have rotting in a draw somewhere, Apple acknowledged that the product had a known design fault, but all they did was replace the logicboard with an identical one, which of course would also fail, in my case I went through _six_ logicboards, two of them in the one go (the tech replaced it and it failed during testing so had to be replaced again before it was returned to me)

      What really amazes me about this is that it is legal. This is due (in my country at least) to corrupt politicians taking too many brown paper bags full of cash in return for winding back consumer protection laws... if a manufacturer acknowledges that there is a known _design_ fault and then continues to provide the faulty product they aught at the very least be told to replace the faulty product with a _redesigned_ one without someone having to go to the trouble of filing suit. Personally, in addition to this I think the executives should also be sent to pound-me-in-the-ass prison.

      --
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  3. Proverbial problem by owlnation · · Score: 2, Funny

    Ovens?

    Sounds like too many cooks were involved.

  4. Without reading the article... by 3seas · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...isn't this what happens when you gotta have it yesterday?

  5. Human space exploration. by slmouradian · · Score: 2, Insightful

    One more thing to add to my list why humans should be involved in space exploration, not just robots.. Perhaps this could be fixed if there was a human there?!

    1. Re:Human space exploration. by sjames · · Score: 2, Insightful

      One more thing to add to my list why humans should be involved in space exploration, not just robots.. Perhaps this could be fixed if there was a human there?!

      That's not a very good reason to send humans to Mars. For the difference in cost, we can send a dozen or so replacement probes before we even approach the cost of a manned mission.

      We would do well to expand our orbital presence first. We need better than chemical propulsion and we need life support systems that can run as a closed system. It's much better to test that in orbit where a failure means we evacuate and try again rather than on a Mars mission where failure means transmit your last words.

      Once we have a significant orbital presence, that also gives us the ability to build and launch the Mars vehicle in orbit. That is, only the lander portion need be designed to operate in an atmosphere at all and only needs to handle landing and takeoff in Mars' gravity. The Earth-mars transport vehicle can be entirely un-aerodynamic and need only support it's own thrust.

  6. My Mother, NASA oven test engineer . . . by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 5, Funny

    From the blog:

    Boynton and his team had noticed, on a test version of TEGA, that the brackets at the bottom of this cover were just a hair's width too big, and as a result obstructed the doors. They sent revised designs for the cover to the manufacturer, Honeybee Robotics of New York. New parts were delivered and installed. But Honeybee had made the new parts using the original flawed designs -- and nobody in Tucson checked them. "They should've caught it and we should've caught it, but neither of us did," says Boynton, ruefully.

    . . . which is why NASA needs to hire my mother as oven test engineer. Not only would she have noticed "hair's width" difference, she would have taken every opportunity she had to complain to everyone she knows, and even total strangers about it.

    On the other hand, once the door problem got fixed, she would find something else wrong with it, and the damn thing would probably never get off the ground.

    --
    Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
    1. Re:My Mother, NASA oven test engineer . . . by slmouradian · · Score: 2

      yes, but it's very hard to ACCURATELY estimate the size of the oven in the quite large temperature variations on Mars.. Don't forget the oven does expand and contract every day/night, and every time it warms itself up.

    2. Re:My Mother, NASA oven test engineer . . . by pavon · · Score: 3, Informative

      The lander wasn't made by NASA, JPL, or anyone like that. It was designed and assembled by the University of Arizona, who naturally had to get most of the parts fabbed by other folks.

  7. Human Mars mission by wfstanle · · Score: 3, Informative

    You are forgetting something ...

    Some plans for a manned Mars mission were based on there not being a return trip to Earth. Anyone who went on such a mission would be marooned there on purpose. It's not a kind of trip I would like to take.

    1. Re:Human Mars mission by Toonol · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think there would be no shortage of volunteers. And by that, I mean, millions of volunteers, including all astronauts, and everybody that wants to be one.

      I'm kind of surprised to read a poster on slashdot write they wouldn't volunteer for a one-way mission.

    2. Re:Human Mars mission by KORfan · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Just run an ad in the paper saying something like this

      "Men wanted for hazardous journey. Low wages, bitter cold, long hours of complete darkness. Safe return doubtful. Honour and recognition in event of success."

      Evidence suggests you'll get more volunteers than you can use.

  8. Amazing by RAMMS+EIN · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ``Nature is reporting that bad brackets were replaced by the manufacturer... with identically bad brackets.''

    Isn't that just purely amazing? A manufacturer who _knows_ the component is bad (because it needs replacement), and then replaces it with ... the same thing with the same faults. That's just unethical. I hope they are suitably punished.

    Also, you would have thought that, after sending a component back for replacement, the replacement would be tested to see if the problem had been fixed.

    I just don't have words anymore.

    --
    Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
    1. Re:Amazing by NekSnappa · · Score: 2, Informative

      As the saying goes. "Never attribute to malice what can be explained with incompetence."
      This could well have been an issue of poor configuration management. Since the article says they used the same drawings. I imagine that even if their models were updated if those changes weren't propagated up through the drawings and the machining files used on the fabrication floor.
      So the net result would be an identical part being fabbed.

      --
      I want to shoot the messenger!
  9. Re:NASA might be tampering with photos by Fastolfe · · Score: 4, Informative

    Off-topic, and the author is an idiot. The rovers' cameras do not necessarily take pictures using the standard red-green-blue colors that we perceive. Depending on what filters were used (for scientific reasons), if you want a "full color" image for humans to appreciate, you have to choose or synthesize non-RGB channels to form an RGB image. The blue tab, for example, on the color calibration target is also very bright in the infrared, so if you use an infrared image as your red channel, what should be blue appears to be pink. All of this perfectly normal and completely expected by everyone that knows how this stuff works. Stop being a silly conspiracy theorist and apply some rational thought and a tiny bit of research.

    http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/hoagland/mars_colors.html
    http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/spotlight/spirit/a12_20040128.html

  10. documentation by wkk2 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Everything needs a version number and serial number.

  11. Re:haha by S.O.B. · · Score: 3, Funny

    Maybe it was the Martian government trying to protect local jobs from foreign workers.

    --
    Some of what I say is fact, some is conjecture, the rest I'm just blowing out my ass...you guess.
  12. manglement by sohp · · Score: 2, Informative

    Most of the comments so far are focusing on the oven door problems. Naturally, because that's what's mentioned in the summary and no one RTFAs.

    Anyway, the *much* more interesting revelation is that after the problems came up, the directive came all the way down from the top of NASA directing the mission scientists to change their plans. "At the end of June, word came down that the Phoenix team was to treat its next TEGA sample as its last, and to go after a sample of rock-hard ice before it did anything else. The Tucson team had lost its autonomy." After that, the team blew at least a month trying to meet this directive, and missed out on doing some of the basic science they wanted to do, just so NASA heads could trumpet feel-good publicity about having detected ice with Phoenix.

    1. Re:manglement by sohp · · Score: 2

      That *might* be true, but if it were, you'd think they'd have been asked to conduct some real science, not focus on the golly-gee-whiz-we-found-ice aspect.

  13. Re:Hm... by tftp · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yes, it is a horrible engineering. However these are one-off designs that never existed before and will never exist after. There is no legacy to build upon, and there is no "Release 1" to learn from. The very first release flies the mission, and if there are bugz ... too bad. To confound the problem, much of this work is probably done by scientists and not by engineers; that's why if the gap between doors is above zero it's all good to go. An experienced mechanical engineer would consider thermal expansion, free play in all pivot points, and other things - but first she'd try to increase the gap to some reasonable size, so that none of those secondary effects could affect the mission.