Shifting Apps To ARM Chips Could Save Laptop Batteries

An anonymous reader writes "When is an Intel PC not an Intel PC? When it moves applications such as Internet browsing and email on to an ARM processor because it can get longer battery life. And according to a story at EE Times, this hybrid Intel-ARM processor approach is being taken by PC makers as prominent as Dell. The problem for Intel: Why would you switch out of 'all-day' mode and use the Intel processor? The problem for ARM: lacking support from Microsoft for Windows; the applications it runs for the PC have to do so under Linux."

Comments

Not a problem

[MadMidnightBomber]

The problem for ARM: lacking support from Microsoft for Windows; the applications it runs for the PC have to do so under Linux.

Not a problem for everyone. I've already got an ARM-based Linux running on a NSLU32 NAS head - 32Mb RAM, 32 Mb flash. If I could get a lightweight laptop with a modern ARM chip, I would be over the moon.

Re:Not a problem

[palegray.net]

I completely agree. I haven't run Windows on my personal machines (outside of a virtualize instance) in five years. Windows software simply isn't a limiting factor for me, or for a lot of folks who want netbook-style computing devices.

Re:Not a problem

[EvilRyry]

WINE is just Win32 for POSIXy platforms. It's not able to rewrite x86 binary for ARM. You could perhaps take Windows software compiled for an ARM processor and run it, but that kind of defeats the point of using Linux for portability in the first place. KVM/Xen also do not rewrite binary for other architectures. QEMU could do it, but performance and battery life would drop dramatically.

Re:Not a problem

[rbanffy]

About 10 years ago I had an IBM z-50. It was about the size of one of the larger Eee's and sported a MIPS processor. At that time (with late 90s battery and display technology) it offered a decent computer (I made it run NetBSD later in its life) with a 10 hour battery life.

A decent laptop built around one of these low-power processors could last a week on a single charge and a big enough battery.

As for desktops, how many ARM cores, FPUs, vector units and cache can be put on a Core i7 die?

Re:Not a problem

[Duradin]

Have you used Windows Mobile? That's something I reserve for inflicting on only my worst enemies and only as a last resort. It's the Jack Bauer option of OSs.

And this is how Linux will win.

[B5_geek]

And this is how Linux will win. Not with a bang but a whimper. Embedded appliances, dedicated purpose applications, and multi-platform compatibility.

Firefox, Thunderbird, and (hopefully) soon KDE.

MS users who don't know any better, will win this for us.

Geeks like us have already dominated the server-side of the Linux equation, now fools will win the desktop for us.

Re:And this is how Linux will win.

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

True; but WinCE is pretty sharply dissimilar to Windows proper. MS has put a good deal of effort into making it look somewhat windowish; but it remains an alien freak. Similar enough to make you fall into Windows habits, odd enough to constantly frustrate those habits.

Honestly, an appropriately skinned version of Linux would probably be more familiar to most users than would WinCE.

Hybrid machine just like Acorn Computers

[SimonTheSoundMan]

Reminds me of the days when Acorn Computers were around with their RISCPC - A machine that was ARM powered, but you could also attach an x86 processor.

This is so 1990's!

Good but..

[LWATCDR]

Frankly I would love an ARM based notebook except for just a few issues.
1. Flash. Like it or not Flash is everywhere and I have not seen a Linux ARM version.
2. Java. I need it and JavaFX could be a nice alternative to Silverlight/Moonlight.

I see Flash as the big issue for most people. I would love to see ARM back on the "desktop" even if it is on the laptop. A ARM with a good GPU really would be a nice netbook system.

Re:Good but..

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

Flash 7 is already available for Linux Arm(see Nokia N770, and possibly Chumby), but it is an OEM licenced embedded thing, not just a download(if you look, Adobe is quite clear on the fact that desktop/laptop flash is free as in beer; but embedded flash very much isn't). Adobe seems to have plans to improve Flash on newer Arm chips, so I suspect that this issue will improve with time.

Re:Good but..

[ozmanjusri]

Frankly I would love an ARM based notebook except for just a few issues. 1. Flash. Like it or not Flash is everywhere and I have not seen a Linux ARM version. 2. Java. I need it and JavaFX could be a nice alternative to Silverlight/Moonlight.

Then put your name down for one of these.

ARM licensed Java from Sun years ago, and include hardware acceleration for Java apps via Jazelle. In addition, Adobe have said they will have a version Flash 10 for ARM sometime this year. So get your wallet out.

At $199, these netbooks won't cost you and arm and a leg...

ARM notebook

[ChristTrekker]

Funny...I read the story and was going to ask on this thread, "Where could I get an ARM-based laptop to run Linux on?" All day on a battery would be fantastic.

Does it matter still ?

[obarthelemy]

I'm wondering if, the the overall scheme of things, the price we pay for the x86-ness of Intel and AMD's CPUs is that high. All their CPUs are basically RISC things, with a very optimized x86 compatibility layer running on top. Is that layer that expensive performance-wise ?

The CPU is not the biggest consumer

[Anonymous Coward]

The display uses far more power than the CPU, so the benefit of adding a second low-power CPU will only be realized with a different display technology that has much lower power consumption for a static image.

Re:Jack Bauer Option

[Anonymous Coward]

"Have you used Windows Mobile? That's something I reserve for inflicting on only my worst enemies and only as a last resort. It's the Jack Bauer option of OSs."

That is an insult to Jack Bauer. He is competent and works 24 hours a day.

But only one day a year.

Darwine already does this

[DrYak]

WINE is just Win32 for POSIXy platforms. It's not able to rewrite x86 binary for ARM.

Indeed, *wine* doesn't do it itself. But nothing prevents you from running a separate layer to do the translation.

QEMU has a Linux-on-Linux mode, where it doesn't emulate a full blown virtual PC, it only runs the application targeting a foreign architectures inside the emulator and passes along the calls to the actual native OS and libraries.

Darwine has been doing exactly this to run x86 Win32 application on PPC Mac OS X using a combination of Wine and QEMU. It should be possible to build a similar stack to run x86 Win32 application on ARM Linux.

But don't expect much performance from it on an ARM netbook. It will probably OK to run a couple of simple tools. It won't probably work with games or other more resource intensive application.
But gamers aren't the machine's main audience anyway, the ARM netbooks are targetted at people who just want Web, Email & Chat, with the longest possible battery life.

Although, you probably could get better Win32 performance (at the cost of battery life) with dual-chip machine (like DELL Lattitude ON) or using accelerator boards if the ARM netbooks has some standard connector (like Xpress card).