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DirectX 10 Coming To Linux and Mac
twickline writes "Jeremy White posted the 2009 roadmap for Crossover, and wrote, 'We've just shipped a lot of those "under the hood" improvements for games out in CrossOver Games 7.2. We're really pushing Direct X 9 support pretty far along, and getting ready to move on Direct X 10. ... In addition to our normal work of broadening and deepening our application support in Wine, we're going to try to dramatically improve the CrossOver GUI itself. First, the Linux version will get a fresh new look. But both versions are going to get an interface that we hope will bring the power of the Compatibility Center right into the installation view. The key idea is to make it easier to distill the gathered wisdom on unsupported applications and make it far easier to use.'"
The only reason I still have a Windows PC at home is for gaming. DirectX 10 support is a step closer to me being able to get rid of it. Can't come soon enough, and I'm happy to pay for it if that's what it takes.
With Wine under the LGPL (making much of CrossOver LGPL) and CodeWeavers supporting Wine development, this will probably result in standard Wine also supporting DirectX 10 soon. I can also see this becoming a DirectX 10 to OpenGL wrapper to provide DirectX 10 features on XP. Both of these would be nice.
Surely with the likes of IBM, Apple, EA, Sun (shudder), Valve, ATI, Nvidia, all teaming up, they could create a cross platform API, and all appropriate documentation, programming plugins etc that will make programming for it easier than DirectX?
I mean, it's not the wildest concept ever. Clean up OpenGL, make it simpler if required. Add Open sound, add openinput, and voila!
If it's simple to code for, well documented and supports all of the latest features, and is downloadable as a library for all of the major windows' and *nix's it will make life easier for gamers, developers and other open source advocates.
It could be like java in concept, but more like directx in function. (ie it works)
The good news: increased base of support for games.
The bad news: Codeweavers makes much noise about their "supported games". But what they don't make explicitly clear is that these games are, for the most part, games that have been reported to work. Don't take my word for it, go and check. Out of 174 games listed on that page, one is "known not to work", 149 get an "honourable mention" (meaning they've been reported to work, but they are not supported by Codeweavers), two get a bronze, and 22 get a silver. So that's 174 games listed, and just 24 of those are supported if there are issues.
Rather disingenuous, really, to have that information tucked away in a pop-up tooltip that only appears when you hover over the medal. I wish them luck, but I can't help but feel that they need to be a little bit more open with their customers.
It also doesn't help that that list hasn't been updated since July ... eight months. Not exactly confidence inspiring, alas.
Direct X 10 coming to Linux and Mac falsely implies that MS would be making it possible for Direct X 10 to be run natively on Linux or Mac. A much more accurate title (though one that many would read and say "who cares" without clicking on the link) would be "Crossover Games to support Direct X 10.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
Is this for Wine or for CrossOver? Because CrossOver isn't free, is it?
It would be nice if this were to be ported to Windows XP and take away the only reason why I would ever consider Vista/7
The last time I played a game using Crossover, it was in DX7, not 9, so I don't know how they can claim that's the case. For those still reading, it was CS:Source and Battlefield 2. Both looked truly horrific compared to playing on Windows and had poor framerates despite being run on a 9600GT.
And then there's Punkbuster support. Until they can get that working 100%, there's no point at all because you end up getting blacklisted so that money you spent buying the game is wasted as your CD Key is unusable on any PB server.
I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either. - Scott Adams
The name tells it all
Direct Xtermination 10
I love the Wine project.
I have seen it mature to where it is amazingly able to reproduce Windows (bugs and all!) which is NO SMALL FEAT.
I've installed Crossover Office for someone and seen it able to run Office perfectly.
I just wish in all of that it was able to run Rogue Squadron, an old Windows 98 game because that is really the only game I miss.
But I suppose Rogue Squadron is too much of an oddball; it's old and probably relies on some undocumented jazz in Windows 98...
I don't know the meaning of the word 'don't' - J
I have not seen anybody say this yet on the thread, but wine is soooo good. Well done the wine team!!!! Great Job!!! (Very grateful as a linux user) For anybody who has not tried it , it is truly fantastic. I have had it running office 2003 under Linux with out any problems. It is so good it could be mistaken as MS office for Linux. It also usually runs all those little odd "shareware" windows apps you downloaded for free as well. In the last year it has improved a great amount. I would have said that two-three years ago it was a play thing, but since it hit V1.0 it is a seriously useful app. The one thing, I wish it had (apart from more mopping up of unimplemented function) is a better integration in to the Linux desktop. i.e. autorunning CDs , gnome recognising exe icons and displaying them. Fantastic job wine team!!! PS along the same lines has anybody seen www.reactos.org , this is also an amazing wine based project.
When one uses free software there is no need to use WINE for M$ libraries. Once this gets going M$ will be able to sue the WINE project and it will cease to exist. Then the people will have no choice with their non-free software addiction but to use M$ Windoze.
--
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Friends do assist M$ addicted friends in committing suicide.
The first steps into DX10 have already been taken in Wine. I have been following the Wine project for long enough to confidently say that even though development has greatly increased over the past two years to the point that Wine can actually be considered a real alternative to using Windows, but I'm sure that that games will only be approaching playability sometime near the next Debian release.
The story should be labeled "HOLY CRAP! Windows Games are Playable in Linux with DirectX 9!"
I play all my Steam games and WoW, BF2, EVE... All in DX9 with various tweaks in the registry.
Either that or "accidentally" dereference null a lot more in your Linux and OSX drivers. Or both. I wouldn't put both past Microsoft either.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
As long as unmodified OpenGL is still in use, *nix will always still be a step behind Windows in gaming. OpenGL and DirectX are simply common APIs for accessing features on graphics cards. OpenGL is no longer a good representation for how these cards operate, and is thus not a good API for programming them.
The question is what is the best way to keep up-to-date with hardware features in a market that is driven by external forces. Do you sit and wait for phoronix to update OpenGL and then try and convince hardware/driver designers and game developers to use it? Do you depend on hardware designers to create their own extensions and developers to write several code paths for different types of cards? Do you create your own extensions to try and unify the vendor extensions?
All of those options sound like a constant game of catch-up to me. On the other hand, consider if *nix adopted a driver framework that better matched the capabilities of today's cards (like Gallium3D), one which DirectX would just be a thin layer to wrap around - practically a native interface, rather than just accessible via the WINE stack, wrapped around a less featurefull interface.
Yes, you would have to update when Microsoft updates in order to keep up, but since the hardware itself is in lockstep with DirectX today, you would need to update anyway. These APIs are usually out for a while before games requiring them are released, and the hardware companies (the ones writing the drivers) will be in talks with Microsoft long before that. By making life easier for driver developers and game programs, you wouldn't be spending as much time playing catch-up because they would be doing more of the work for you.
Whoosh!
Great news! Now, does Crossover run on Windows XP as well?
Aw, come on! I just spent the weekend fighting with Windows to get it to cooperate with Linux in a dual-booting scenario, with countless unpluggings and repluggings of SATA cables and partition rearrangings and no less than two Windows reinstalls, all for gaming purposes, just to see THIS?!?
Nah, seriously, this should be pretty sweet once it comes to fruition. Assuming it also brings with it further compatibility enhancements to other games (I really should open a ticket that Audiosurf seemed to stop working with a recent Steam update...). "Mad" "props" to the Crossover and WINE teams!
Demanding constant attention will only lead to attention.
I got Crossover when they had their 'free download' day a while back. I couldn't get Spore OR Neverwinter Nights 2 working. Epic fail. How about you guys shore up DX9 support before going hog wild on DX10? Then I might actually buy your product.
Not gonna happen. OpenGL had it's chance, and lost out to DirectX's clear superiority. And it's not like the really big guns, like id and others, didn't TRY to get OpenGL and non-Windows platforms, to work out.
If you want to game, you need to run Windows. It really is that simple. I find it a shame that bitter and irrational hatred prevents people from just learning how to use the OS, and the scant few (free, even) apps to make it a very secure system. Oh well, zealotry does terrible things to a mind.
Considering that barely any games run perfectly under WINE without some sort of manual tweaking, and that most games don't run acceptably well even with, is it really time to be pushing for DX10 support?
A brief overview of some of the games I'm likely to play, and their compatibility (I define "tweaking" to mean "must install Windows DLLs and/or make registry/settings changes." In other words, won't run out-of-box):
1) Warcraft III: Works playably if DirectX is disabled (force to OpenGL) but umpteen issues make it an unpleasant experience. For example, don't ALT-TAB, WINE will destroy all textuers.
2) Supreme Commander: No audio without significant tweaking. Unplayable without graphical tweaks. When you get it to run, graphical glitching, inability to select higher quality modes, almost unplayable performance.
3) Left 4 Dead, Team Fortress 2, any other Source game: Runs unplayably slowly. A patch exists to resolve the issue at the expense of graphical glitching.
4) F.E.A.R. 2: Will not run without graphical tweaks, then it works with acceptable performance and no graphical issues. Mouse cursor may be stuck on-screen, issues with audio mixing makes voices hard to hear.
5) Natural-Selection, other Half-Life 1 (GoldSrc) games: Microphone quality issues, random crashing, host of other minor bugs, but generally works well.
6) BioShock: Frequent crashing, severe graphical issues, requires extensive tweaking to run, essentially unplayable.
So here we are, six games that cover OpenGL (Half-Life 1), DX7 (Warcraft III), DX9 (SupCom, Source games, BioShock, FEAR 2, etc.). Some like BioShock can run under DX10, but their unplayability under DX9 makes that moot.
Out of these six games that I'd like to play, only three are playable without recompiling WINE. Of those, only one (HL1-based games) work without tweaks, and it's still not perfect.
So, of my six games, none work perfectly, and only half can actually be played. And as a gamer playing a game for the first time, assuming I can even get it to work under WINE, I'll never really be sure if I'm seeing the game the way it was meant to be played, or if I'm experiencing some audio or graphical problems that I don't recognize (I wouldn't know if it wasn't supposed to be like that).
And they want to move on to DirectX 10 support? Damn it, how about you fix EXISTING APIs before moving on to new ones? Warcraft III is a DirectX 7 game, and runs so slowly by default that you have to switch it to OpenGL! If DirectX 7 still isn't working, why bother with DirectX 10?