Nintendo Penalizing Homebrew Users?

An anonymous reader writes "Bricked your Wii? Not only will Nintendo charge you for the repair, they will now add an additional fee if they detect any homebrew software. 'Should Nintendo have to pay to repair hacked Wiis under warranty? Maybe not, but they have no (moral) right to gouge customers out of spite for having the HBC installed. This actually poses a technical dilemma for us with BootMii. As currently designed, BootMii looks for an SD card when you boot your Wii, and if it finds the card and the right file, it will execute that file. Otherwise, there's no way to tell it's installed.'"

Comments

Is this allowable by law in Europe?

[lordofthechia]

Doesn't Europe have the equivalent of the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act ?

Re:Is this allowable by law in Europe?

[lordofthechia]

For the uninformed (mods, looking at you), among other things, the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act (unless I've mixed up Supreme Court Cases) puts the burden on the manufacturer to prove that an aftermarket part or enhancement caused the defect for which the product needs to be serviced.

The homebrew channel would fall under this and since it is easy to remove be no cause for voiding a warranty (like Ford refusing an engine repair because you installed an aftermarket radio...).

This would be like

[Norsefire]

Microsoft charging more if they discover Ubuntu on a separate partition.

Re:This would be like

[LordKronos]

unless you consider the Zune a computer (which you can).

Yeah, but if you've install Ubuntu on a separate partition on your Zune:
1) Congrats
2) Why?

Rightly So

[cfriedt]

I do understand German, and this receipt says that the internal software (i.e. firmware) was modified.

Realistically, if someone voids their warranty by modifying the firmware on a device, regardless of whether it was done directly by the user or by the homebrew software, then they should expect to pay to have that repaired.

Why? because it takes time. Usually companies have very specific procedures for quickly re-flashing using their existing boot firmware. However, if that boot firmware is modified (i.e. the device is 'bricked') then that procedure needs to be changed. In this case, the engineer would need to 'hack' their own device to get it up to usable standards again (i.e. 'unbricked').

In the non-wii-world (i.e. reality), people that fix things also need to be paid adequately.

This customer should be happy that their bricked wii was even serviceable and that they weren't forced to cough up an extra 40€ to buy a brand-new Wii for 250€.

Re:Rightly So

[KanjiMonster]

Actually, in Germany you still have warranty even when modifying the device, as long as the defect wasn't caused by the modification. The problem is proving that, and doing an expert testimonial costs easily more than the repair itself. But if it proves that the defect wasn't your fault, then Nintendo has to honor the warranty *and* pay for the testimonial.

You doubt. Never a good sign

[SmallFurryCreature]

I do speak german and softwarehack is NOT a german word, it is a borrowed word and therefor means the same thing as you would expect it to. Never DOUBT. CHECK!

Your entire argument starts to look shakey because you asumed.

You then go on to claim that it is a seperate line. It is not, it is a wrap around of the previous line. Failure two.

You then go on to make your final claim. The email being fake. 2 strikes, is the third a hit? We already know you leap to conclusions, so might you have struck out completly?

The email indeed seems suspicious. The english in it is piss poor and that is coming from me. Could there be a reason? Nintendo is a japanese company, could we be dealing with an advanced case of engrish here? Maybe someone low in the hierachy whose native language is not english went outside the official channels to send this email?

It is important to remember that many internal emails would make any language teacher cry like a britney spears fan. I have seen worse.

The grammar itself is not enough to label the email a fake. That it came through an anonymous source, well that doesn't mean anything.

Finally, the wording. It isn't very proffesional but I am sure we all remember the halloween documents. If Balmer can throw chairs why can't a nintendo flunky send out this email?

So, two strikes and one questionable. I think you put to much faith in proffesionalism in individual employees. While I have no proof this email is wrong, it being stupid and badly written does not guarantee it as a fake. Really, read more leaked documents.

Re:You doubt. Never a good sign

[Hognoxious]

I do speak german and softwarehack is NOT a german word

Thought so, it's nowhere near long enough.

Is it so hard to understand?

[abigsmurf]

The warranty states that you cannot modify the system yourself either by opening up the console or installing custom firmware. By not following these conditions you're voiding agreed conditions. It's not illegal or immoral (gotta love the irony of accusing Nintendo of that in this case), you go against the contracted conditions, the contract is void.

If firmware has been modified they may not be able to use the utilities they have to detect faults or may not be able restore it as easily. It could take extra time and require extra effort.

It's hard enough giving support to customers when you know the software on their systems, let alone when they've got a modification which could be doing god knows what.

Re:Is it so hard to understand?

[abigsmurf]

Except that's not true (even if the act did apply in Germany):

One condition of a full warranty under that act:

"may not exclude or limit consequential damages for a breach of any written or implied warranty on the product, unless the exclusion or limitation conspicuously appears on the face of the warranty"

And in very prominent text on the standard Nintendo Hardware warranty (their caps, not mine):

"THIS WARRANTY SHALL NOT APPLY IF THIS PRODUCT: (a) IS USED WITH PRODUCTS NOT SOLD OR LICENSED BY NINTENDO (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, NON-LICENSED GAME ENHANCEMENT AND COPIER DEVICES, ADAPTERS, AND POWER SUPPLIES); (b) IS USED FOR COMMERCIAL PURPOSES (INCLUDING RENTAL); (c) IS MODIFIED OR TAMPERED WITH; (d) IS DAMAGED BY NEGLIGENCE, ACCIDENT, UNREASONABLE USE, OR BY OTHER CAUSES UNRELATED TO DEFECTIVE MATERIALS OR WORKMANSHIP; OR (e) HAS HAD THE SERIAL NUMBER ALTERED, DEFACED OR REMOVED."

That condition stands out clearly on the warranty ( http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/manuals/warrantytext_eng.jsp ) which itself is fairly short and easy to understand.

Re:Sorry, no deal

[EdIII]

There ain't enough money in the WORLD!

Really? Seriously?

A lot of people say that (and I hate MS as much as anybody), but if I was offered even the insult of $1,000,000 USD to install Windows 7 .............. I have a feeling that there will be a few machines with Windows 7 on it.

Then I would hire a few dozen Japanese hotties with pig-tails and school girl outfits to do all of my actual work on other machines and I would just have to *suffer* through it. At least when I get pissed off at the Windows 7 machine when it starts screwing up (inevitably of course) I can have a bunch of my "employees" come in sucking lollipops to give me my "tech support".

Ohhhhh, and I am sure some of that $$$$ will be used to buy several well placed poles in my office......

" but they have no (moral) right to gouge"

[Anita Coney]

Anyone has the right to charge whatever price they want for any product or service they are selling. If you don't like it, don't pay it. It's as simple as that.

Yeah, I know you'll mod me down for this, it seems to happen every time I point out an utterly obvious truth.