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Minor Damage Found On Space Shuttle
The BBC is reporting on minor damage to the space shuttle Atlantis revealed by a 10-hour inspection in orbit. On the shuttle's right side, near where the wing joins the body, inspection revealed a 21" (53cm) line of chips in the tiles that make up the vehicle's heat shield. "...more analysis by engineers would determine whether a 'focused inspection' was needed in that specific area. If so, astronauts would use sensors to determine the exact depth of the damage to the heat shield tiles. NASA has placed the space shuttle Endeavour on stand-by to rescue the crew of Atlantis if they are endangered." The crew couldn't shelter on the ISS in case of trouble, because their orbit is higher and on a different inclination.
Roger that.
FWIW, you can get a lot of mission info while it happens, even if you don't have satellite TV - http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/index.html
Pathological kinda promises Path + Logical - but instead, you get stuck with pathetic.
i guess it's not just dropping to another altitude. it's about changing the orbital plane, for which they don't have enough fuel.
More info here: http://spaceflightnow.com/shuttle/sts125/090512fd2/index5.html
"And Scooter, also I've got some good news about the tile damage that we saw on the starboard chine area earlier today," astronaut Alan Poindexter radioed from mission control shortly after 8 p.m.
"Oh, I'm looking forward to that. Go ahead," replied shuttle commander Scott "Scooter" Altman.
"It turns out that a focussed inspection of that area on the starboard chine is not going to be required," Poindexter reported.
"All right, you've got some happy EVA campers on that," Altman said.
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So what makes you such an expert?
Nasa experts have looked into all of these issues and potential solutions.
A mere couple of hundred miles is not a problem (you do know how fast the shuttle flies don't you?) Orbital mechanics is the problem. The fuel required for the shuttle to change orbits would weigh too much for it to get off the ground in the first place.
The risks have been very carefully considered, with the mission ruled out of safety grounds for a long time. Yes, they are pushing the risks on this mission but having a back up shuttle on the pad ready to lift off in three days (you do know about this don't you?) mitigates some of the risks. That together with other changes they have made have kept the risks of a catastrophic failure below the limit set for every mission.
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I read some article that said it was the latter -- putting it into a suicide path into the ocean.
See this AP article:
The latter. The photos and laser scans made of the chips have been made with an inspection boom which is now carried on the shuttle to make these inspections post Columbia.
Normally (again post Columbia) the shuttle does a back flip when arriving at the ISS so that dinks can be photographed by the ISS. On this trip, this obviously isn't possible.
Oh and past shuttle flights have had far far worse damage than this which is minor.
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I think the best solution would be if Atlantis could be brought back by autopilot. If the damage is marginal (that is they THINK it might destroy the shuttle but are not sure) then bringing it back unmanned would give you the possibility (if the damage is survivable) of recouping your billion dollar plus investment.
Won't work. The landing spots are generally near the takeoff spots. The takeoff spots were located so if it blows up on takeoff, the parts rain down on the dolphins and whales. Unfortunately (?) when it comes in to land, it arrives from the opposite direction, and no one selected landing sites that are empty to the west. Unfortunately gets a ? mark because back in the 70s when the shuttle was going to do everything for everyone, everywhere, it was occasionally claimed it would be able to land on commercial runways... so if you're coming in a bit short, just land at colorado international airport. That, along with most of the vehicles abilities, was all cut during development to save money.
The astronauts may have lobbied to keep NASA from giving the shuttles the ability to land themselves (or via ground control) in an attempt to keep pilots from being made irrelevant. (Throwback to test-pilot days I guess).
Based on the faulty assumption that all pilots do is keep it straight and level and wait as patiently as the plane lands. The whole point of decades of training for airline pilots and astronauts is for them to fully understand each little bit of the A/C and how to work when it breaks. They know their vehicle like a kernel hacker knows his kernel.
So, say the exhaust temperature of one APU is fluctuating. If the computer could "do something" to fix it, it would. The humans job is to invent new ideas of troubleshooting and fixing. Flip that switch see what happens, try this maneuver. The stuff the Apollo 13 guys did is not amazing or unlikely or lucky, despite what the general public thinks, it is in fact exactly what they were supposed to do...
Think of that Canadian pilot whom invented a way to put a jetliner in a slip to lose altitude to land at an abandoned military field when the plane ran out of gas because of metric/imperial issues.
Thats why you have humans onsite, in the loop.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
buy Powerball tickets, because those kinds of odds are nearly as good as winning
I wish that were true, but NASA's estimate on heat shield damage is 1 in 221. Two in a row are unlikely, but not unimaginable.
Thanks for that, Mr $0.02, that made me smile :-)
Daveime, no I'm not an expert but I do understand the laws of physics and have read up on this. Some of what you say is correct, but a lot isn't.
A small amount of fuel could be used to get the shuttle to visit the ISS. Unfortunately, this would be in a very elliptical orbit so they would only be able to (very) briefly wave through the window as they flew past each other at a very large differential speed before ploughing into the Earth in an unfortunately bright fireball.
To get to the same altitude as the ISS (keeping the orbit circular) requires dropping by 210km and speeding up by 200m/s. Not in itself a great requirement on fuel. The problem is that the orbit inclinations are so different (HST is 28.5 degrees, ISS is 51.6 degrees). To make this change requires something like a 3000m/s speed change sideways (this calc is only order of magnitude accurate). This requires a lot of fuel.
As others have stated, the current design of the shuttle has some major faults. Not being on the top of the rocket being one of them. This is not news and has been known for a long time and yes it has been taken into account in the next design (which isn't a shuttle at all).
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