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FCC's Duplicity On BPL Revealed

eldavojohn writes "Ars has a summary of the curious events surrounding the death of broadband over power lines (BPL). We've discussed BPL's trials and advances here many times. The Federal Communications Commission's go-ahead was halted last year by a federal court, after a suit by the American Radio Relay League over claims of unacceptable radio interference from BPL. The DC Court of Appeals judge noted, 'There is little doubt that the [FCC] deliberately attempted to exclude from the record evidence adverse to its position.' The ARRL's FOIA request to obtain non-redacted documents finally bore fruit under the Obama administrations more open FOIA guidelines. The ARRL's preliminary analysis of the released documents point out a few critical areas where the FCC redacted data that is clearly adverse to the claims of BPL proponents. By rights, this ought to lay BPL to rest once and for all." A story at Broadband Reports notes that BPL is dying on its own, as most of the vendors who had been testing it "have since moved on to promote smart electrical grid functionality."

26 of 97 comments (clear)

  1. Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind BPL by Jerrry · · Score: 4, Informative

    BPL isn't really (and never was) about delivering Internet service over electric lines. It was geared more towards smart power meters that the utilities could read remotely rather than sending an army of meter readers out to every house in the country once a month to read the meters.

  2. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by pe1rxq · · Score: 5, Informative

    You don't need much bandwidth to read out a few digits....

    The 'B' in BPL stands for Broadband, which was definitly intended to be used to send consumers large amount of porn....

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  3. SOP for the FCC by R2.0 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The FCC picks winners and losers all the time. Ask the folks who had private mobile radio licenses when the FCC decided that the frequencies could be better utilized - by Nextel. Most of those licenses were for local emergency services, and we all know how well Nextel worked for them when the time came.

    --
    "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
    1. Re:SOP for the FCC by commodore64_love · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yeah but the FCC should pick the winners and losers based on all available data, and then reach a rational conclusion. There's nothing rational about pre-judging who will be the winner, and then refusing to look at data that shows the winner has flaws. That's more like a religion than a proper-operating government. Faith and blind devotion to a cause, not reason.

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    2. Re:SOP for the FCC by Shakrai · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Faith and blind devotion to a cause, not reason.

      In other words, the Democratic and Republican parties?

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
  4. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by TinBromide · · Score: 4, Informative

    Broadband may mean high bandwidth in most marketing contexts, but it also means sending multiple signals over a single line. I doubt that they're sending those digits modulated into the 60hz AC current so they're multiplexing the line in a broadband fashion. Broadband may still apply if each house has its own meter frequency that is sent over a single trunk line coming from the transformer up to the local power station regardless of the bandwidth used.

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    Is it sad that I am more likely to recognize you and your posts by your sig than your name or UID?
  5. FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by commodore64_love · · Score: 3, Insightful

    *This* is why I don't want the government running businesses (mail, trains, hospitals, schools). The people in power use that power to censor information contrary to their personal beliefs, and they push agendas we are forced to adopt (like the "feel good" philosophy that is failing to teach our kids anything). It's a rigged system, a monopoly, not freedom or liberty.

    The FCC did exactly the same thing with the Whitespace/TV Band devices -

    - they ignored testimony and in-the-field research that demonstrated such devices interfere with television reception. They shoved through the okay on this, and in a few years, over-the-air reception of television (or FM radio) will be near-impossible. Instead people will just see/hear digital hash because the teenager next door is surfing on channel 8 with his Ipod. The FCC has essentially killed free-to-view TV/radio.

    I hate monopolies, whether it's a private monopoly like Comcast or a government one. A free market is preferable in almost-all cases. We need the FCC monopoly over the radio spectrum, but that doesn't mean we need to extend FCC-style corruption to other areas. We need fewer monopolies, not more.

    --
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    1. Re:FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by Gordonjcp · · Score: 4, Insightful

      *This* is why I don't want the government running businesses (mail, trains, hospitals, schools). The people in power use that power to censor information contrary to their personal beliefs, and they push agendas we are forced to adopt (like the "feel good" philosophy that is failing to teach our kids anything). It's a rigged system, a monopoly, not freedom or liberty.

      But that's the problem. The goverment *isn't* running the show, private industry is.

      Imagine what your country would be like if the RIAA were in charge of running the roads.

    2. Re:FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by ColdWetDog · · Score: 2, Funny

      Imagine what your country would be like if the RIAA were in charge of running the roads.

      I'm sure they would damn well shut down those "performances" of 120 dB thuds coming out of cars driven by dazed and deaf teenagers. I'd cut them a significant degree of slack for that alone.

      Now, quit driving your Rice Krispy or whatever on my lawn.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    3. Re:FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      While I agree that the FCC is riddled with rot, and I'm very much in favor of freedom as a goal, the notion that the free market is more honest seems dubious at best.

      The trouble is, private entities are generally quite responsive to customer requirements. This is their virtue, in most cases; but it can also be a huge vice. Institutional Review Boards, for instance, are supposed to verify that clinical trials are being conducted with adequate safeguards for the welfare of research subjects. The companies that hire them, though, are attempting to buy IRB approval, which is what they want, not ethical oversight, which is what they need. Shockingly enough, "customer service" quickly goes from basic efficiency to telling the customer exactly what they want to hear. Arbitration agents tend to work the same way. Any large company that habitually includes mandatory binding arbitration clauses in its contracts(this almost definitely means your bank, your credit card company, often your telco, quite frequently your car dealership, among others) will be a repeat buyer of arbitration services, probably hundreds or thousands of cases a year. You, on the other hand, might be buying a few instances a lifetime. Wholly unsurprisingly, arbiters overwhelmingly find in favor of their real customers, and ones that don't typically find themselves without work.

      Regulatory capture is a real, and very important, problem; but government corruption is only one of its forms and it crops up, more or less inescapably, anywhere you have a situation where somebody needs to be told something they don't want to hear in order to protect the rights and interests of others. More specifically, it usually crops up when one party has a small, but extremely concentrated, interest in something, and a much larger party has a larger; but highly diffuse countervailing interest in the same thing. It is a hard problem.

    4. Re:FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by commodore64_love · · Score: 2, Interesting

      >>>The goverment *isn't* running the show, private industry is.

      I cannot make any sense of your sentence, unless I conclude you have your head buried in the sand. Government runs the local mail business, they run the K-12 schools, and they run passenger rail, and in every case it's a monopoly with all the negative facets thereof (lack of choice, poor service, mistreatment of customers).

      Perhaps you were thinking of healthcare, which you are correct is still private, but that's still better than a government monopoly. Imagine if your healthcare was run like Amtrak or the DMV. What a nightmare that would be. At least with private care, you have literally thousands of different hospitals to choose from. If hospital A sucks, choose hospital B instead. It's not a monopoly.

      It's pro-choice.

      Final thought - The economic housing bubble, and its eventual collapse, was caused by Congress's mandate for zero-down mortgages, and the Federal Reserve's poor economic policies (specifically Greenspan's artificially low lending rates). Yet another failure we can chalk up to government. Yay. And now they are pursuing policies that will create yet another artificial bubble which will build-up during 2010 and 2011, and eventually collapse.

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    5. Re:FCC redacted data adverse to BPL by Big+Boss · · Score: 2, Informative

      With a decent signal, whitespace devices are supposed to avoid that channel. So in areas served with a local transmitter, that shouldn't be an issue. Those that will be negatively effected will be those in "fringe" areas. While that sucks, it is a small minority and they were likely receiving out of area transmissions. IMO, if the signal can't be received with "rabbit ears", it should be OK to use another device there. That might mean that some people have to get better antennas for TV. And some might lose some channels, but I doubt that "The FCC has essentially killed free-to-view TV/radio.".

      If you brought a whitespace device to my house, I seriously doubt the few mW of power would overwhelm my TV setup, even if it used the same channel. I'm ~15 miles from high power transmitters with a directional antenna.

      I'm OK with whitespace devices only if they can be shown to avoid frequencies with an existing user. I'd also want to see decent enforcement so that if someone's malfunctioned the FCC would make them take it off the air. That's the bit that I think makes this plan suspect, the FCC isn't very good at enforcement.

  6. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by TinBromide · · Score: 5, Funny

    PS, porn from the power company, that is both shocking and electrifying... I'm sure I'm going to catch some static from that, but I couldn't care watt happens to my current karma because of these charged puns.

    --
    Is it sad that I am more likely to recognize you and your posts by your sig than your name or UID?
  7. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by DerekLyons · · Score: 4, Informative

    You're years behind the times as that army is already virtually gone. They've long since been replaced by meters that can be read by simply driving down the street and interrogating them as they go by.

  8. Still working in at least one test city by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    It's still working in Manassas, Virginia. If you want full duplex 32 kbps for $24.95/month that is.

    The contractor, Comtec, that ran the program has pulled out and it is now managed directly through the city's utilities department.

  9. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by Joehonkie · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Broadband means sending multiple signals over different frequencies on one line, as opposed to baseband which is one signal on one frequency. It actually has no technical meaning that involves necessarily high bandwidth.

  10. the real issue is the frequencies in use by MrSaxonite · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The real problem with broadband over powerline is you need alot of bandwidth, at the low frequencys that are called the AM band, and the shortwave band; which would not be so bad, if the cables they used for this were like the one the cable tv company used, but the powerlines are not shielded cables, anything that goes over them leaks energy all over the place, basicly overloading all the cheap electronics with rf recievers in them, yet unlike the cable tv companies, the power companies don't think you want to steal their signals... although I've read of many stealing power when the lines go right over their house or barns, which have huge transformers hidden in em

    it's bugs us ham radio people the most, cause, the way to test if it was causing crazy ass static to overwhlem all the nice signals we used to get from foriegn countries, (which is how we make our free long distance phone calls, be it analog, or digital, wheather talking, typing, or sending pictures) was not to listen to the radio, no, instead it was the signal level at the closest powerlines and the fcc's version of how quick the signal is supposed to drop off.... hence this ugly argument, and the desire to hide the facts as to how it was decided.

    1. Re:the real issue is the frequencies in use by Shakrai · · Score: 2, Informative

      although I've read of many stealing power when the lines go right over their house or barns, which have huge transformers hidden in em

      That's an urban legend. The Mythbusters tried it and were able to steal a whooping eight millivolts.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    2. Re:the real issue is the frequencies in use by drinkypoo · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's an urban legend. The Mythbusters tried it and were able to steal a whooping eight millivolts.

      That's because they are IDIOTS who do not understand TIME CUBE. Only with a perfect understanding IMPOSSIBLE in in their SINGLE DAY SLAVE UNREALITY will this WORK.

      I wonder if the time cube guy comes from the same planet as Dr. Bronner.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  11. Good Riddance by brain1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It's about time this whole lamebrain flawed "technology" finally was put in the grave. There was a lot more than just Amateur Radio at stake. Military, Shipboard, and Aircraft use the 3-30 MHz band as well an I think they wouldn't have been as nice as the ARRL.

  12. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by omnichad · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sounds like my old 14.4 modem was broadband.

  13. And the people rejoyced by cyberbill79 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Yay. After seeing the reports on what it would do to the radio spectrum, I was worried some guy in his office somewhere would just stamp the 'OK' on it. Thank you ARRL and all involved. Maybe I should renew my membership now... meh.

  14. Re:powerline ethernet however, is doing well by Gordonjcp · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In contrast to BPL, powerline ethernet is doing quite well and has some nice products (I'd suggest it to anyone over wireless in a home any day - much faster and better range).

    Unfortunately it causes the same sort of interference as BPL. One of my neighbours has just recently had his powerline ethernet kit taken away because it was causing interference from broadcast AM at 500kHz or so right up to about 150MHz. Two doors down it was enough to completely disrupt the 2m amateur band, and a couple of hundred metres away it was enough to disrupt the VHF lowband railway signalling system...

  15. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by commodore64_love · · Score: 2, Informative

    Yes that's ultimately where the term originates for data communications. "Narrowband" referred to the 0-to-8000 hertz bandwidth of a telephone line, whereas "broadband" referred to a DSL line that has no upper limit (except the increasing noise as you go higher in frequency).

    Now broadband is little more than a marketing term which means "fast". It's gradually lost any technical definition. BPL aka Broadband over Phone Lines could just as easily be called "Fast Internet over phone lines". That's really all it means.

    --
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
  16. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by dkleinsc · · Score: 4, Funny

    I actually don't expect much resistance to the puns, but I'd think that sort of thing should be confined to your own ohm.

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    I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
  17. Re:Smart Meters, not Internet Service was Behind B by Captain+Sarcastic · · Score: 2, Funny

    You must have been a graduate of the University of Coulombia!

    (Re-volting, isn't it?)

    --
    Strike while the irony is hot! -- The Freethinker